Proposed Fictional League Dev/Aging Modifiers

[kq76]

Originally Posted by RonCo

I got interested. Here's the OPS data for my baseline league...all default settings. Major offense inflation.

[scary graph that wouldn't quote]

! I wish Markus would listen to you more.

Originally Posted by RonCo

The Development Modifier influences how fast or slow a player reaches his peak. The Aging Modifier influences how fast or slow a player drops off. It can be fairly complex to think about on a skill-by-skill basis, and unfortunately we get only a macro "pitcher" or "hitter" toggle that influences all ratings for the player type.

I selected to develop players more slowly because I was seeing both pitchers and hitters peak far too soon (ages 23-25 rather than 27-29), as experienced in game, and "proven" via my Tango comparison.

I selected to age players more quickly because I was seening them hold on too long, and because the Tango study showed they needed it to model major league careers better. Yes, some of the issue with Ks falling too soon are aggravated because I increased aging. But if you look at the charts in my report, you'll see this is due to the fundamental curve OOTP is using. It drops off too fast after age 37, meaning you can either set it so that you mid-range is too high, but old pitchers hold on properly, or you can set it so that the aging curve is "right" until age 37, but falls off after that. Given that there are more pitchers in the mid-range ages, I chose to make that part right at the expense of the older pitchers.

Ultimately, given the game's approach to development, each setting is a trade-off of some sort.

Just quoting this one as I think it might be the most important post in the thread. Well, it's probably a toss up between this one and the 1st one I quoted.

I wonder, RonCo, if you could give us an update on what you would personally use now for OOTP9.1.6.

You first said for, I guess, the initial release:

Batter Aging: 2.00
Batter Dev: .5
Pitcher Aging: 1.75
Pitcher Dev: .5

but according to goldenglove you at some time switched them to:

Batter Aging: 1.750
Batter Development: .500
Pitcher Aging: 1.500
Pitcher Development: .500

Then there were a couple people in this thread who liked:

Batter Aging: 1.750
Batter Development: .750
Pitcher Aging: 1.500
Pitcher Development: .750

[RonCo]

Duplicating my post elsewhere:

I think I've finally settled on

Batting Aging: 1.75
Batting Development: .6
Pitching Aging: 1.75
Pitching Development: .7

(Along with Sky Dog's other modifiers)

I've actually had better success with Pitcher Aging at 2.5 (though I admit I don't know if it makes much difference past 2.0), but then you need to start getting into changing League Totals and even stronger AI reliance on ratings in order to stop long-career pitchers finishing with a string of k/9 rates of 2.0-3.0.

This is probably the last time I'm going do this kind of a study. It's just too hard to figure out how to make the thing work right with this development engine, and I quite honestly have lost my passion for it at this point.

[SittingDuck]

There does come that time.

Well, thanks for all the hard work.

[conception]

At some point, everyone has to just accept the best that is possible and move on to actually enjoying the game. Once you get really into a fantasy league, it is fun even if some aspects of it end up a little off.

[RonCo]

Originally Posted by conception

At some point, everyone has to just accept the best that is possible and move on to actually enjoying the game. Once you get really into a fantasy league, it is fun even if some aspects of it end up a little off.

True, but it doesn't have to be this hard.

[darkcloud4579]

Originally Posted by RonCo

Duplicating my post elsewhere:

I think I've finally settled on

Batting Aging: 1.75
Batting Development: .6
Pitching Aging: 1.75
Pitching Development: .7

(Along with Sky Dog's other modifiers)

I've actually had better success with Pitcher Aging at 2.5 (though I admit I don't know if it makes much difference past 2.0), but then you need to start getting into changing League Totals and even stronger AI reliance on ratings in order to stop long-career pitchers finishing with a string of k/9 rates of 2.0-3.0.

This is probably the last time I'm going do this kind of a study. It's just too hard to figure out how to make the thing work right with this development engine, and I quite honestly have lost my passion for it at this point.

Appreciate the study, nonetheless. It was a yeoman's effort and one that immersinik's everywhere truly appreciate.

Even if we deviate from them a bit.

[neojonas]

Yes thank you very much for your hard work RonCo. So many of us appreciate it.

[thomamon]

Are these settings still the same with patch 9.2.2?

[Curtis]

It doesn't look as though RonCo will be back to answer that. He's decided that Markus is ignoring his work, so his efforts would be better spent on some other project. He wrote that he doesn't PLAN to be posting here anymore.

A great loss to the community.

[Isura]

Yes, I'm reading his paper atm. Really great work.. Makes the game very enjoyable.

[thomamon]

Originally Posted by Curtis

It doesn't look as though RonCo will be back to answer that. He's decided that Markus is ignoring his work, so his efforts would be better spent on some other project. He wrote that he doesn't PLAN to be posting here anymore.

A great loss to the community.

Wow, that hurts. He was a vital part of the team!

[Curtis]

This is from a locked thread, dated October 14th, by RonCo:

Why did you leave this place?

Just to be clear, while I think OOTP is a great little game in its own comprehensive way, the only thing I care about is simulating a realistic fictional environment that is played online--i.e. getting players to develop right and getting the game engine to play actual baseball. I don't care about the GM AI, nor do I care about historical simulation. I don't care about face gen. I don't care about scouting except as it gets in the way of or interacts with development. I don't care about uniforms. All I care about is whether players age right and the game engine works. I spent easily 1,000 hours proposing designs and doing testing on this game over the last year. I focused on development, a new pitching model, and a few other small areas--pretty much none of which was used. It is obvious to me that the game is not going to get any better if I work on it or if I don't. So I'm taking my ball and going home because, quite honestly, the game is no fun for me. I see nothing but the gaping holes. I've also gotten so deeply involved at my real work, that I haven't had time to run my FOBL team, so what little motivation I had for the work was removed.

If this last ever changes, I'll come back to run a FOBL team. And if it _really_ changes, perhaps I'll even decide to write my own game. It's really what I should have done last year given this effort.

But until then, I'll leave this post as my presumptive last post...but then again, I should never say never.

[satchel]

Originally Posted by RonCo

I spent easily 1,000 hours proposing designs and doing testing on this game over the last year.

While I have great gratitude to RonCo for his hard work and dedication, this "1000 hours in the last year" figure is an exaggeration. There's no way.

That would be eight hours a day, five days a week, for half the year. Or close to three hours a day, for 365 straight days.

A full-time job is about 2000 hours a year.

[Afino]

Originally Posted by Curtis

This is from a locked thread, dated October 14th, by RonCo:

Why did you leave this place?

Just to be clear, while I think OOTP is a great little game in its own comprehensive way, the only thing I care about is simulating a realistic fictional environment that is played online--i.e. getting players to develop right and getting the game engine to play actual baseball. I don't care about the GM AI, nor do I care about historical simulation. I don't care about face gen. I don't care about scouting except as it gets in the way of or interacts with development. I don't care about uniforms. All I care about is whether players age right and the game engine works. I spent easily 1,000 hours proposing designs and doing testing on this game over the last year. I focused on development, a new pitching model, and a few other small areas--pretty much none of which was used. It is obvious to me that the game is not going to get any better if I work on it or if I don't. So I'm taking my ball and going home because, quite honestly, the game is no fun for me. I see nothing but the gaping holes. I've also gotten so deeply involved at my real work, that I haven't had time to run my FOBL team, so what little motivation I had for the work was removed.

If this last ever changes, I'll come back to run a FOBL team. And if it _really_ changes, perhaps I'll even decide to write my own game. It's really what I should have done last year given this effort.

But until then, I'll leave this post as my presumptive last post...but then again, I should never say never.

To me, the reason why he left is awfully petty. Is it that big of a deal? RonCo came up with his own settings that fit HIS need.

Isn't that the motto of OOTP? "It's your game, play it your way??" I'm sure there's settings for EVERYONE out there, and Markus and the rest of development and testing created this game to be able to customize it exactly to your own specifications, however varied they may be. To me, that's the most important thing.

Thanks, Markus, for a great game.

[Nutlaw]

Let's not rehash this same old thing again please.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by satchel

While I have great gratitude to RonCo for his hard work and dedication, this "1000 hours in the last year" figure is an exaggeration. There's no way.

Sure it's possible. He could be retired. Or independently wealthy. Or disabled. Or got laid off. There's no telling.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by Nutlaw

Let's not rehash this same old thing again please.

How long have you been on this board, Nutlaw?

[satchel]

Originally Posted by The Wolf

Sure it's possible. He could be retired. Or independently wealthy. Or disabled. Or got laid off. There's no telling.

Anything is possible. But he frequently makes references to having a job. So the probability is minuscule; I'd estimate less than 1%.

[The Wolf]

So much for the benefit of the doubt.

[Isura]

Originally Posted by satchel

Anything is possible. But he frequently makes references to having a job. So the probability is minuscule; I'd estimate less than 1%.

That's only 2.7 hours/day for a year. I can see it!