Would It Be Possible To Include Catobase within OOTP6? - Page 4

kq76 · 03-10-2004, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Killebrew
Jeff Cato's OOTP History has it's look dictacted by CSS files like the html for OOTP5, so the look has almost no limits.

Oh I realize that it uses stylesheets and that you can customize some parts like colors and font sizes (e.g. http://www.hblbaseball.com/reference/index.html), but much of the layout is fairly fixed. I should have said "layout" in my previous post, not "look". The layout is of course secondary to the content, so much so that I wouldn't be surprised if people didn't roll their eyes at me for bringing it up. In particular, I find it difficult to take in all the info on the player pages (getting more familiar with it over time probably helps though). I'm not at all suggesting that some data be taken away, if anything add more. I just wonder if some tweaks to the layout might make it easier to digest.

The biggest thing I would like to see is to have all the data of all the players and teams in sortable tables (multiple sortable columns) in html, so you can very easily analyze it all. Now that would be heaven for me. My archive does this in excel, but that's nowhere near as convenient as it being in html and included as part of the game.

DaveHorn · 03-10-2004, 06:52 PM

First, here here to the idea!

kq - Adding sortable columns to Catobase would mean its no longer static HTML. You would then need a website/app server to host Catobase. Either that or many many many copies of the same HTML where each one was just a different sort on a different column.

jmaness84 · 03-10-2004, 07:39 PM

So whats up with Cato's Utility actually going in to OOTP6? Any more news? I think it has to be implemented now. Markus can't just say that and not do it. Get our hopes up for nothing.

dougaiton · 03-10-2004, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by kq76
Oh I realize that it uses stylesheets and that you can customize some parts like colors and font sizes (e.g. http://www.hblbaseball.com/reference/index.html), but much of the layout is fairly fixed. I should have said "layout" in my previous post, not "look". The layout is of course secondary to the content, so much so that I wouldn't be surprised if people didn't roll their eyes at me for bringing it up. In particular, I find it difficult to take in all the info on the player pages (getting more familiar with it over time probably helps though). I'm not at all suggesting that some data be taken away, if anything add more. I just wonder if some tweaks to the layout might make it easier to digest.

[blatant compliment masquerading as point]
I know you're interested in the layout, rather than the look, but if you want to see some great work with the look of CATO, check out the great work Drew has done in LotD fitting CATO in to the style of the league site! Truly the wizard!
[/blatant compliment masquerading as point]

Kemp · 03-10-2004, 08:11 PM

Just wondering, will OOTP6 have a database export feature as had been discussed?

I know for previous versions, I'd use utilities to do the DB export and then create my own reports in Access. It worked GREAT.

rangerforlife · 03-10-2004, 11:43 PM

Dean Gordon, you're the freaking man. I wouldn't even have suggested that the Catobase be combined with OOTP... not that I don't want it, but it would cause me to become even more of an OOTP addict and overall recluse than I already am...

major, major props on starting this thread... now I just hope they really can pull it off. I don't want this to be OOTP's answer to the A-Rod/BoSox deal.

BrewersFan2003 · 03-11-2004, 08:41 AM

Really, I think a database like Cato's should be introduced with the game, if not in this version, the following versions down the line. It is something we are all asking for, but I think on a cosmetic level, the Cato utility or something Markus implements on his own will need to have a better layout for people like myself. I know personally I could care less as well at some of the statistics that are shown on the player pages, and some of the information provided... But, I really do think if the layout is worked on and this utility might be improved, or worked on to create a newer utility that is more user-friendly and follows the cosmetic design of the game, it should be brought in as a addition.

Chappy · 03-11-2004, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by dougaiton
[blatant compliment masquerading as point]
I know you're interested in the layout, rather than the look, but if you want to see some great work with the look of CATO, check out the great work Drew has done in LotD fitting CATO in to the style of the league site! Truly the wizard!
[/blatant compliment masquerading as point]

Wow! Whoever Drew is did an excellent job!

fhomess · 03-11-2004, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Chappy
Wow! Whoever Drew is did an excellent job!

That (the LOTD) is one nice looking website!

As for Catobase, I don't know if Markus will be able to get it in OOTP6 or not, but let's give them some time to work it out. It's not something they'll be able to give us an answer on in two days. Markus regularly surprises and delivers, so let's give him the benefit of the doubt here that he's doing what he can to get it in before release. I suspect he won't say anything more about it until it's finalized.

Ben Music · 03-11-2004, 11:08 AM

For those interested in the Catobase, Jeff has made his triumphant return to the forums. See link below:

http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...threadid=56828

Dean Gordon · 03-11-2004, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rangerforlife
Dean Gordon, you're the freaking man. I wouldn't even have suggested that the Catobase be combined with OOTP... not that I don't want it, but it would cause me to become even more of an OOTP addict and overall recluse than I already am... major, major props on starting this thread... now I just hope they really can pull it off. I don't want this to be OOTP's answer to the A-Rod/BoSox deal.

Its only because I have to work on the Catobase for EBL and NABL that I thought of this...

Also looking at the GMC Catobase, pouring over the stats, and being pissed at how one of the most dominant teams in history, Unionville, has choked time and time again in the damn playoffs....

ctorg · 03-11-2004, 02:19 PM

Actually, I requested the very same thing last year, but Markus probably missed it.

CubsFan · 03-11-2004, 06:20 PM

Just wanted to add my two cents that this is the one non-game engine addition I have wanted since I first started playing OOTP. I used early versions of Cato's utility and found it to be incredible. Unfortunately, the process of using it became too much for me. Having something similar in-game would be an incredible addition.

Bonedwarf · 03-12-2004, 02:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dean Gordon
Spending a ton of time in the GMC Catobase pouring over stats really shows to me the importance of getting my ass in gear and doing one for the EBL and NABL...

If the Catobase was included in-game, I think solo play would dramatically increase. Why do people play baseball sims? To re-write history. So they can pour over stats. That is the essentialness of baseball - the tradition. The Catobase applied to a solo league would enhance it that much more...

Yes indeed. I ONLY do ficitional leagues, and I use Ryan's database with OOTP4. Cato's, as fantastic as it is, requires more work than I can be bothered with

If it was built into OOTP6... WOO! Yes. GIMME!

rangerforlife · 03-12-2004, 03:08 AM

Speaking of the Catobase, does anyone else think the Bill James HoF Monitor would be a decent addition? I know Jeff threw the HoF Standards and Black and Gray Ink Tests on there. I just like the HoF Monitor, too.

SnowMan · 03-12-2004, 03:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bonedwarf
If it was built into OOTP6... WOO! Yes. GIMME!

What he said.

Bonedwarf · 03-12-2004, 05:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by SnowMan
What he said.

BusterKing · 03-12-2004, 07:08 AM

Bring it on!

Matt from TN · 03-18-2004, 12:06 PM

since cato's reference is useful and fun for both solo & online leagues (I never go w/out it anymore), does anyone think there's the slightest possibility it could be modified in some way to also extract data from the almanac (i know this was kinda mentioned before) for us knuckleheads who simmed many seasons pre-cato and were too dumb to save the league files of every year? I'd do almost anything to get a hold of something like that.

I've discovered a way to manually enter every season's stats to recreate past seasons, but damn it's time consuming... I have 20 seasons to do and I think if I quit my job and left my wife I could get it accomplished in one year. Most of the basic info is there in the almanac, which would be good enough for me. I suppose the most important info missing would be the player#'s, but if you've never duplicated a name (i.e. two John Smith's) - and I haven't in almost 30 yrs now - it could still work.

Henry · 03-18-2004, 12:17 PM

Unless Jeff is willing to get reinvolved with his previous work, I'm guessing we'll ultimately have to rely on Markus to expand on the Almanac. Unless I'm mistaken, it's likely that the changes in V6 will likey render Cato's work useless unless he returns to make modifications.

I'm like most of you and would love to see the utility added to OOTP, but it's likely not to happen before V7 if at all.

Henry

03-10-2004, 06:52 PM	#62
DaveHorn All Star Starter Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 1,146	First, here here to the idea! kq - Adding sortable columns to Catobase would mean its no longer static HTML. You would then need a website/app server to host Catobase. Either that or many many many copies of the same HTML where each one was just a different sort on a different column. __________________ Dave HFTC Commish

03-10-2004, 11:43 PM	#66
rangerforlife Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: I want to hear from a clone! React to me!!! Posts: 225	Mad props Dean Gordon, you're the freaking man. I wouldn't even have suggested that the Catobase be combined with OOTP... not that I don't want it, but it would cause me to become even more of an OOTP addict and overall recluse than I already am... major, major props on starting this thread... now I just hope they really can pull it off. I don't want this to be OOTP's answer to the A-Rod/BoSox deal.

03-11-2004, 11:08 AM	#70
Ben Music Major Leagues Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Minneapolis, MN Posts: 432	For those interested in the Catobase, Jeff has made his triumphant return to the forums. See link below: http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...threadid=56828 __________________

03-11-2004, 02:19 PM	#72
ctorg Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Queens, NY Posts: 9,848	Actually, I requested the very same thing last year, but Markus probably missed it. __________________ My music "When the trees blow back and forth, that's what makes the wind." - Steven Wright Fjord emena pancreas thorax fornicate marmalade morpheme proteolysis smaxa cabana offal srue vitriol grope hallelujah lentils

03-12-2004, 03:08 AM	#75
rangerforlife Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: I want to hear from a clone! React to me!!! Posts: 225	Speaking of the Catobase, does anyone else think the Bill James HoF Monitor would be a decent addition? I know Jeff threw the HoF Standards and Black and Gray Ink Tests on there. I just like the HoF Monitor, too. __________________ "Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men." - Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

03-10-2004, 07:39 PM	#63
jmaness84 All Star Starter Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Georgia Posts: 1,685	So whats up with Cato's Utility actually going in to OOTP6? Any more news? I think it has to be implemented now. Markus can't just say that and not do it. Get our hopes up for nothing.

03-10-2004, 08:11 PM	#65
Kemp All Star Starter Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 1,181	Just wondering, will OOTP6 have a database export feature as had been discussed? I know for previous versions, I'd use utilities to do the DB export and then create my own reports in Access. It worked GREAT.

03-11-2004, 08:41 AM	#67
BrewersFan2003 Minors (Single A) Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 75	Really, I think a database like Cato's should be introduced with the game, if not in this version, the following versions down the line. It is something we are all asking for, but I think on a cosmetic level, the Cato utility or something Markus implements on his own will need to have a better layout for people like myself. I know personally I could care less as well at some of the statistics that are shown on the player pages, and some of the information provided... But, I really do think if the layout is worked on and this utility might be improved, or worked on to create a newer utility that is more user-friendly and follows the cosmetic design of the game, it should be brought in as a addition.

03-11-2004, 06:20 PM	#73
CubsFan Minors (Double A) Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 150	Just wanted to add my two cents that this is the one non-game engine addition I have wanted since I first started playing OOTP. I used early versions of Cato's utility and found it to be incredible. Unfortunately, the process of using it became too much for me. Having something similar in-game would be an incredible addition.

03-12-2004, 07:08 AM	#78
BusterKing Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 2,437	Bring it on!

03-18-2004, 12:06 PM	#79
Matt from TN Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: In a funk.... Posts: 3,413	since cato's reference is useful and fun for both solo & online leagues (I never go w/out it anymore), does anyone think there's the slightest possibility it could be modified in some way to also extract data from the almanac (i know this was kinda mentioned before) for us knuckleheads who simmed many seasons pre-cato and were too dumb to save the league files of every year? I'd do almost anything to get a hold of something like that. I've discovered a way to manually enter every season's stats to recreate past seasons, but damn it's time consuming... I have 20 seasons to do and I think if I quit my job and left my wife I could get it accomplished in one year. Most of the basic info is there in the almanac, which would be good enough for me. I suppose the most important info missing would be the player#'s, but if you've never duplicated a name (i.e. two John Smith's) - and I haven't in almost 30 yrs now - it could still work. __________________ Set in Stone... Players Remain with Original Franchise

03-18-2004, 12:17 PM	#80
Henry Hall of Fame Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 6,498	Unless Jeff is willing to get reinvolved with his previous work, I'm guessing we'll ultimately have to rely on Markus to expand on the Almanac. Unless I'm mistaken, it's likely that the changes in V6 will likey render Cato's work useless unless he returns to make modifications. I'm like most of you and would love to see the utility added to OOTP, but it's likely not to happen before V7 if at all. Henry