Why were 6.12 and 6.5 so good?

[Afino]

I see many people around here still swear by 6.12 and 6.5.

Why was this version of the game so popular?? And why weren't future versions so universally acclaimed by us forum readers??

I just started playing the game this summer and started with OOTP8, so I'd just like to get an idea of why exactly this is.

[Raderick]

Originally Posted by Afino

I see many people around here still swear by 6.12 and 6.5.

Why was this version of the game so popular?? And why weren't future versions so universally acclaimed by us forum readers??

I just started playing the game this summer and started with OOTP8, so I'd just like to get an idea of why exactly this is.

The simplicity of 6.5 and the lack of bugs trumps all versions released after it. Also it's much much better for online leagues.

[RchW]

Originally Posted by Raderick

The simplicity of 6.5 and the lack of bugs trumps all versions released after it. Also it's much much better for online leagues.

Well you are entitled to your opinion. I took v6.5 off my computer after v2006 was released and have never missed it.

[RBLwebguy]

It is simplistic and easier to gauge your team, very easy to do what you need to do to run your team and when you want to be part of an online league and have fewer hours in the week, it is the perfect product.

[kq76]

Originally Posted by Afino

I see many people around here still swear by 6.12 and 6.5.

Why was this version of the game so popular?? And why weren't future versions so universally acclaimed by us forum readers??

I just started playing the game this summer and started with OOTP8, so I'd just like to get an idea of why exactly this is.

6.x really wasn't that good. I mean, it was pretty good, but some people make it out to be the best game ever and it just wasn't.

I think the reason why it was so revered was because OOTP2006 was in a lot of ways, a big jump back. The reason for this was the code was like spaghetti which made it very difficult for Markus to improve it so he decided to rewrite it from scratch, but when he did that he just couldn't fit everything into OOTP2006 in the time allotted so it ended up being pretty bare bones and pretty buggy. OOTP had also joined SI at the time and Markus wanted to make use of SI's programming knowledge and so when he wanted to do things like they did he had to learn how they did those things which took even more time. In the end, when you had the choice of playing with OOTP6.x or OOTP2006, I think for many of us the choice was pretty clear: a game that isn't new, but works well; or one that is, but doesn't.

After that it took awhile to rebuild trust in the product for some. It might have even been best to skip OOTP2006 and code right on through to OOTP2007. I skipped OOTP2007, but I picked up OOTP8, which was an update of it, and overall I thought 8 was pretty good and, at least for me, better than OOTP6.x. Not releasing OOTP2006 would have been a major loss of revenue, which, who knows, may have put an end to OOTP for good though. Either way, I believe it probably was necessary to go through those steps to get to where we are today. OOTP9 still is more complicated than OOTP6.x was, but in probably almost every other way it is superior. And I don't know about you, but I'd rather have a semi-complicated game that can do a lot than a less complicated game that can do less.

As for which is better for online leagues, OOTP9 by far IMO. I can zip through everything so fast now it's not funny and if I want more info it's likely there and right at my fingertips. There may be a few lingering things that OOTP10 needs to fix for online leagues that OOTP6.x did right and OOTP9 doesn't, but overall I think it is much better for commissioners and managers. Like solo players, it just takes time to get used to everything.

[AirmenSmith]

For me it has always been about the interface. When we went from 6.5 to 2006 it was a massive shift. 6.5 seemed to be more user friendly and very easy for new players to pick up and play. 2006 had so much different options that it seem overwhelming. But with that said I am now use to the interface and would not go back to 6.5. OOTP 9 seems the best OOTP out now IMO and I can't wait for 10.

[Afino]

Interesting.

Yeah - online leagues aren't a large percentage of my total OOTP experience, so maybe that's why I never understood why it seemed a lot of leagues just made the switch recently to OOTP9.

[Antonin]

I enjoyed 6.X but had problems with some of the fonts. I never played 6.5 because I think you had to purchase that update and after my negative experience with the 6.12 fonts I decided not to bother.

However, I still do play OOTP5 and think it is almost perfect. I like the simplicity. Sometimes I just want to play a simpler game, without Rule 5 drafts and waivers and all that stuff. When a free version of OOTP5 was made available I downloaded it and resumed playing an old league I had saved on CD.

I tried to move that league from OOTP5 to OOTP7, but it just did not work very well. So I started new leagues for OOTP7, 8 and now 9, and continued playing my old Summer League in OOTP5.

I love OOTP9 but will continue to play OOTP5.

[darkcloud4579]

It was good for the same reason so many of us loved FPS: Baseball. Because of how much better it was than anything else on the market. Not so much because it was infalliable or because we didn't have to create massive house rules to compensate for its flaws or any of that.

That said, I downloaded it again after looking at this thread, since it'd been so long since I'd played it and I realized almost immediately what the appeal was. Hard to play it after playing the modern versions, but at the same time..the simplicity and the ability to just "dive in and play" factor is huge. But that's mostly owing to the features it lacked compared to the modern versions. The GUI was hard to look at for long time, too. But that said, I do think it's a lot of fun to play in retrospect.

[ashantewarrier]

One word: Catobase.

[eriqjaffe]

Originally Posted by ashantewarrier

One word: Catobase.

Catobase was great, but it could also be a huge pain the ass. It was never the most stable app, even though Markus went out of his way to ensure compatibility.

[Jason]

IMO, OOTP 9 far surpasses 6.5. I think a lot of folks have happy feelings for the older versions...kind of like the folks who still play outdated games like FPS Football or Baseball Mogul...but what we have now is better in terms of online functionality.

[kingcharlesxii]

Originally Posted by eriqjaffe

Catobase was great, but it could also be a huge pain the ass. It was never the most stable app, even though Markus went out of his way to ensure compatibility.

Yeah, Catobase was great but I shudder when I think about how many hours I wasted because something small was messed up.

It's very common for people to remember things they enjoyed in the past as better than they actually were. 6.5 is this type of situation IMO. There were so many annoying little legacy bugs and if you wanted to run a more complicated league it was rather difficult.

[satchel]

It's not that the quality of the v6 games was that much better. I think a lot of the reason that people were so attached to it (and this is closely related to what KQ said) was that it was the de facto standard for so long: OOTP6 came out in 2004, and it wasn't wholly replaced until OOTP2006 came out in its named year; that game never really caught on, so the community didn't move forward until OOTP2007 came out. So by 2007, v6 was the game that most people had been playing for three years. OOTP6 was an excellent game (though not as good as those which followed), so everyone had become really attached to it. Even four years later, it was hard for many people to let it go.

So it's not that the quality of that game was so much better; it's just that the quality of its immediate replacement wasn't sufficiently better to significantly surpass it, and v6 eventually became entrenched, having been the community choice for so long.

[ctorg]

It was simpler. I'll give it that. I loved it at the time. And OOTP2006 was a bit of a mess. But OOTP9 is much, much better IMO.

[frankduffy]

Sometimes there are too many options added to a game's future generation. 6.5 had a nice addition in the player strategy area, which V5 didn't have. The stats were enough. Etc,...

I find V9 to be a little overhwelming sometimes.

[t-bone shuffle]

Reading this made me go back and take a quick spin through 6.5.

I think that playing out games is still more fun in 6.5 than even in the newest version. Plain and simple, more fun.

Otherwise 6.5 can't keep up with OOTP 9.

[pstrickert]

Say more, t-bone. What exactly makes it more fun?

IMO, the earlier OOTP is less "sterile" in appearance than the later OOTP. It was easier to produce a new skin for the earlier OOTP, too. The later OOTP has a lot to offer, of course. But I think the in-game presentation could make "smarter" use of real estate -- I'm thinking of the sensible format of the MLB.com Gamecast.

[t-bone shuffle]

Originally Posted by pstrickert

Say more, t-bone. What exactly makes it more fun?

IMO, the earlier OOTP is less "sterile" in appearance than the later OOTP. It was easier to produce a new skin for the earlier OOTP, too. The later OOTP has a lot to offer, of course. But I think the in-game presentation could make "smarter" use of real estate -- I'm thinking of the sensible format of the MLB.com Gamecast.

I suppose it's hard to put into words what exactly equates to "fun" so I'll just ramble off a few things that come to mind (keep in mind that I played only 4 or 5 games w/6.5 for the first time in a least a couple of years).

The pbp/game engine just feels more "solid/realistic"........the ease of lineup changes (coupled with the fact that you're asked to confirm before going back to the game, thus eliminating all the inadvertent changes I make in 9).......the game screen is not so cluttered (I only use the webcast screen in 9, can't imagine how you'd manage a game using the broadcast screen and I'm not switching screens during a game) and the info on the 6.5 screen makes for much quicker immersion IMO...........the opportunity to make base running decisions (something I didn't know I missed until I got the chance to do it again - this should definitely come back to the game).....the opposing AI manager does a much better job of utilizing his roster (pitching changes, pinch hitters and pinch runners are all utilized better in 6.5)..................

That's all that come to mind right now, but I will say one more thing and I'm not trying to start anything at all. But going back and spending some time with 6.5 left me with the impression that the newer version is significantly less concerned with/aimed at the solo player, which is fine. I have no doubt that there are significantly larger numbers using 9 for online leagues and historical replays than there are playing solo, and I think the new versions are a reflection of this.

[Dargone]

OOTP9 is so much better, in my opinion.