Does DH'ing help with fatigue/injuries?

[Biggio509]

Originally Posted by Matt Arnold

Buster Posey also retired at age 34, Bench at 35 and never hit 140+ games after he was 30.

It's always the flaw with catchers - you really want them in the lineup and playing, but catching is such a toll.

That was a huge part of the reason Craig Biggio was moved to second base and probably gave him a lot more longevity and less need to hold him out of the lineup. Few catchers can play all middle positions though and go from C to 2B to CF and back to 2B.

[Dave Stieb II]

Your namesake was a helluva ball player.
I haven't given up on his son, either. He's had a run of tough luck the past couple years but I'm sure not ready to give up on him yet.
He'll never reach dad's level but I'm still convinced he can be a solid MLB contributor.

[Dave Stieb II]

Originally Posted by Rain King

He started 120 games at C and 40 games at DH. So, only 2 games not in the starting lineup. He pinch hit in 1 of those 2 games.

Sal Perez is an absolute freak.
Three years ago there was a consensus that he was breaking down due to his workload behind the plate throughout his career.
Now he's doing this.
Amazing. A true stud.
But why couldn't he man up for that 162nd game last year?

[kq76]

Originally Posted by jdw31158

In my Cubs save, Contreras was in the yellow but I wanted to keep his bat in the lineup, so I started him in left. The next day he was fully rested. I imagine it has a lot to do with durability as far as how and how long it takes to get rested.

Originally Posted by MathBandit

So DH causes extra fatigue but LF heals fatigue?

I wonder if fatigue is more complex than we might have thought. For example, I once thought that it was as simple as you if you play a game you take a certain hit to fatigue. But plenty of people have said that catchers take more of a hit than other positions (I can't remember the last time I ran with a stud catcher, I usually go with a tandem so I don't really notice this). And if this is the case with catchers, there's a good chance other position players take more of a hit than others (like a LF should fatigue less than a CF).

But what if, it's not simply playing a game and depending on the position, but if it's also dependent on the defensive plays the player is involved in. For example, I could see a corner outfielder having quite an easy game with maybe a couple of flyballs or softly hit balls at them and then the next game they have a couple plays where they have to make diving catches or run into the wall. It would make sense if the latter saw much more of a fatigue hit.

Similarly at bat, if you strikeout / popup / flyball 5/6 times, I don't think you should take much of a hit at all DHing. But, if you have a couple doubles, maybe steal a base or two, or have to score from first or second on a single, you probably should take some of a hit even when DHing.

[Primary]

this is anecdotal but I'm pretty sure 1B fatigues slower than other positions

[fredbeene]

In PT your DH can play 160 games

[TuckerDuckson]

Originally Posted by Dave Stieb II

Sal Perez is an absolute freak.
Three years ago there was a consensus that he was breaking down due to his workload behind the plate throughout his career.
Now he's doing this.
Amazing. A true stud.
But why couldn't he man up for that 162nd game last year?

Perez gave up on defense and sold out on his bat really, could be an adjustment to how catcher defense is reported, but mans has pretty much completely flipped his game in the past two years, from a passible bat (good in comparison to catchers though, mid 2010s offensive catchers were nearly non-existent in the AL, hence the SS, despite putting up a sub 100 OPS+ in his silver slugger seasons pre-2021), while playing gold glove defense to just being Gary Sanchez but a better hitter. Seems like his injury in 2019 completely ruined his defense, along with age, so he just worked on hitting, which is why he is probably DHing a lot more now. He still throws runners out, but less people are running on him due to the royals pitching staff, and his range has been suffering, but his bat has been getting better and better.

[md40022]

Perez..... Injured in 2019. Injured in 2020. Comes back in 2021, on the wrong side of 30 and a catcher, and puts up the biggest numbers of his career by a mile.

I base this on nothing, buttttttttttt I wonder if he saw Dr. McGwire for help rehabbing the injury and then saw Dr. Bonds for some suggestions on how to increase performance when you're supposed to be on the decline.

No substance behind that theory, other than the rehabbing injury and age & body wear of a full time catcher definitely sure seem to check the boxes.

[fredbeene]

Originally Posted by Primary

this is anecdotal but I'm pretty sure 1B fatigues slower than other positions

1b is absolutely slower fatigue and in real life.
Not as much diving or running into walls.

These are all easy to test and sim.
Set up your team or all teams with backs positions at Replace on Tired for R and L
You can get 156 out of 1b
C ~ 120

Not quite what IMPACT players ironman setting has.
I would hope setting to Ironman will play more, fatigue less.

[fredbeene]

Originally Posted by kq76

I wonder if fatigue is more complex than we might have thought. For example, I once thought that it was as simple as you if you play a game you take a certain hit to fatigue. But plenty of people have said that catchers take more of a hit than other positions (I can't remember the last time I ran with a stud catcher, I usually go with a tandem so I don't really notice this). And if this is the case with catchers, there's a good chance other position players take more of a hit than others (like a LF should fatigue less than a CF).

But what if, it's not simply playing a game and depending on the position, but if it's also dependent on the defensive plays the player is involved in. For example, I could see a corner outfielder having quite an easy game with maybe a couple of flyballs or softly hit balls at them and then the next game they have a couple plays where they have to make diving catches or run into the wall. It would make sense if the latter saw much more of a fatigue hit.

Similarly at bat, if you strikeout / popup / flyball 5/6 times, I don't think you should take much of a hit at all DHing. But, if you have a couple doubles, maybe steal a base or two, or have to score from first or second on a single, you probably should take some of a hit even when DHing.

In reality what you describe is true and would be cool if the game actually factored that in. Similar to pitches thrown.
That isn't happening.
I am not sure if it even takes into account Inninigs played rather than games. Would be nice to know as it creates more strategy options, pulling players when leads are big to save for the next game.

[Matt Arnold]

It does factor innings, games, PA, positions, etc... I mean, not to the "oh he had to leg out a bunch of close GB so let's tire him out more vs lazily striking out 4 times in the game" and stuff like that. But there are some general rules at play that will alter things a little based on scenarios.

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by fredbeene

1b is absolutely slower fatigue and in real life.
Not as much diving or running into walls.

These are all easy to test and sim.
Set up your team or all teams with backs positions at Replace on Tired for R and L
You can get 156 out of 1b
C ~ 120

Not quite what IMPACT players ironman setting has.
I would hope setting to Ironman will play more, fatigue less.

Ironman / Normal / Fragile / etc. refer to injury rates, not fatigue rates. I think the primary issue with fatigue is that it makes you more prone to getting hurt, so in that case you can mess with that a bit - say, set your Ironman shortstop to only be removed at 50% fatigue instead of the standard 85% - but if you set guys to be rested when tired and use the defaults, the Ironman level will get fatigued at exactly the same rate as a Normal, I'm almost positive. You might see an Ironman actually play more games but that's going to be because he'll get pulled from the lineup due to injury (including day-to-day ones, which can have a massive effect on player performance) less often.