Height/weight: how much does it matter

[AaD88]

I am curious if people take frame (player height and weight) into account when drafting and developing prospects. I know in real life sometimes larger frames leave room for velocity or power gain. Do people feel like this is relevant in OOTP, or have they found that height/weight is just a number?

[Syd Thrift]

I *believe* that height and weight are correlated with Power and Stuff for pitchers but a. I'm not 100% sure and b. if they are, I'm almost positive that those correlations are already baked into the ratings (i.e. you don't need to, like, add 10 points of Stuff to a 6'10" guy - the effects of his height on his Stuff can already be seen).

[rudel.dietrich]

I think it only matters for first base defense. Otherwise it does not matter AFAIK. I could also be wrong

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by rudel.dietrich

I think it only matters for first base defense. Otherwise it does not matter AFAIK. I could also be wrong

Oh right, forgot all about defense at first base. Yeah, I know it's a separate not-baked-in factor there as well, although I think it's less of a sliding scale bonus and more of a "you must be this tall to be any good / get on this particular first base oriented ride" thing.

[fredbeene]

one would think that weight would play a factor in speed.
ie frank howard type with no other information available should not be a 100 speed or range.
probably doesn't' effect historical real players...but seems like there should be an effect for all FICTIONAL PLAYERS

[One Post Wonder]

I seem to remember hearing that tall pitchers have better control. Though that was from a few versions back and again, whatever adjustments are made to anything are already factored in. You can just look at the resulting abilities and you don't have to worry about it.

I think weight tends to increase as a player gets older but that is cosmetic.

Long story short I never look at height and weight at all, for anything.

[ezpkns34]

Originally Posted by rudel.dietrich

I think it only matters for first base defense

learned something new today

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by fredbeene

one would think that weight would play a factor in speed.
ie frank howard type with no other information available should not be a 100 speed or range.
probably doesn't' effect historical real players...but seems like there should be an effect for all FICTIONAL PLAYERS

I *believe* BMI has an effect on speed and by proxy outfield range, but as before, this is already baked into the ratings, and yes, that would be for fictional players only since historical/current players are graded by stats.

[rudel.dietrich]

In my testing, height and weight don’t seem to affect speed or durability or pitching effectiveness at all.

If these are indeed “baked in” then maybe I won’t see them.
But I have created four types of teams. Short and thin. Short and heavy. Tall and thin and tall and heavy.
Besides first base defense, nothing seemed to matter.

[NoOne]

if it has an impact it's while ratings are created - believe you can find a post from marcus/matt/someone from ootp in the past that says as much? it's been long enough that i don't have as good of recall, lol.

e.g. tall / big guy is more likely to have a higher than average power rating potential or a higher velocity than a 5'5" guy. So the physical characteristics should line up at least in some correlation to the ratings - but not always... it's not 1:1 correlation as we can see examples of where it is not true in our games.

after they are created it doesn't matter... the ratings dictate results. that is their function.

lots of creative ways to apply such things and have results swayed in proportion to any hard data on the subject. i'd bet a lot that height does correlate to velocity and power to height and size in real life... could be part of aging process or injuries etc... just not how they perform on the field after creation in a more direct way, so you wouldn't see any correlation that defies the ratings in any large enough sample. you'd have to compre ratings to physical characteristics or rate of change over time for things like injuries and degradation of skills... could still impact tht in indirect ways.

height definitely impacts 1B defense... can simply open editor and see that impact in real time.

[AaD88]

Thanks guys! Appreciate the feedback.

Just kind of hashing back my original thought: if there are two 18 y/o SP with velocity in 88-90 range, but one is 5'8" and the other is 6'6", could we assume that the taller pitcher is more likely to develop velocity boosts? Or is this completely random/baked in from the beginning?

It sounds like power is what it is in the ratings, that is good for me to know. I guess my questions are more development-related.

[Syd Thrift]

I think it’s the after, although if you don’t have Scouting set to 100% accurate I’d trust the higher POTs of the taller pitcher over the shorter one.

[TwinsTHunter]

I've noticed bigger hitters tend to add more power as they develop more often than smaller players.

Same for taller/heavier pitchers adding velocity as they develop. It can happen with smaller guys too, but I track my prospects extremely closely and the bigger players tend to have more room for growth, as one would expect.

As was mentioned, outside of 1B defense, already developed players don't seem to be at any kind of advantage.

I've also noticed shorter starting pitchers tend to be more injury prone over their careers, which I also think is more realistic based on historical data.

On the flip side, shorter players, especially center fielders, seem to see more increases in their outfield range as they develop than taller/heavier players.

Again, it's nothing crazy, but I do factor in the players height/weight when drafting players if the prospects are otherwise similar. I'm much more likely to draft a 5'10" CF then one who is 6'4", because the 6'4" player will generally gain more weight as he gets older and lose speed/range. If I want a player who may develop power or a pitcher who has maybe 2 great off speed pitches but only an average rated fastball potential, I will draft someone taller because once the power/velocity develops, they will be a considerably better prospect.

(Edit: I play with scouting at 100% accuracy so I see the ratings as they actually are, not just a scouts guess if that matters to anyone)

[brotherblues]

Originally Posted by TwinsTHunter

I've noticed bigger hitters tend to add more power as they develop more often than smaller players.

Same for taller/heavier pitchers adding velocity as they develop. It can happen with smaller guys too, but I track my prospects extremely closely and the bigger players tend to have more room for growth, as one would expect.

As was mentioned, outside of 1B defense, already developed players don't seem to be at any kind of advantage.

I've also noticed shorter starting pitchers tend to be more injury prone over their careers, which I also think is more realistic based on historical data.

On the flip side, shorter players, especially center fielders, seem to see more increases in their outfield range as they develop than taller/heavier players.

Again, it's nothing crazy, but I do factor in the players height/weight when drafting players if the prospects are otherwise similar. I'm much more likely to draft a 5'10" CF then one who is 6'4", because the 6'4" player will generally gain more weight as he gets older and lose speed/range. If I want a player who may develop power or a pitcher who has maybe 2 great off speed pitches but only an average rated fastball potential, I will draft someone taller because once the power/velocity develops, they will be a considerably better prospect.

(Edit: I play with scouting at 100% accuracy so I see the ratings as they actually are, not just a scouts guess if that matters to anyone)

Lots of interesting info here. Mabe even the answer to an old mystery/gripe for me, which is too many CFs losing massive amounts of range around ages 23-24.

[zippykat]

It seems like it should make a difference in power or a pitchers speed only if he is filling out a frame. A player who is drafted at 6'6" and 180 lbs might develop more power as he fills out his frame. A player that comes into the league 6' 6" and 260 probably will not add speed or power. If he can't break 90 at 6-6 260, he's not going to do it at 6-6 270 or 280.

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by rudel.dietrich

In my testing, height and weight don’t seem to affect speed or durability or pitching effectiveness at all.

If these are indeed “baked in” then maybe I won’t see them.
But I have created four types of teams. Short and thin. Short and heavy. Tall and thin and tall and heavy.
Besides first base defense, nothing seemed to matter.

To go back to this, I think you have time order mixed up. Height and weight (and for speed, BMI) are correlated to Stuff, Power, and so on. The correlation happens during player creation, so in a sense having high Power (or at least high Power potential) creates high weight, not the other way around. If you change the ratings on the fly after player creation, no, I don't think you'd see any difference; as noted, whatever factor you get from height or what have you has already been baked in to the player.