2023-2024 NBA Season Thread

[Cobra Mgr]

So much matters in how you word things. And it is amazing how good politicians make a deal sound when they are spending other people's $. OKC announced a deal w/the Thunder to build a $900M arena.

Hard pause.

That is minimum $900M. Of course, we all know the price tag will go higher. But the Thunder have committed to $50M solid. Now they word it as if the city got something here. This is the 1st time they got a team to help pay. Yay. Oh yeah, you guys built the original arena, sans franchise. Your 1st owner bought you guys a NBA team by, frankly, lying to Seattle about trying to negotiate a new deal for an arena.

Let's also keep in mind $50M is all they are giving. For a 25 year stay. $2M a year. For a billion dollar home designed to make them a profit. 2022, OKC was said to have made $274M in revenue. So based on a VERY conservative projection of $200M a year, they are committing essentially 1% of their inc9me to rent. Rent on a place designed to give them income.

It astounds me the people who get miffed @ a poor person getting a free aspirin or education are ready to give five bucks to a guy that farts 20 dollar bills.

[rudel.dietrich]

Originally Posted by dsvitak

These players aren't racing up and down the court. Any NBA player can tell stories of playing 10 hours a day, for months at a time, when they were coming up.

I am not sure what you mean here

[Amazin69]

All I know is that I never even heard the phrase "load management" before we traded our entire future* to entice Kawhi to stop by occasionally, So I think it is player-driven, at least in one case.

(*-yes, Leonard was a FA. But he doesn't come without George, who cost us SGA, Gallinari, and more #1s than I'll see in my remaining lifetime, perhaps.)

[Antonin]

The big news today: my Cleveland Cavaliers have signed...Tristan Thompson!!!! Why, I do not know. He was a useful player years and years ago, but why in the world they want him now is beyond me.

[rudel.dietrich]

The NBA seems to be making some moves towards decreasing load management.

I think between the 65 games needed to win awards, fines and behind the door pressure from the league office we can see how this work this upcoming season.

Maybe that will be enough. If that is not enough, we could see penalties increase to taking away draft picks.

[thehef]

Originally Posted by rudel.dietrich

The NBA seems to be making some moves towards decreasing load management.

I think between the 65 games needed to win awards, fines and behind the door pressure from the league office we can see how this work this upcoming season.

Maybe that will be enough. If that is not enough, we could see penalties increase to taking away draft picks.

The 65 game rule will probably have some effect, but beyond that it seems the league is merely prodding teams to adjust when they rest their players - so the rest doesn't occur on national TV games - as opposed to how often they rest them.

[rudel.dietrich]

Originally Posted by thehef

The 65 game rule will probably have some effect, but beyond that it seems the league is merely prodding teams to adjust when they rest their players - so the rest doesn't occur on national TV games - as opposed to how often they rest them.

We will see how this season goes. Maybe I am optimistic in that we will see overall games played increase 5-10%

Others are more cynical and feel like we could see team start to use the injury tag more often.

[thehef]

Originally Posted by rudel.dietrich

We will see how this season goes. Maybe I am optimistic in that we will see overall games played increase 5-10%

Others are more cynical and feel like we could see team start to use the injury tag more often.

Yep. It's probably going to be a combination of a slight uptick in games played, some additional & creative use of the injury tag, plus more times that guys are on a "minutes restriction" - both the announced kind and the unannounced - "Hmm. Kawhi only played 16 minutes two nights ago 15 tonight..." - kind...

[pilight]

Originally Posted by rudel.dietrich

We will see how this season goes. Maybe I am optimistic in that we will see overall games played increase 5-10%

I assume you mean games by "stars". The overall number of games shouldn't change. After all, somebody is playing in the games when Leonard sits.

[Amazin69]

One would hope. But if an entire Taylor Swift lifetime of being a Clipper fan has taught me anything, it's that you can never be too certain…

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by Cobra Mgr

I'll never get the bail system. I saw a story earlier this week of a young man wrongly accused of trying to sell a stolen Xbox & he spent 2 months in jail before they dropped the charges.

And this millionaire gets to post bail of just $75,000 for this kind of violent act?

I'm all for eliminating bail altogether. In a situation like this, if you think Porter is a flight risk or he'll retaliate against the victim, you take that under consideration as to whether you let him out at all (plus there are other things you can do besides cash bail, such as ankle monitoring). In the case of the guy above, the flight risk is the issue, not some precedent that says that in cases like that you assign him $10K bail or whatever.

In some cases it probably means people who were otherwise going to pay their way out stay in but honestly it probably means more people released while our turrible-slow legal system does its thing.

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by rudel.dietrich

We will see how this season goes. Maybe I am optimistic in that we will see overall games played increase 5-10%

Others are more cynical and feel like we could see team start to use the injury tag more often.

I agree with the earlier statement TBH that most of the time this load management stuff is coming from on high. Owners and the front office have an investment in these players and they don't want them to break down. I think most players, given their druthers, would happily play 40 minutes a night every night. I'm not even sure that Kawhi Leonard represents an exception to that; he's being load-managed heavily because he tore his ACL - which in years past meant that your NBA career was over - and recently he got the biscuit meniscus.

The really bad stuff to me was OKC "load managing" SGA the year before last and just shutting him down for no reason other than to give them a better chance in the lottery. *That* is specifically the thing the league needs to defend against, not the Clips trying to get Kawhi to play 10 games a year instead of 0.

[rudel.dietrich]

Originally Posted by Syd Thrift

The really bad stuff to me was OKC "load managing" SGA the year before last and just shutting him down for no reason other than to give them a better chance in the lottery. *That* is specifically the thing the league needs to defend against, not the Clips trying to get Kawhi to play 10 games a year instead of 0.

I think the new lottery odds and the play-in tournament have reduced blatant tanking a little bit.

Even this past season, with a once in a lifetime talent at #1 overall, we only saw a small handful of teams go into the season with no playoff aspirations at all.

[rudel.dietrich]

Originally Posted by Cobra Mgr

Kevin Porter Jr arrested for strangling girlfriend.

Not to dredge up a horrible story, but Houston have released KPJ as of last Friday, and served notice to the NBAPA that it intends to claw back every bit of his guaranteed money that they can.

[monkeyman576]

I am all for load management. Players should not be expected to sacrifice their career longevity for ticket sales.

[dsvitak]

Originally Posted by rudel.dietrich

I am not sure what you mean here

Players needing extensive rest between games, and only playing in 60 games a year.

Growing up (coming up is a common urban expression), these players played from sunrise to sunset. The only break they got was when their team lost, and they called "next", and waited their turn for the next game to start.

I played hours and hours per day, days and days on end. I played so much that my fingertips used to bleed. Lazy players making 50 million dollars a year just ... baffle me.

[monkeyman576]

Originally Posted by dsvitak

Players needing extensive rest between games, and only playing in 60 games a year.

Growing up (coming up is a common urban expression), these players played from sunrise to sunset. The only break they got was when their team lost, and they called "next", and waited their turn for the next game to start.

I played hours and hours per day, days and days on end. I played so much that my fingertips used to bleed. Lazy players making 50 million dollars a year just ... baffle me.

That's just it though, millions of millions dollars a year is an investment, and neither fans nor owners should want to see that investment not play in the playoffs because of burnout.

[pilight]

Originally Posted by dsvitak

Growing up (coming up is a common urban expression), these players played from sunrise to sunset. The only break they got was when their team lost, and they called "next", and waited their turn for the next game to start.

I played hours and hours per day, days and days on end. I played so much that my fingertips used to bleed. Lazy players making 50 million dollars a year just ... baffle me.

And you walked uphill in the snow to get to the court and again to get back home, right?

[rudel.dietrich]

Originally Posted by dsvitak

Players needing extensive rest between games, and only playing in 60 games a year.

Growing up (coming up is a common urban expression), these players played from sunrise to sunset. The only break they got was when their team lost, and they called "next", and waited their turn for the next game to start.

I played hours and hours per day, days and days on end. I played so much that my fingertips used to bleed. Lazy players making 50 million dollars a year just ... baffle me.

These players play much harder than you ever did.
They also have played thousands of games growing up. At a much higher level than you ever did.

They train every offseason harder than you ever did.
They practice in between games and get work in between games.

Once again you use your YMCA career to compare yourself to a professional basketball player.
Once again you embarrass yourself.

Just stop

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by dsvitak

Players needing extensive rest between games, and only playing in 60 games a year.

Growing up (coming up is a common urban expression), these players played from sunrise to sunset. The only break they got was when their team lost, and they called "next", and waited their turn for the next game to start.

I played hours and hours per day, days and days on end. I played so much that my fingertips used to bleed. Lazy players making 50 million dollars a year just ... baffle me.

These players play a looooooot of basketball still and at a far higher level than you ever did.

I do have to say here, too, you know what else I remember about old-timey pro basketball, like before the 2000s especially but before load management became a thing? Guys coming up, looking amazing for a couple years, and then blowing out their knees and boom that was it for their career. Occasionally you had a guy like Bernard King who was able to come back from a major injury and still be a good player but, like, remember Jeff Ruland? No? Dude was a 20/10 center right before the Ewing/Hakeem era whose career immediately came to an end at the beginning of the 1985 season. The Pacers had a pretty good center, forget his name right now, from that time period, who also got hurt and left immediately. They also had a guy named I think Jeff Hubbard(?) who came in and left.

It felt to me even at the time that the sea change with Anfernee Hardaway and Grant Hill weren't that they also got hurt but that they actually came back and had careers - neither of them of course at the Hall of Fame levels they were putting up beforehand but still decent players, at least. That was better than nothing. I also remember that the guys playing a million minutes back then weren't really the super-duper stars like MJ or Barkley (who "load managed" thanks to various injuries throughout the second half of his career) but players like Anthony Mason and Latrell Sprewell, who were generally scrappy guys who were if anything just too ornery to come off the court (I mean, Spree is way more famous for choking his coach than for being one of the last guys to play 3200 minutes in a season).

As noted earlier, the vast majority of these situations come down from the front office, not the players. If you give the players their druthers, a lot of them would play all 48 minutes and never come out, not because they're dumb or anything but because they love to play the game that much. They accept rotations because everyone uses them now, but I'm sure a Trae Young would faaaar rather play 40 a night and average 30 points than the 34-35 a night and 26 he gets now. If nothing else, per-game stats are still the easiest thing to point to when contract time comes around.