Ok, I’m confused…

Ty Cobb · 08-07-2023, 10:22 AM

Looking through the AH this morning, I was struck by the relatively high ratings/costs for the live St. Louis missions. Let’s face it, they’re a last place team. Does their management suck that badly that there’s tons of talent and no results, or are they just overvalued?

I’m not trying to knock the franchise, ok? I’m just puzzled at the dissonance between W/L and player ratings. Someone set me straight here, alright. WTH am I missing?

kq76 · 08-07-2023, 10:48 AM

I think they started off that way and as we've been going through the season their values have gone down a bit, but probably not enough.

For example, it took forever for Nolan Arenado to not be a perfect card and even now he's still a 95. His defense notwithstanding, he's not even close to being the best 3B in the game. Many preseason predictions didn't even have Arenado cracking the top 5. Jose Ramirez is the best 3B (this year and since 2020) and he's only rated an 88.

Yeah, the Cardinals have underperformed expectations, but maybe OOTP probably relies too heavily on fangraphs (they had Arenado ranked 1st), or whoever they rely on, for their preseason evaluations.

Ty Cobb · 08-07-2023, 10:54 AM

Thanks.

LeeD · 08-08-2023, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kq76

I think they started off that way and as we've been going through the season their values have gone down a bit, but probably not enough.

For example, it took forever for Nolan Arenado to not be a perfect card and even now he's still a 95. His defense notwithstanding, he's not even close to being the best 3B in the game. Many preseason predictions didn't even have Arenado cracking the top 5. Jose Ramirez is the best 3B (this year and since 2020) and he's only rated an 88.

Yeah, the Cardinals have underperformed expectations, but maybe OOTP probably relies too heavily on fangraphs (they had Arenado ranked 1st), or whoever they rely on, for their preseason evaluations.

Yep. When the experts were predicting that a team would be good, there's always that tendency to figure that they're better than they've played and that they'll turn things around. The Cards have played better lately and their record in one-run games has been terrible (an indicator that things are better than they've seemed), but it's getting awful late for them to make a run, even in a weak division.

bailey · 08-08-2023, 04:55 PM

The truth is a bit more gamey why St. Louis is the toughest live mission to complete today. There are only 34 Card cards and you need 31.

If you've completed St. Louis in the past, how many Cardinals do you have left? I must have locked 31, but I only have 24 (!) left.

LeeD · 08-09-2023, 02:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bailey

The truth is a bit more gamey why St. Louis is the toughest live mission to complete today. There are only 34 Card cards and you need 31.

If you've completed St. Louis in the past, how many Cardinals do you have left? I must have locked 31, but I only have 24 (!) left.

That's true. A lot of Cardinals have become ex-Cardinals.

Capngary · 08-14-2023, 08:15 PM

Sometimes players don't play up to their ratings
Some teams over achieve, some choke. (69 Mets - 69 Cubs)
Had there been a midseason card set in 1969, the Cubs (with the entire infield going to the All Star game) would have looked A LOT better than the Mets. It just doesn't always work like it does on paper.

I have not really followed the Cards this year (except as a standings watcher). Their W/L is bad, but I wonder if they aren't just finding ways to lose (or not win).

LeeD · 08-16-2023, 04:28 PM

The Cardinals are 10-23 in one-run games. Only the Padres (6-19) are worse, and they're another massive underachiever so far.

rburgh · 08-18-2023, 12:39 AM

Have no pitching. Bailey is right, the cards are expensive because there is little wiggle room, you have to get all but 3 guys. After the next update it will be lots easier.

08-07-2023, 10:22 AM	#1
Ty Cobb Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Grayling, MI Posts: 4,586	Ok, I’m confused… Looking through the AH this morning, I was struck by the relatively high ratings/costs for the live St. Louis missions. Let’s face it, they’re a last place team. Does their management suck that badly that there’s tons of talent and no results, or are they just overvalued? I’m not trying to knock the franchise, ok? I’m just puzzled at the dissonance between W/L and player ratings. Someone set me straight here, alright. WTH am I missing? __________________ "You could not live with your own failure. Where did that bring you? Back to me." Thanos

08-07-2023, 10:48 AM	#2
kq76 Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 11,782	I think they started off that way and as we've been going through the season their values have gone down a bit, but probably not enough. For example, it took forever for Nolan Arenado to not be a perfect card and even now he's still a 95. His defense notwithstanding, he's not even close to being the best 3B in the game. Many preseason predictions didn't even have Arenado cracking the top 5. Jose Ramirez is the best 3B (this year and since 2020) and he's only rated an 88. Yeah, the Cardinals have underperformed expectations, but maybe OOTP probably relies too heavily on fangraphs (they had Arenado ranked 1st), or whoever they rely on, for their preseason evaluations. __________________ My OOTP Wishlist \| My FAQ List OOTP Wiki \| Your Recommended Team Nicknames, By City (A Crowdsourced Project) Last edited by kq76; 08-07-2023 at 10:53 AM. Reason: added Jose Ramirez 2020-2023 stats link

08-07-2023, 10:54 AM	#3
Ty Cobb Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Grayling, MI Posts: 4,586	Thanks. __________________ "You could not live with your own failure. Where did that bring you? Back to me." Thanos

08-14-2023, 08:15 PM	#7
Capngary Bat Boy Join Date: Apr 2023 Location: Chattanooga, TN Posts: 14	And ... Sometimes players don't play up to their ratings Some teams over achieve, some choke. (69 Mets - 69 Cubs) Had there been a midseason card set in 1969, the Cubs (with the entire infield going to the All Star game) would have looked A LOT better than the Mets. It just doesn't always work like it does on paper. I have not really followed the Cards this year (except as a standings watcher). Their W/L is bad, but I wonder if they aren't just finding ways to lose (or not win).

08-18-2023, 12:39 AM	#9
rburgh All Star Reserve Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 988	Cards Have no pitching. Bailey is right, the cards are expensive because there is little wiggle room, you have to get all but 3 guys. After the next update it will be lots easier.

08-08-2023, 04:55 PM	#5
bailey Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 3,366	The truth is a bit more gamey why St. Louis is the toughest live mission to complete today. There are only 34 Card cards and you need 31. If you've completed St. Louis in the past, how many Cardinals do you have left? I must have locked 31, but I only have 24 (!) left.

08-16-2023, 04:28 PM	#8
LeeD All Star Reserve Join Date: Jan 2022 Posts: 800	The Cardinals are 10-23 in one-run games. Only the Padres (6-19) are worse, and they're another massive underachiever so far.