Confused about playoff benching

Roy Tucker · 02-13-2016, 10:23 PM

Rather than say this shouldn't happen (it shouldn't), there ought to be a trigger that causes a storyline to occur that explains the benching.

Long story short, Chris Johnston, a 5-time all-star in his prime, a man who hit 336, and also hit 362 the final month of the season (and was playing every day that month) is no longer in the starting lineup in the playoffs. He comes off the bench from time to time as a pinch hitter. Doesn't make sense unless he slept with the manager's wife and if he did there should be an email about it!!

The game has put Richardson in left, Black in center and Romero in right.

Here are the players in question:

bwburke94 · 02-13-2016, 11:23 PM

Who was controlling the team? What are your player evaluation settings?

Roy Tucker · 02-14-2016, 04:44 AM

The Manager is controlling the team and I use the default player evaluation settings. Also it's the same manager that has always played him for the past ten years. As I said, more than the benching, my main issue is it not being communicated to me in some way. Whatever the logic (faulty as it may be) of the AI is, should be sent to be in a news story or email so I can see reasoning behind the AI's decision

Roy Tucker · 02-14-2016, 05:52 AM

I have started the next season and the manager still is refusing to put him in the starting lineup even though his ratings have held up. Now for the decision: go in commissioner mode? fire the manager? (even though he has been great for me) or trade the guy who took his starting spot even though he is the practical joker on the team which helps team morale. Not sure what to do, but am leaning towards commissioner mode as I don't see how a manager can bench a 21 million dollar player who is coming off a 330 batting avg. Hell even the White Sox gave Adam Dunn four years lol

kq76 · 02-14-2016, 06:15 AM

Even the positions they're at are a bit weird. Romero should be in CF.

Black has to be in there somewhere, Johnston seems pretty clearly the 2nd best of the 4, and with the other 2 a toss-up, Romero is the best CF, which leaves Richardson out.

Is no one forced to start at a certain position?

I wonder if Johnston had a cold streak and others had hot streaks. Richardson is even angry about his own performance.

Who's your DH?

Maybe the game just really dislikes Johnston's low power and eye.

Roy Tucker · 02-14-2016, 07:09 AM

Thanks for responding. Yeah, I just don't get it. The whole thing seems a bit off. However, I think the manager's ratings help explain the story.
To answer your questions:

I can't force start because the manager is legendary and has full control of the lineups. Also Johnston hit 362 the final month of the season going into the playoffs, playing every day. Since I am on a new season, I don't have Richardson's splits, but considering he hit 209 for the year, I assume his last month could not have been hotter than Johnston's. I just don't understand what could have triggered this, especially now that it has continued into the following year. I took a look at Johnston's ratings history, but the ratings have held steady.

I don't have a DH. Pitchers bat in my league.

Here are the manager's ratings:

Perhaps as you said, it is the eye rating since the managers favors high OBP, but he has had a poor eye the entire season and Richardson was on the team the entire season. Also the manager favors veterans that have speed which is Johnston, but I suppose Richardson fits the bill as well which would make OBP the tie breaker even though Johnston is clearly the better player and has played under this very same manager for the past decade.

There should be an email or a news story communicating why this decision was made instead of me piecing it together like this. And then to really help with the immersion the story should indicate that this was a controversial move considering the contributions Johnston had made to the team.

Still not sure what I am going to do. I think I will take commissioners mode off the table since this doesn't look like a playoff bug, but in fact a change of heart by the manager that has carried into the next year. So it looks like I have to either fire the manager or trade Richardson.

Honorable_Pawn · 02-14-2016, 10:42 AM

nm

Westheim · 02-14-2016, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kq76

Maybe the game just really dislikes Johnston's low power and eye.

So do I, but Richardson makes me weep more.

There's something fishy going on since the last update (just posted about that today). I for one have a team in my league that hits a top 10 home run hitter consistently in the #7 or #8 spot for no reason. There are things that don't make any sense.

ThatSeventiesGuy · 02-14-2016, 11:20 AM

I once had the AI leave a guy who led the league in HRs and was a three-time MVP not just out of the lineup, but off the playoff roster completely...two years in a row! Good thing I checked both times before the playoffs started.

Padreman · 02-14-2016, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roy Tucker

Thanks for responding. Yeah, I just don't get it. The whole thing seems a bit off. However, I think the manager's ratings help explain the story.
To answer your questions:

I can't force start because the manager is legendary and has full control of the lineups. Also Johnston hit 362 the final month of the season going into the playoffs, playing every day. Since I am on a new season, I don't have Richardson's splits, but considering he hit 209 for the year, I assume his last month could not have been hotter than Johnston's. I just don't understand what could have triggered this, especially now that it has continued into the following year. I took a look at Johnston's ratings history, but the ratings have held steady.

I don't have a DH. Pitchers bat in my league.

Here are the manager's ratings:

Perhaps as you said, it is the eye rating since the managers favors high OBP, but he has had a poor eye the entire season and Richardson was on the team the entire season. Also the manager favors veterans that have speed which is Johnston, but I suppose Richardson fits the bill as well which would make OBP the tie breaker even though Johnston is clearly the better player and has played under this very same manager for the past decade.

There should be an email or a news story communicating why this decision was made instead of me piecing it together like this. And then to really help with the immersion the story should indicate that this was a controversial move considering the contributions Johnston had made to the team.

Still not sure what I am going to do. I think I will take commissioners mode off the table since this doesn't look like a playoff bug, but in fact a change of heart by the manager that has carried into the next year. So it looks like I have to either fire the manager or trade Richardson.

Well there's your problem you have a Caucasian Dominican at the Helm you can't trust those guys. I only trust Hispanic Domincans

bwburke94 · 02-14-2016, 06:40 PM

A better solution would be trading (or even DFAing) Richardson. He's the guy blocking your star.

Roy Tucker · 02-15-2016, 12:05 AM

I took the advice and traded Richardson so what happens? My Dominican Caucasian (not that there is anything wrong with that) manager puts in a different bench player ahead of Johnson!

Here is the guy who is now replacing Johnston

Then I had an epiphany. I should have looked at the depth chart first. Now I can see my manager's opinion of players. I have revoked the trade of Richardson in commissioner mode so I can make a more fully informed decision.

Clearly he doesn't think highly of Johnston. To get Johnston to play, I would have to trade Black. He doesn't have him listed as a backup anywhere else. It is also confusing why Black isn't listed as a RF, even as a backup since that is his most highly rated position. I can't trade Black so that leaves the 21,000,000 4-time all star or the manager who I have won multiple championships with. And again I don't mind having to make the decision, teams have to choose between superstars and managers all the time. I just wish more information was pushed to me instead of having to pull it. Also, there is no guarantee my new manager would start Johnston, grrrr

Westheim · 02-15-2016, 02:47 AM

The best thing now would be to release or trade ALL outfielders in the entire organization, except for Black, Johnston, and a scum of your choice. That might solve the problem.

(third-string catcher pops up playing centerfield)

Oh, well, I tried.

bwburke94 · 02-15-2016, 02:51 AM

You should do a little test - what happens if Black and Johnston are the only outfielders on the roster?

kq76 · 02-15-2016, 04:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bwburke94

You should do a little test - what happens if Black and Johnston are the only outfielders on the roster?

Yeah, create a copy of the league and test this. We might at least learn something.

Roy Tucker · 02-15-2016, 05:37 AM

Followed your advice, and look at that, Johnston is in the starting lineup (he hit a hr) Black moves to right and they move my back up 1b to left. More interestingly, look what happens as I add each player back to the team. I didn't know how to have the manager update the depth chart the day of so I played a game after each transaction to see the new depth chart.

So after I added back each person , the AI now keeps Johnston in the starting lineup, as it should. Also, interestingly, Richardson loses his starting job and is replaced by Romero. I made no other changes other than playing a game each day. Seems like I somehow triggered a bug the first time around? Or at the very least an odd decision because just 5 games later, the depth chart is as it should be. Thanks for the help and ideas everyone!

02-13-2016, 10:23 PM	#1
Roy Tucker Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 255	Confused about playoff benching Rather than say this shouldn't happen (it shouldn't), there ought to be a trigger that causes a storyline to occur that explains the benching. Long story short, Chris Johnston, a 5-time all-star in his prime, a man who hit 336, and also hit 362 the final month of the season (and was playing every day that month) is no longer in the starting lineup in the playoffs. He comes off the bench from time to time as a pinch hitter. Doesn't make sense unless he slept with the manager's wife and if he did there should be an email about it!! The game has put Richardson in left, Black in center and Romero in right. Here are the players in question: Last edited by Roy Tucker; 02-13-2016 at 10:25 PM.

02-14-2016, 05:52 AM	#4
Roy Tucker Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 255	I have started the next season and the manager still is refusing to put him in the starting lineup even though his ratings have held up. Now for the decision: go in commissioner mode? fire the manager? (even though he has been great for me) or trade the guy who took his starting spot even though he is the practical joker on the team which helps team morale. Not sure what to do, but am leaning towards commissioner mode as I don't see how a manager can bench a 21 million dollar player who is coming off a 330 batting avg. Hell even the White Sox gave Adam Dunn four years lol Last edited by Roy Tucker; 02-14-2016 at 05:57 AM.

02-14-2016, 06:15 AM	#5
kq76 Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 11,755	Even the positions they're at are a bit weird. Romero should be in CF. Black has to be in there somewhere, Johnston seems pretty clearly the 2nd best of the 4, and with the other 2 a toss-up, Romero is the best CF, which leaves Richardson out. Is no one forced to start at a certain position? I wonder if Johnston had a cold streak and others had hot streaks. Richardson is even angry about his own performance. Who's your DH? Maybe the game just really dislikes Johnston's low power and eye. __________________ My OOTP Wishlist \| My FAQ List OOTP Wiki \| Your Recommended Team Nicknames, By City (A Crowdsourced Project)

02-14-2016, 07:09 AM	#6
Roy Tucker Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 255	Thanks for responding. Yeah, I just don't get it. The whole thing seems a bit off. However, I think the manager's ratings help explain the story. To answer your questions: I can't force start because the manager is legendary and has full control of the lineups. Also Johnston hit 362 the final month of the season going into the playoffs, playing every day. Since I am on a new season, I don't have Richardson's splits, but considering he hit 209 for the year, I assume his last month could not have been hotter than Johnston's. I just don't understand what could have triggered this, especially now that it has continued into the following year. I took a look at Johnston's ratings history, but the ratings have held steady. I don't have a DH. Pitchers bat in my league. Here are the manager's ratings: Perhaps as you said, it is the eye rating since the managers favors high OBP, but he has had a poor eye the entire season and Richardson was on the team the entire season. Also the manager favors veterans that have speed which is Johnston, but I suppose Richardson fits the bill as well which would make OBP the tie breaker even though Johnston is clearly the better player and has played under this very same manager for the past decade. There should be an email or a news story communicating why this decision was made instead of me piecing it together like this. And then to really help with the immersion the story should indicate that this was a controversial move considering the contributions Johnston had made to the team. Still not sure what I am going to do. I think I will take commissioners mode off the table since this doesn't look like a playoff bug, but in fact a change of heart by the manager that has carried into the next year. So it looks like I have to either fire the manager or trade Richardson. Last edited by Roy Tucker; 02-14-2016 at 07:11 AM.

02-14-2016, 11:20 AM	#9
ThatSeventiesGuy Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Midland, MI Posts: 3,426	I once had the AI leave a guy who led the league in HRs and was a three-time MVP not just out of the lineup, but off the playoff roster completely...two years in a row! Good thing I checked both times before the playoffs started. __________________ https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/...00&postcount=1

02-13-2016, 11:23 PM	#2
bwburke94 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Belchertown, MA, USA Posts: 4,504	Who was controlling the team? What are your player evaluation settings?

02-14-2016, 04:44 AM	#3
Roy Tucker Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 255	The Manager is controlling the team and I use the default player evaluation settings. Also it's the same manager that has always played him for the past ten years. As I said, more than the benching, my main issue is it not being communicated to me in some way. Whatever the logic (faulty as it may be) of the AI is, should be sent to be in a news story or email so I can see reasoning behind the AI's decision

02-14-2016, 10:42 AM	#7
Honorable_Pawn Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Tampa Bay Posts: 6,407	nm __________________ PBA Quickstart for OOTP Background Images Collection All PBA games broadcast live on Steam. Last edited by Honorable_Pawn; 02-14-2016 at 11:10 AM.

02-14-2016, 06:40 PM	#11
bwburke94 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Belchertown, MA, USA Posts: 4,504	A better solution would be trading (or even DFAing) Richardson. He's the guy blocking your star.

02-15-2016, 12:05 AM	#12
Roy Tucker Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 255	I took the advice and traded Richardson so what happens? My Dominican Caucasian (not that there is anything wrong with that) manager puts in a different bench player ahead of Johnson! Here is the guy who is now replacing Johnston Then I had an epiphany. I should have looked at the depth chart first. Now I can see my manager's opinion of players. I have revoked the trade of Richardson in commissioner mode so I can make a more fully informed decision. Clearly he doesn't think highly of Johnston. To get Johnston to play, I would have to trade Black. He doesn't have him listed as a backup anywhere else. It is also confusing why Black isn't listed as a RF, even as a backup since that is his most highly rated position. I can't trade Black so that leaves the 21,000,000 4-time all star or the manager who I have won multiple championships with. And again I don't mind having to make the decision, teams have to choose between superstars and managers all the time. I just wish more information was pushed to me instead of having to pull it. Also, there is no guarantee my new manager would start Johnston, grrrr Last edited by Roy Tucker; 02-15-2016 at 12:22 AM.

02-15-2016, 02:47 AM	#13
Westheim Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Germany Posts: 13,723	The best thing now would be to release or trade ALL outfielders in the entire organization, except for Black, Johnston, and a scum of your choice. That might solve the problem. (third-string catcher pops up playing centerfield) Oh, well, I tried. __________________ Portland Raccoons, 92 years of excell-.... of baseball: Furballs here! 1983 * 1989 * 1991 * 1992 * 1993 * 1995 * 1996 * 2010 * 2017 * 2018 * 2019 * 2026 * 2028 * 2035 * 2037 * 2044 * 2045 * 2046 * 2047 * 2048 * 2051 * 2054 * 2055 * 2061 1 OSANAI : 2 POWELL : 7 NOMURA \| RAMOS : 8 REECE : 10 BROWN : 15 HALL : 27 FERNANDEZ : 28 CASAS : 31 CARMONA : 32 WEST : 39 TONER : 46 SAITO Resident Mets Cynic - The Mets from 1962 onwards, here.

02-15-2016, 02:51 AM	#14
bwburke94 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Belchertown, MA, USA Posts: 4,504	You should do a little test - what happens if Black and Johnston are the only outfielders on the roster?

02-15-2016, 05:37 AM	#16
Roy Tucker Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 255	Followed your advice, and look at that, Johnston is in the starting lineup (he hit a hr) Black moves to right and they move my back up 1b to left. More interestingly, look what happens as I add each player back to the team. I didn't know how to have the manager update the depth chart the day of so I played a game after each transaction to see the new depth chart. So after I added back each person , the AI now keeps Johnston in the starting lineup, as it should. Also, interestingly, Richardson loses his starting job and is replaced by Romero. I made no other changes other than playing a game each day. Seems like I somehow triggered a bug the first time around? Or at the very least an odd decision because just 5 games later, the depth chart is as it should be. Thanks for the help and ideas everyone! Last edited by Roy Tucker; 02-15-2016 at 05:39 AM.