2024 NFL Season thread

[kq76]

Originally Posted by CONN CHRIS

I absolutely agree. Just don't want that lost in the clearly different versions of what you and I saw out of Hill in this. To reiterate, even though I saw (and firmly still believe) that he was an ass, none of the police actions that followed were remotely justified.

We're cool. I get that your and people like monkeyman576's viewpoints on this are very different from one another. I'm not at all lumping you two together in my mind. I just very much don't agree with the view that he was being an ass and I felt compelled to point that out.

Did Tyreek do absolutely everything that he should have done? No, I don't think that at all either. I'm sure some expert on the topic could easily point out to us all what he should have done differently.

It's like Ragnar's "Mess with the bull, get the horns. That doesn't mean the bull was in the right." comment. I don't agree that he was "messing" with him either. Tyreek didn't want the officer damaging his vehicle and he wanted to get out of there as fast as he could. And if that meant he had to get a ticket, he was fine with it. Was he all flowery about it like a southern belle? No, but he wasn't "messing" with him.

[Cobra Mgr]

Originally Posted by kq76

It's like Ragnar's "Mess with the bull, get the horns.

The problem I have with that take is we are are implying like we should expect policemen to behave like wild untamed beasts. Are we surprised Tyreek got roughed up for not kissing the police's ring? No. Because they are not held accountable. But this shouldn't be the logical progression of reactions. I emphasize again:

Police are TRAINED.

They aren't raised in the woods. They are supposed to be intelligent, thinking, reasoning, rational, disciplined human beings. We shouldn't just dismiss this as "don't tug on Superman's cape". Once we see one is incapable of being an intelligent, thinking, reasoning, rational, disciplined human being, we should demand for their immediate termination. And in no way, shape or form give the notion that "That's life". Because that person has shown they are not qualified to handle a job that handles a gun.

[monkeyman576]

It could have been handled better by the officers, and maybe a suspension and additional training could be required by the officers, but I don't think anyone should be fired. No one was hurt or injured. In the end the officers put their lives on the line every single day in dangerous situations and Hill has had multiple issues with the law.

[Cobra Mgr]

So injury & death is the only reason why an officer should be fired.
Check.

[Cobra Mgr]

Some of my Steeler friends are celebrating the 20th anny of Jerome Bettis stats line.

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by Cobra Mgr

The problem I have with that take is we are are implying like we should expect policemen to behave like wild untamed beasts. Are we surprised Tyreek got roughed up for not kissing the police's ring? No. Because they are not held accountable. But this shouldn't be the logical progression of reactions. I emphasize again:

Police are TRAINED.

They aren't raised in the woods. They are supposed to be intelligent, thinking, reasoning, rational, disciplined human beings. We shouldn't just dismiss this as "don't tug on Superman's cape". Once we see one is incapable of being an intelligent, thinking, reasoning, rational, disciplined human being, we should demand for their immediate termination. And in no way, shape or form give the notion that "That's life". Because that person has shown they are not qualified to handle a job that handles a gun.

No, we should not expect them to act like that, but be prepared that they might. If you follow police brutality like you say, then you know you can't expect them to act the right way either. You only hope they do. How does it benefit you to push their buttons?

If a Hells Angel biker pulled up to a traffic light with his (property) girlfriend on the back and you asked, which one is the hog? He's really not supposed to get off that bike and beat you to death. But you did bring it upon yourself.

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by kq76

It's like Ragnar's "Mess with the bull, get the horns. That doesn't mean the bull was in the right." comment. I don't agree that he was "messing" with him either. Tyreek didn't want the officer damaging his vehicle and he wanted to get out of there as fast as he could. And if that meant he had to get a ticket, he was fine with it. Was he all flowery about it like a southern belle? No, but he wasn't "messing" with him.

I don't believe you even believe this. I do believe he wanted to get out of there as soon as possible, but wasn't bright enough to know the quickest path. He didn't say don't knock on my window like that because he was concerned. Because he didn't stop saying it. That's not how a normal person interacts. He was talking as if from a position of power. The cop recognized this and showed, and told Hill who was in the position of power. It's clear in the video.

[Cobra Mgr]

That's essentially why the whole incident happened. Two parties trying to prove whose farts smells like flowers.

[Cobra Mgr]

Originally Posted by Ragnar

No, we should not expect them to act like that, but be prepared that they might. If you follow police brutality like you say, then you know you can't expect them to act the right way either. You only hope they do. How does it benefit you to push their buttons?

If a Hells Angel biker pulled up to a traffic light with his (property) girlfriend on the back and you asked, which one is the hog? He's really not supposed to get off that bike and beat you to death. But you did bring it upon yourself.

I disagree. Because we selectively use that reasoning. Girl gets drunk at a party. Or worse accepts drinks from a stranger. She gets raped. Do we say, "She brought it on herself."? Ray Rice's once g/f hits him repeatedly & spits on him and he loses it & knocks her out. Do we say "She brought it on herself."? Bryce Harper admires a moonshot off his bat then takes 98 in the spine. Did Bryce "bring it upon himself"? I leave my keys in the car. Someone breaks in & drives off w/it. Did I "bring it upon myself"?

We're not talking falling dominos here. These are CHOICES. Yeah, I gotta keep my head on a swivel. But that doesn't mean I punched myself if someone throws a haymaker @ me while I'm looking in the opposite direction.

[Rain King]

Originally Posted by Cobra Mgr

That's essentially why the whole incident happened. Two parties trying to prove whose farts smells like flowers.

The difference, of course, is that the police officers are the professionals in this situation. It is their job to be able to handle Hill's disposition professionally.

They failed at that. Otherwise, we would either not be talking about this at all or criticizing Hill.

[Cobra Mgr]

Originally Posted by Rain King

The difference, of course, is that the police officers are the professionals in this situation. It is their job to be able to handle Hill's disposition professionally.

They failed at that. Otherwise, we would either not be talking about this at all or criticizing Hill.

Yeah, I'm not going into degrees of guilt here. Again, we are human beings. We can think. We recognize cause and effect. We know the "Golden Rule" even if we don't believe in the Bible.

As adults, do we really have to go to seminars & workshops to know we should behave decently w/one another?

I don't expect Hill to be happy & smiling joyfully at being stopped. I don't expect police officers to not get P.O.'d at a pompous fool. But if we've got no more self-control than this, then no wonder human kind can't make any progress.

[dsvitak]

Originally Posted by Cobra Mgr

That's essentially why the whole incident happened. Two parties trying to prove whose farts smells like flowers.

We don't always agree..and I have stayed away from the convo..but this I can agree with.

[monkeyman576]

The person committing the crime is usually not going to win out in these situations. The officers should have behaved better but I’d rather have the officers in their jobs than Hill in his job given his history.

[Amazin69]

Originally Posted by monkeyman576

The person committing the crime is usually not going to win out in these situations. The officers should have behaved better but I’d rather have the officers in their jobs than Hill in his job given his history.

The "crime" was a traffic violation. That doesn't justify a dick-measuring contest, much less escalation to near-violence, IMO.

And given that Hill has been a consistently excellent performer (leading the NFL in Receiving Yards and Touchdowns last season), despite having pled guilty to a charge and served his probation that ended 7 years ago, I think the Dolphins are quite fine with having Hill in his job, your opinion to the contrary.

[Cobra Mgr]

Originally Posted by monkeyman576

The person committing the crime is usually not going to win out in these situations. The officers should have behaved better but I’d rather have the officers in their jobs than Hill in his job given his history.

You'd rather an officer continue to commit police brutality on the citizens on Miami than Tyreek Hill score TD's.

Some of the things that come out w/your pseudonym makes me wonder do you ever give any thought to your thoughts.

EDIT

This is a perfect example why what you stated was such a terrible take.

[mytreds]

Tua suffered another concussion

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by Cobra Mgr

I disagree. Because we selectively use that reasoning. Girl gets drunk at a party. Or worse accepts drinks from a stranger. She gets raped. Do we say, "She brought it on herself."? Ray Rice's once g/f hits him repeatedly & spits on him and he loses it & knocks her out. Do we say "She brought it on herself."? Bryce Harper admires a moonshot off his bat then takes 98 in the spine. Did Bryce "bring it upon himself"? I leave my keys in the car. Someone breaks in & drives off w/it. Did I "bring it upon myself"?

We're not talking falling dominos here. These are CHOICES. Yeah, I gotta keep my head on a swivel. But that doesn't mean I punched myself if someone throws a haymaker @ me while I'm looking in the opposite direction.

If I leave my keys in my car, and it gets stolen, I would blame myself. My actions were really stupid. You can't expect everyone to act according to the law.

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by mytreds

Tua suffered another concussion

Tua's problem is that he doesn't know how to protect himself once out of the pocket.

[Ragnar]

How dumb are the Jets? They traded for a player that wanted off a team because they wouldn't give him an extension. This player is Reddick. So they decide to also not give him an extension. He would have stayed in Philly if he wanted to play out his last year. Why trade for him?

[Cobra Mgr]

Originally Posted by Ragnar

If I leave my keys in my car, and it gets stolen, I would blame myself. My actions were really stupid. You can't expect everyone to act according to the law.

So when the thief gets caught, is his atty. going to say you brought it on yourself as a defense? You going to blame yourself if your daughter gets kidnapped standing at the bus stop by herself?

Again, these are not falling dominos.