Thanks for the memories, but I'm done

mrowland · 06-30-2022, 07:20 PM

I have bought this game every year going back to 2015, with the last 5 years being on Steam. This version, OOTP 23, has been awash from the beginning with bugs, glitches, inconsistencies, etc. It feels like it is a game that was an afterthought in development that was forgot about and then just rushed to the finish line.

Today was the final straw. The same, persistent bug that has plagued expansion drafts since I started playing (where the draft order is missing a team), it popped up again, and it happened to be right after the season where I was playing Challenge mode and somehow guided my Royals (in 2023) to the playoffs.

No big deal, right? Just create a draft order CSV file to correct the issue, that's what we've ALWAYS done since day one (why they can't just FIX THE DAMN BUG I WILL NEVER KNOW). I loaded the draft CSV file into the import folder, told the game to find it....CRASH. Game just crashed. Loaded it back up. The save was now corrupt. W.T.F. I loaded a backup save. It was from the offeason of 2022.

I'm done. I just can't do this game anymore. Just can't. I have 264.5 hours into the '23 version and they have been excruciating for the most part. This game is just NOT FUN and feels like a chore to play. I'm not wasting any more time with it. The only good feature that was added this year was the ability to request multiplayer trade packages and prospect trade packages (after years of asking for this), but it's not enough.

I'm sure you won't miss one player. But I can't take it any longer Devs. There are too many quality games that I can play that are fun and don't feel like they were created as an afterthought.

I reserve the right to alter my opinion if the game is dramatically improved in future versions, but I won't even consider it until the '25 version (and even then, probably not at all).

Thanks for the memories.

bosunmate · 06-30-2022, 08:05 PM

You'll be back OOTP gets in your blood, but seriously sorry for your problems it sucks when you lose your league...

silvam14 · 06-30-2022, 09:17 PM

This is a bummer, man

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

jimmysthebestcop · 07-01-2022, 12:13 AM

I can hear the white knights assembling.

tejdog1 · 07-01-2022, 02:48 AM

I still mourn the first league I had and lost in v12.
Never taken a Mets dynasty further than that one. Still miss it

KJDelaney · 07-01-2022, 08:54 AM

For this version, I gave up too.

I have been playing since around OOTP 4 or 5, I think.

Customer Support was very good. I was refunded. But I am done. I have found a suitable replacement for what i want.

For those of you who are still enjoying the game, mazel tov. I hope it is as superb as you want it to be. For me, there were just too many issues and crashes.

Simmo13 · 07-01-2022, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimmysthebestcop

I can hear the white knights assembling.

No you can't.

mitchkenn · 07-01-2022, 09:54 AM

OOTP 23 has some changes that need getting used to - just like every version when it first comes out. One i noticed was in self created players batting numbers - slight change, hardly game breaking. So far, i'm liking 23 as much as past versions. Each year there are upgrades, changes and the game evolves, not always to my desired designs, but always (for me anyway) well worth continuing. I had the game when it was "season 2" or something like that - on a floppy disc. Lost that disc decades ago and when found OOTP 14, i've been enjoying each season since. Just me and my half-penny worth of observation.

Pelican · 07-01-2022, 09:55 AM

This is one of those YMMV moments. My experience - thus far - with 23 has been fine. I like it better in some respects. But that’s just me. I don’t mean to question or minimize others’ negative experiences and frustration. I don’t know why my expansion draft (for the 2022 Season, adding Buffalo and Charlotte) went smoothly. Forgive me, at one point I wrongly thought that some people on here were complainers, could never be satisfied, etc. Now I realize that’s unfair and wrong. for some reason, parts of the game break down for some people in some instances, even while others of us sail on through somehow (not, I assure you, due to greater expertise, at least in my case). Developers may say they cannot duplicate these crashes and bugs. But these honest complaints from dedicated players are not made up. I don’t understand how that can happen (and not happen); but it needs to be addressed. Call me a “white knight” but I want the game to work for everybody; not just for me.

TroubleBoy · 07-01-2022, 10:41 AM

Tell me about it.

Notwithstanding the con of having to buy this game every year for my on-line leagues, I started a standard historical game in 23 this past week and today got a message telling me the database couldn't be loaded because the game was created in 22.

Doh! No, it wasn't Homer. Three seasons down the tubes...

OOTP 23 has had more updates and patches than I can remember in other versions. You're absolutely right - it was an afterthought.

PSUColonel · 07-01-2022, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pelican

This is one of those YMMV moments. My experience - thus far - with 23 has been fine. I like it better in some respects. But that’s just me. I don’t mean to question or minimize others’ negative experiences and frustration. I don’t know why my expansion draft (for the 2022 Season, adding Buffalo and Charlotte) went smoothly. Forgive me, at one point I wrongly thought that some people on here were complainers, could never be satisfied, etc. Now I realize that’s unfair and wrong. for some reason, parts of the game break down for some people in some instances, even while others of us sail on through somehow (not, I assure you, due to greater expertise, at least in my case). Developers may say they cannot duplicate these crashes and bugs. But these honest complaints from dedicated players are not made up. I don’t understand how that can happen (and not happen); but it needs to be addressed. Call me a “white knight” but I want the game to work for everybody; not just for me.

What you just said is the antithesis of a “Whit Knight”.. I myself have never even heard this term until very recently here, but I don’t think what you are saying here qualifies at all 😉

pauwoo · 07-01-2022, 12:19 PM

Boy oh boy... losing a save that you've invested so much time & care into is rough. Happened to me in the OOTP20 to 21 conversion of my favorite offline save. I think I made it almost 6 months without playing OOTP in any serious fashion - sure, we had our dalliances, our one-offs. Eventually, I was able to retrieve the save from one of my forked files (in addition to backups, I copy entire saves to an external HDD and have now started creating QS files as backups too). Of course, that retrieval meant losing 4-years of in game time.

In the end, it was a small price to pay, because I still get so much enjoyment from the save.

Sorry you had this experience. I understand why you'd want to step away from the game for awhile.

pauwoo · 07-01-2022, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

What you just said is the antithesis of a “White Knight”.. I myself have never even heard this term until very recently here, but I don’t think what you are saying here qualifies at all 😉

It's defined as, "a person or thing that comes to someone's aid". Obviously, here and elsewhere on the internet the colloquialism has been reappropriated to imply something negative... like, here come the White Knights to save OOTP from valid criticism. It's so silly. It's as silly as calling someone a snowflake. Or a Karen. Etc.

Emotional intelligence is dead. Lol.

silvam14 · 07-01-2022, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TroubleBoy

Tell me about it.

Notwithstanding the con of having to buy this game every year for my on-line leagues, I started a standard historical game in 23 this past week and today got a message telling me the database couldn't be loaded because the game was created in 22.

Doh! No, it wasn't Homer. Three seasons down the tubes...

OOTP 23 has had more updates and patches than I can remember in other versions. You're absolutely right - it was an afterthought.

I've started standard historical games for every year from 1901 to 2021 to test my historical uniforms. I have never seen that error. sounds to me like you may have tried to open a 22 save in 23 by accident

silvam14 · 07-01-2022, 12:55 PM

.

md40022 · 07-01-2022, 12:59 PM

To the original poster..... I get it. And I feel you.

Investing time into something only to lose it completely is tough. I struggled with investing 20 minutes into a game only to have it crash. I still had the save to fall back on though. I can't even imagine losing the entire save. I absolutely get the frustration.

The tough thing here is it really seems like the developers at OOTP genuinely care about attempting to fix problems. That makes it tough for me because there have been times in the past when I was dealing with bugs and crashes where I wanted to smash the computer and be done with it - but I truly think the OOTP team puts honest effort into fixing issues and I truly hate being a raging maniac when I know the people in question are giving me good, honest effort. And I do believe that is the case.

I did have some crash issues with 23 which I was able to find a work around for and those crashes have supposedly been fixed in a recent patch (so far, so good). But when I was dealing with problems in the past, I was right there with you in wanting to just say "F it".

I'm not a big gamer at all. My brother is though. And he says this type of stuff, with glitches and crashes right after release and then 100000 patches along the way is a lot of times just the way things go. I personally find that people tolerate it as much as they do to be really surprising. Like I've said on here plenty in the past, it wouldn't be tolerated in any other industry....... Could it be improved, or is it just nature of the beast when it comes to programming and developing a software? Truthfully, I don't know enough about it to have an answer for it. All I know is everyone's time is valuable and when it comes to investing your time into something only to have it crash or lose it completely, and for it to be a reoccurring issue that doesn't get resolved...... Man, I'm sorry but I just can't believe that's "normal" in the computer gaming world. Again, what makes it tough is I do think the OOTP team are good people who are trying hard. It would be a lot easier for me to rant and rave to people who I felt were being lazy or neglectful. I don't feel that's the case here. Regardless though, I feel your pain.

DJ_Jak_32 · 07-01-2022, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimmysthebestcop

I can hear the white knights assembling.

See you're still grinding the axe.

When can we expect your live stream?

Syd Thrift · 07-01-2022, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

What you just said is the antithesis of a “Whit Knight”.. I myself have never even heard this term until very recently here, but I don’t think what you are saying here qualifies at all 😉

Yeah, tbh I see a lot of people lodging legitimate complaints and critiques of the game. This looked like the same and even the original post, while bombastic, is understandable. That said, "white knight" is one of those coded words that's used by certain people to signal to others which "side" they're on while not actually saying much. TBH I don't want to know this information about other people who post here; I'd prefer to be left in the dark about peoples' non-OOTP opinions.

fredbeene · 07-01-2022, 06:12 PM

say you are an average joe with a job, a small social life......you really only have time to devote to 3 or 4 games....
i personally love the idea of this game....but it is not quite where i want it to be......
legacy HTML non sortable filterable reports
way behind baseball ref in terms of stats
can't do historical expansion without simming the previous year
enhanced pbp
no sortable team stats (until this year)
and other odds and ends...

frustrated i discovered other other games to broaden my gaming experience.

i imagine this is just a part time dev job as new features, to me, are excruciatingly slow.....to be fair, some other non sport games i have tried also seem to lack new dev.
i wonder if there are more issue now with new ownership??

i check in regularly cuz it IS in my blood....and hope there will be a post on new features.........one day one day...
i look forward to the day my 'near perfect' OOTPB game is made....

MikeS369 · 07-02-2022, 12:59 AM

No need to announce your departure. This is not an airport.

06-30-2022, 07:20 PM	#1
mrowland Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Jul 2014 Posts: 27	Thanks for the memories, but I'm done I have bought this game every year going back to 2015, with the last 5 years being on Steam. This version, OOTP 23, has been awash from the beginning with bugs, glitches, inconsistencies, etc. It feels like it is a game that was an afterthought in development that was forgot about and then just rushed to the finish line. Today was the final straw. The same, persistent bug that has plagued expansion drafts since I started playing (where the draft order is missing a team), it popped up again, and it happened to be right after the season where I was playing Challenge mode and somehow guided my Royals (in 2023) to the playoffs. No big deal, right? Just create a draft order CSV file to correct the issue, that's what we've ALWAYS done since day one (why they can't just FIX THE DAMN BUG I WILL NEVER KNOW). I loaded the draft CSV file into the import folder, told the game to find it....CRASH. Game just crashed. Loaded it back up. The save was now corrupt. W.T.F. I loaded a backup save. It was from the offeason of 2022. I'm done. I just can't do this game anymore. Just can't. I have 264.5 hours into the '23 version and they have been excruciating for the most part. This game is just NOT FUN and feels like a chore to play. I'm not wasting any more time with it. The only good feature that was added this year was the ability to request multiplayer trade packages and prospect trade packages (after years of asking for this), but it's not enough. I'm sure you won't miss one player. But I can't take it any longer Devs. There are too many quality games that I can play that are fun and don't feel like they were created as an afterthought. I reserve the right to alter my opinion if the game is dramatically improved in future versions, but I won't even consider it until the '25 version (and even then, probably not at all). Thanks for the memories.

06-30-2022, 09:17 PM	#3
silvam14 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Dedham, MA Posts: 10,015	This is a bummer, man Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk __________________ Senior "Nancy Boy" of the OOTP Boards _______________________________________________

07-01-2022, 02:48 AM	#5
tejdog1 All Star Starter Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Danbury, CT Posts: 1,650	I still mourn the first league I had and lost in v12. Never taken a Mets dynasty further than that one. Still miss it __________________ It's amazing How you make your face just like a wall How you take your heart and turn it off How I turn my head and lose it all And it's unnerving How just one move puts me by myself There you go just trusting someone else Now I know I put us both through hell ~Matchbox 20, "Leave" Everyone knows it's spelled "TRAID", not trade

07-01-2022, 09:54 AM	#8
mitchkenn Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: Oregon, not by design Posts: 2,872	OOTP 23 has some changes that need getting used to - just like every version when it first comes out. One i noticed was in self created players batting numbers - slight change, hardly game breaking. So far, i'm liking 23 as much as past versions. Each year there are upgrades, changes and the game evolves, not always to my desired designs, but always (for me anyway) well worth continuing. I had the game when it was "season 2" or something like that - on a floppy disc. Lost that disc decades ago and when found OOTP 14, i've been enjoying each season since. Just me and my half-penny worth of observation. __________________ "This is my opening farewell " - Jackson Browne “They make a desolation and call it peace.” ― Agha Shahid Ali "Maybe she just has to sing, for the sake of the song - And who do I think that I am to decide that she's wrong." - Townes Van Zandt "I saw a young man leaning on his wooden crutch - He called out to me, 'Don't ask for so much' And a young woman leaning in her darkened door She cried out to me, 'Why not ask for more?' " - Leonard Cohen "Hello darkness, my old Friend ...." - Paul Simon Before Mays, before DiMaggio, there was Oscar Charleston. "All the lies about Babe Ruth are true." - Waite Hoyt Avatar is the late great Townes Van Zandt. rip.

07-01-2022, 12:19 PM	#12
pauwoo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2014 Location: Seattle Posts: 2,266	Boy oh boy... losing a save that you've invested so much time & care into is rough. Happened to me in the OOTP20 to 21 conversion of my favorite offline save. I think I made it almost 6 months without playing OOTP in any serious fashion - sure, we had our dalliances, our one-offs. Eventually, I was able to retrieve the save from one of my forked files (in addition to backups, I copy entire saves to an external HDD and have now started creating QS files as backups too). Of course, that retrieval meant losing 4-years of in game time. In the end, it was a small price to pay, because I still get so much enjoyment from the save. Sorry you had this experience. I understand why you'd want to step away from the game for awhile. __________________ Be excellent to each other. the Portland Pioneers \| the Los Angeles Leopards Last edited by pauwoo; 07-01-2022 at 02:00 PM.

06-30-2022, 08:05 PM	#2
bosunmate All Star Starter Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 1,724	You'll be back OOTP gets in your blood, but seriously sorry for your problems it sucks when you lose your league...

07-01-2022, 12:13 AM	#4
jimmysthebestcop Banned Join Date: Jun 2018 Posts: 1,727 Infractions: 0/2 (5)	I can hear the white knights assembling.

07-01-2022, 08:54 AM	#6
KJDelaney All Star Reserve Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 579	For this version, I gave up too. I have been playing since around OOTP 4 or 5, I think. Customer Support was very good. I was refunded. But I am done. I have found a suitable replacement for what i want. For those of you who are still enjoying the game, mazel tov. I hope it is as superb as you want it to be. For me, there were just too many issues and crashes.

07-01-2022, 09:55 AM	#9
Pelican Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2021 Location: Wilmington, Delaware Posts: 3,057	This is one of those YMMV moments. My experience - thus far - with 23 has been fine. I like it better in some respects. But that’s just me. I don’t mean to question or minimize others’ negative experiences and frustration. I don’t know why my expansion draft (for the 2022 Season, adding Buffalo and Charlotte) went smoothly. Forgive me, at one point I wrongly thought that some people on here were complainers, could never be satisfied, etc. Now I realize that’s unfair and wrong. for some reason, parts of the game break down for some people in some instances, even while others of us sail on through somehow (not, I assure you, due to greater expertise, at least in my case). Developers may say they cannot duplicate these crashes and bugs. But these honest complaints from dedicated players are not made up. I don’t understand how that can happen (and not happen); but it needs to be addressed. Call me a “white knight” but I want the game to work for everybody; not just for me.

07-01-2022, 10:41 AM	#10
TroubleBoy Bat Boy Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Macclesfield, Cheshire Posts: 16	Tell me about it. Notwithstanding the con of having to buy this game every year for my on-line leagues, I started a standard historical game in 23 this past week and today got a message telling me the database couldn't be loaded because the game was created in 22. Doh! No, it wasn't Homer. Three seasons down the tubes... OOTP 23 has had more updates and patches than I can remember in other versions. You're absolutely right - it was an afterthought.

07-01-2022, 12:55 PM	#15
silvam14 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Dedham, MA Posts: 10,015	. __________________ Senior "Nancy Boy" of the OOTP Boards _______________________________________________ Last edited by silvam14; 07-01-2022 at 01:10 PM.

07-01-2022, 12:59 PM	#16
md40022 All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2018 Posts: 740 Infractions: 0/1 (1)	To the original poster..... I get it. And I feel you. Investing time into something only to lose it completely is tough. I struggled with investing 20 minutes into a game only to have it crash. I still had the save to fall back on though. I can't even imagine losing the entire save. I absolutely get the frustration. The tough thing here is it really seems like the developers at OOTP genuinely care about attempting to fix problems. That makes it tough for me because there have been times in the past when I was dealing with bugs and crashes where I wanted to smash the computer and be done with it - but I truly think the OOTP team puts honest effort into fixing issues and I truly hate being a raging maniac when I know the people in question are giving me good, honest effort. And I do believe that is the case. I did have some crash issues with 23 which I was able to find a work around for and those crashes have supposedly been fixed in a recent patch (so far, so good). But when I was dealing with problems in the past, I was right there with you in wanting to just say "F it". I'm not a big gamer at all. My brother is though. And he says this type of stuff, with glitches and crashes right after release and then 100000 patches along the way is a lot of times just the way things go. I personally find that people tolerate it as much as they do to be really surprising. Like I've said on here plenty in the past, it wouldn't be tolerated in any other industry....... Could it be improved, or is it just nature of the beast when it comes to programming and developing a software? Truthfully, I don't know enough about it to have an answer for it. All I know is everyone's time is valuable and when it comes to investing your time into something only to have it crash or lose it completely, and for it to be a reoccurring issue that doesn't get resolved...... Man, I'm sorry but I just can't believe that's "normal" in the computer gaming world. Again, what makes it tough is I do think the OOTP team are good people who are trying hard. It would be a lot easier for me to rant and rave to people who I felt were being lazy or neglectful. I don't feel that's the case here. Regardless though, I feel your pain.

07-01-2022, 06:12 PM	#19
fredbeene All Star Starter Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 1,637	say you are an average joe with a job, a small social life......you really only have time to devote to 3 or 4 games.... i personally love the idea of this game....but it is not quite where i want it to be...... legacy HTML non sortable filterable reports way behind baseball ref in terms of stats can't do historical expansion without simming the previous year enhanced pbp no sortable team stats (until this year) and other odds and ends... frustrated i discovered other other games to broaden my gaming experience. i imagine this is just a part time dev job as new features, to me, are excruciatingly slow.....to be fair, some other non sport games i have tried also seem to lack new dev. i wonder if there are more issue now with new ownership?? i check in regularly cuz it IS in my blood....and hope there will be a post on new features.........one day one day... i look forward to the day my 'near perfect' OOTPB game is made....

07-02-2022, 12:59 AM	#20
MikeS369 All Star Reserve Join Date: Dec 2020 Location: USA Posts: 653	No need to announce your departure. This is not an airport.