what are the top 10 baseball countries?

dave1927p · 09-19-2009, 08:34 PM

kq76 · 09-19-2009, 09:08 PM

I take you're asking about real life or OOTP?

In real life I don't know the answer to that, but you could check out the results from the last few world tournaments like the Olympics and Baseball World Classic or whatever it's called.

Renner · 09-19-2009, 09:19 PM

According to the International Baseball Federation -

http://www.ibaf.org/fileadmin/user_u...ngs_12_Aug.pdf

1. Cuba
2. Korea
3. Japan
4. USA
5. Chinese Taipei
6. Netherlands
7. Mexico
8. Canada
9. Venezuela
10. Puerto Rico

Déjà Bru · 09-19-2009, 10:38 PM

Sorry, but I reject any such list that ranks Netherlands (#6) above Dominican Republic (#13). It's based on results from recent international tournaments only. To have the Dominican Republic not even in the top ten is ridiculous.

I respectfully submit the historical tallies of foreign major leaguer players by country at Baseball Reference as a better barometer of baseball quality over time. Total all-time major leaguers from the Dominican, 493. Total from Holland, 8.

Sure, I am opening myself up to ethnocentrism by holding up MLB membership as the ultimate standard of baseball excellence, especially these days. Renner is going to come back and tell me off by asserting such a list as irrelevant, considering how much of MLB history involved exclusivity based on race. Politics also enter in to screw things up; the embargo of Cuba, for example.

Nevertheless, but with a nod of compromise to Renner, I present my top 12 baseball countries based on the numbers of foreign players being good enough to play in MLB in 2007, the latest data that I have:

UNITED STATES (almost all the rest)
CUBA (6, but moved up to #2 in consideration of historic political barriers and recently demonstrated quality of play)
DOMINICAN REPUBLIC (98)
VENEZUELA (51)
PUERTO RICO (28)
CANADA (19)
JAPAN (13)
MEXICO (13)
PANAMA (7)
KOREA (3)
TAIWAN (2)
COLOMBIA (2)

These are the top 12 baseball countries in the world, IN ORDER! What do you think of that, and the way I selected them? Do you like how I adjust my own standards to move Cuba up, for the very same reason that their teams have been successful in recent international tournament play?

[Yes, I'm trying to stir up controversy.

]

dsvitak · 09-19-2009, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Déjà Bru

UNITED STATES (almost all the rest)
CUBA (6, but moved up to #2 in consideration of historic political barriers and recently demonstrated quality of play)
DOMINICAN REPUBLIC (98)
VENEZUELA (51)
PUERTO RICO (28)
CANADA (19)
JAPAN (13)
MEXICO (13)
PANAMA (7)
KOREA (3)
TAIWAN (2)
COLOMBIA (2)

In Japan, it takes NINE years as a pro to then be released for play in the US. If you start at age 20, then you are 29 or so when you start. This, coupled with SEVERE language problems, limits the number of Japanese players. I would probably rate them a little higher on your list.

Renner · 09-19-2009, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Déjà Bru

Sorry, but I reject any such list that ranks Netherlands (#6) above Dominican Republic (#13).

[Yes, I'm trying to stir up controversy.

]

I agree with you 100%. Just wanted to spark some discussion.

But, I will have to disagree with you in that you make me sound like I work for the International Baseball Federation !

kq76 · 09-19-2009, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Déjà Bru

Sorry, but I reject any such list that ranks Netherlands (#6) above Dominican Republic (#13). It's based on results from recent international tournaments only. To have the Dominican Republic not even in the top ten is ridiculous.

I somewhat agree with you on that because you can easily have a bad or good stretch, but as for the rest I can't say I agree much. To me, beating all the rest of the competition 2 times in a row in the premier tournament in the world deserves a great deal of respect and until someone else beats them soundly Japan is #1 in the world. After that, it's a a toss-up for me with Korea, the USA, Venezuela, Cuba and the DR all being there with maybe one or two others then the rest are another tier below.

Just because you have a lot of players in the majors doesn't mean a whole heck of a lot to me due to different barriers to entry. Sure, depth should count for something, but if we're going to rank countries I'd rather do it based on who gets the job done best when it really counts.

Bluenoser · 09-20-2009, 05:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Déjà Bru

Sorry, but I reject any such list that ranks Netherlands (#6) above Dominican Republic (#13). It's based on results from recent international tournaments only. To have the Dominican Republic not even in the top ten is ridiculous.

I respectfully submit the historical tallies of foreign major leaguer players by country at Baseball Reference as a better barometer of baseball quality over time. Total all-time major leaguers from the Dominican, 493. Total from Holland, 8.

Sure, I am opening myself up to ethnocentrism by holding up MLB membership as the ultimate standard of baseball excellence, especially these days. Renner is going to come back and tell me off by asserting such a list as irrelevant, considering how much of MLB history involved exclusivity based on race. Politics also enter in to screw things up; the embargo of Cuba, for example.

Nevertheless, but with a nod of compromise to Renner, I present my top 12 baseball countries based on the numbers of foreign players being good enough to play in MLB in 2007, the latest data that I have:

UNITED STATES (almost all the rest)
CUBA (6, but moved up to #2 in consideration of historic political barriers and recently demonstrated quality of play)
DOMINICAN REPUBLIC (98)
VENEZUELA (51)
PUERTO RICO (28)
CANADA (19)
JAPAN (13)
MEXICO (13)
PANAMA (7)
KOREA (3)
TAIWAN (2)
COLOMBIA (2)

These are the top 12 baseball countries in the world, IN ORDER! What do you think of that, and the way I selected them? Do you like how I adjust my own standards to move Cuba up, for the very same reason that their teams have been successful in recent international tournament play?

[Yes, I'm trying to stir up controversy.

]

The only problem I have with this list is it's based solely on population other than #2. Just because there are more Puerto Ricans than Japanese in MLB does not necessarily make them a better baseball country.

To the OP of this thread, please define the criteria for "Top Baseball Country". Does it mean the country that provides the best talent, the most talent, or is it something else?

Déjà Bru · 09-20-2009, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Renner

I agree with you 100%. Just wanted to spark some discussion.

But, I will have to disagree with you in that you make me sound like I work for the International Baseball Federation !

This board needs a boost, and we're getting the job done, eh!

Vinny P. · 09-20-2009, 10:37 PM

I would rank Chinese Taipei (formerly Taiwan

*shrugs.*) as pretty high.

I am from Williamsport PA, home of Little League, and the LLWS puts my hometown in the world spotlight for two weeks (formerly one week) out of the year.

And Taiwan, year after year after year comes in like a storm. Besides the US, they have the most world chamionships. (And yes, there was quite a bit of controversy back in the 90s and early 2000s before they left the LL organization for a couple of years, due to their so-called "super leagues," and age discrepency) but this year, they did legitimately perform extremely well, and perhaps will place them back on the map for LL.

Baseball in Taiwan is coming back, and if LL is any indication, has a bright future there. I would perhaps place them ahead of Panama and Korea, and settle them right in behind Mexico.

09-19-2009, 09:19 PM	#3
Renner Major Leagues Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Connecticut Posts: 416	According to the International Baseball Federation - http://www.ibaf.org/fileadmin/user_u...ngs_12_Aug.pdf 1. Cuba 2. Korea 3. Japan 4. USA 5. Chinese Taipei 6. Netherlands 7. Mexico 8. Canada 9. Venezuela 10. Puerto Rico __________________ I drink only distilled water, or rain water, and only pure-grain alcohol.

09-19-2009, 08:34 PM	#1
dave1927p FHM Moderator Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Brantford, ON Posts: 2,908	what are the top 10 baseball countries? what are the top 10 baseball countries? __________________ IN 1964 THE LEAFS WON THE STANLEY CUP :: IT'S ALSO THE YEAR THE CANADIAN FLAG WAS DESIGNED...coincidence?

09-19-2009, 09:08 PM	#2
kq76 Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 11,994	I take you're asking about real life or OOTP? In real life I don't know the answer to that, but you could check out the results from the last few world tournaments like the Olympics and Baseball World Classic or whatever it's called. __________________ My OOTP Wishlist \| My FAQ List OOTP Wiki \| Your Recommended Team Nicknames, By City (A Crowdsourced Project) For Beta/Devs: Full screen (1920x1080)

09-20-2009, 10:37 PM	#10
Vinny P. Banned Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 1,518 Infractions: 0/1 (4)	I would rank Chinese Taipei (formerly Taiwan shrugs.) as pretty high. I am from Williamsport PA, home of Little League, and the LLWS puts my hometown in the world spotlight for two weeks (formerly one week) out of the year. And Taiwan, year after year after year comes in like a storm. Besides the US, they have the most world chamionships. (And yes, there was quite a bit of controversy back in the 90s and early 2000s before they left the LL organization for a couple of years, due to their so-called "super leagues," and age discrepency) but this year, they did legitimately perform extremely well, and perhaps will place them back on the map for LL. Baseball in Taiwan is coming back, and if LL is any indication, has a bright future there. I would perhaps place them ahead of Panama and Korea, and settle them right in behind Mexico.