So, when do we get a 24 update?

[Rain King]

Originally Posted by BaseballGOAT

It doesn't seem to just be the league name or team names tho. Ficti9nal leagues from that country have been affected as well. So while I understand there may be legal implications still at play... I feel if we just knew all the search parameters for the nuking things could begin to move forward. My fear is what if I create said fictional league and are in say 2042 and search parameters see the name Ichiro Nomo and its flagged because of Ichiro Suzuki and Hideo Nomo and then my league gets nuked. That save is ruined for me at that point. Think of the time and effort invested

All of the reports of fictional leagues that I have seen people report that have had issues still had some reference to the league in question. Maybe that had part of that league's name in their league name or the players were fictional but they were using "real" team names. Obviously there could be someone that has an example that doesn't make sense, but I've yet to see one. Do you have an example?

I'm creating a new fictional Japanese league right now and will test the Ichiro Nomo case.

[RaUni]

Originally Posted by Rain King

All of the reports of fictional leagues that I have seen people report that have had issues still had some reference to the league in question. Maybe that had part of that league's name in their league name or the players were fictional but they were using "real" team names. Obviously there could be someone that has an example that doesn't make sense, but I've yet to see one. Do you have an example?



I'm creating a new fictional Japanese league right now and will test the Ichiro Nomo case.

My league had 6-10 teams from said league in a fictional league. Over 200 teams mainly MLB, KBO and fictional. Everything scrambled. *** League was loaded during file creation but was deleted day 1 after creating my fictional league. Every MLB, kbo and fictional team scrambled. 200 plus hours of designing the league gone.

Tbh I kept the few teams just to respect the old league but most of the teams in the Japanese division were custom. I'd have gladly changed those team names if it would've saved all that but they refused to give anyone a chance or anything. Unacceptable. Reckless. No thought put into it.

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[Rain King]

Originally Posted by RaUni

My league had 6-10 teams from said league in a fictional league. Over 200 teams mainly MLB, KBO and fictional. Everything scrambled. *** League was loaded during file creation but was deleted day 1 after creating my fictional league. Every MLB, kbo and fictional team scrambled. 200 plus hours of designing the league gone.

Tbh I kept the few teams just to respect the old league but most of the teams in the Japanese division were custom. I'd have gladly changed those team names if it would've saved all that but they refused to give anyone a chance or anything. Unacceptable. Reckless. No thought put into it.

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That sucks and I understand that is frustrating.

Based on your explanation of your setup I see why it was scrambled, though. Your league included teams that matched the real-life Japanese professional league.

I don't disagree that it would have been better had they been able to edit ONLY the offending teams within a league but that just isn't what happened.

[Rain King]

FYI, the "Ichiro Nomo" case did not cause any issues in my test.

[RaUni]

Originally Posted by Rain King

That sucks and I understand that is frustrating.



Based on your explanation of your setup I see why it was scrambled, though. Your league included teams that matched the real-life Japanese professional league.



I don't disagree that it would have been better had they been able to edit ONLY the offending teams within a league but that just isn't what happened.

Markus stated they would randomize any *** data. This did this to all data. They obviously did not test or care. They should not have scrambled anything non ***

They could've randomized those team names. That's all.

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[Rain King]

Originally Posted by RaUni

Markus stated they would randomize any *** data. This did this to all data. They obviously did not test or care. They should not have scrambled anything non ***

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Yes. What is listed in the changelist and what actually happened do not appear to match exactly.

However, I think we have enough information at this point to understand what the cases are regarding what was "randomized" and thus how leagues can/can't be created going forward.

[RaUni]

Originally Posted by Rain King

Yes. What is listed in the changelist and what actually happened do not appear to match exactly.



However, I think we have enough information at this point to understand what the cases are regarding what was "randomized" and thus how leagues can/can't be created going forward.

There isn't any going forward. Not with this unethical behavior.

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[Rain King]

Originally Posted by RaUni

There isn't any going forward. Not with this unethical behavior.

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That is a decision that is completely legitimate if it is the best thing for you.

[OutS|der]

Originally Posted by RaUni

Markus stated they would randomize any *** data. This did this to all data. They obviously did not test or care. They should not have scrambled anything non ***

They could've randomized those team names. That's all.

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Yeah I don't know why they didn't go that way considering changing the league and team names is all that's needed to bypass the randomization.
Players names are left alone this way.

Really frustrating they had to randomize players when there was no need to

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by OutS|der

Yeah I don't know why they didn't go that way considering changing the league and team names is all that's needed to bypass the randomization.
Players names are left alone this way.

Really frustrating they had to randomize players when there was no need to

I hope that they can speak to it in time but I’m pretty sure that the issue is that in Japan, unlike the US, stats and history are protected in copyright. This makes some sense that if you have real stats or a certain league, you can’t just change the league and team names and allow even a fictionalized version of Sadaharu Oh with the same HR totals year to year as he had IRL. Apparently relocating all that to South Africa and changing player names is enough, I don’t know. It’s crazy and this goes beyond “selling a game without a license”; OOTP was unlicensed for the MLB for years and they never had to rewrite existing saves because enterprising fans changed the names of the San Diego Whale Vaginas to the Padres or something.

To be clear, I think this sucks and I am not on build 110 yet because I don’t know what effect it will have on my system (using a euphemism here). It double sucks for people who bought it on Steam who didn’t catch it in time, or who just allow all patches because, well, they’ve never done stuff like this. That really sucks and I understand why people are upset. I personally want to know how my league will be affected by stuff before I buy 24.

What I’d really like less of is the “this is all because OOTP got bought out by a Korean gacha company” crap. If I get whinged at every time I blame this on Konami, y’all don’t get to blame this on Com2Us either. This feels, frankly, and not to those of you who haven’t posted a lot before this but to certain members who’ve been on this particular topic for a while, like another attempt to blame the Asian ownership for everything people don’t like about the current direction of the product.

[OutS|der]

Originally Posted by BaseballGOAT

It doesn't seem to just be the league name or team names tho. Ficti9nal leagues from that country have been affected as well. So while I understand there may be legal implications still at play... I feel if we just knew all the search parameters for the nuking things could begin to move forward. My fear is what if I create said fictional league and are in say 2042 and search parameters see the name Ichiro Nomo and its flagged because of Ichiro Suzuki and Hideo Nomo and then my league gets nuked. That save is ruined for me at that point. Think of the time and effort invested

I can confirm fictional teams from Japan are NOT randomized. The only way randomization happens is if the league is named Nippon and or the team names are the same as the original teams. I just imported a MLB quickstart and changed the team and league names and NONE of the players were touched.

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by OutS|der

I can confirm fictional teams from Japan are NOT randomized. The only way randomization happens is if the league is named Nippon and or the team names are the same as the original teams. I just imported a MLB quickstart and changed the team and league names and NONE of the players were touched.

Do we know how history is handled? I have a fictional/historical league with a Japanese Baseball League (apparently that’s what I named it from the start, given that Nippon is just Japan in Japanese) but the team names are historical. If I rename the teams, will it still go into the history, see those historically accurate names, and scramble stuff / move to P.Rico?

[OutS|der]

Originally Posted by Syd Thrift

Do we know how history is handled? I have a fictional/historical league with a Japanese Baseball League (apparently that’s what I named it from the start, given that Nippon is just Japan in Japanese) but the team names are historical. If I rename the teams, will it still go into the history, see those historically accurate names, and scramble stuff / move to P.Rico?

History appears to be intake and shows the original names. IE Munetaka Murakami still has him winning the 2020 Nippon best 9 award. His stats show the new team name though. Seems even N*P*B is blocked on the forums

[Syd Thrift]

Yeah I've been using it in place of other swear words and unacceptable names and stuff, such as talking about J *** n's role in the r *** of N *** king.

[RaUni]

Originally Posted by Syd Thrift

I hope that they can speak to it in time but I’m pretty sure that the issue is that in Japan, unlike the US, stats and history are protected in copyright. This makes some sense that if you have real stats or a certain league, you can’t just change the league and team names and allow even a fictionalized version of Sadaharu Oh with the same HR totals year to year as he had IRL. Apparently relocating all that to South Africa and changing player names is enough, I don’t know. It’s crazy and this goes beyond “selling a game without a license”; OOTP was unlicensed for the MLB for years and they never had to rewrite existing saves because enterprising fans changed the names of the San Diego Whale Vaginas to the Padres or something.



To be clear, I think this sucks and I am not on build 110 yet because I don’t know what effect it will have on my system (using a euphemism here). It double sucks for people who bought it on Steam who didn’t catch it in time, or who just allow all patches because, well, they’ve never done stuff like this. That really sucks and I understand why people are upset. I personally want to know how my league will be affected by stuff before I buy 24.



What I’d really like less of is the “this is all because OOTP got bought out by a Korean gacha company” crap. If I get whinged at every time I blame this on Konami, y’all don’t get to blame this on Com2Us either. This feels, frankly, and not to those of you who haven’t posted a lot before this but to certain members who’ve been on this particular topic for a while, like another attempt to blame the Asian ownership for everything people don’t like about the current direction of the product.

How are you praising OOTPD nonstop and don't even have the update. Update it, see what it does to your league, and deal with it and move on right? Isn't that what you're preaching? And again acting like "you're pretty sure what's happening" with no evidence of anything. You love Markus. We get it. If you trust him so much, update your game and load that league.

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[Kobeck]

Originally Posted by Sweed

Mirrors my experience. v23 is a big improvement over v22 and a vast improvement over v19(if we want to go with "the last 4 versions").

It's a baseball game, there is only so much one can do. v1, after all, already had three bases and home plate.

For playing out games, unless it goes to a physics model, development will always(?) be tweaks and small additions, I think?

Transactions, like all sports sims, will continually be "improved" so, for many, not sexy.

Database/stat keeping improvements come version to version. When they add something like SIERA they get a response something like "it should have already been there. It's hardly an addition."

It's the same for many things that are already in the game. IE they will never be seen as "new" but only "improved". Well yeah, what else can they be?

The elephant in the room is how far will they, or do the want to, go down the "front office operations" path? This is the area that a lot of users here ask for and want/expect an FM type of depth. Fair enough request and understand their desire to have these type of financials. If this were added there would be some joy from users because OOTP is finally making "BIG STEPS" while others would find it "not sexy" and "a version I could just as well skip". Me? If it were FM depth I'd hand most of it off to my staff. That doesn't mean I'd complain that another area of the game was "forgotten about" or there was "nothing new" in OOTP for me. I would still "buy a license" for the game and be happy for those that finally "got theirs".

I've never played PT nor have I even loaded it up for a "look see". I have no interest. I am also not a PT hater but, for my style of play, I think it has lead to huge improvements in OOTP proper. However for those that want the FM type front office experience? I will concede that PT is probably a huge stumbling block to getting that type of front office experience. At least AFAIK there are no financials in PT which means any financial improvements are an "OOTP only" feature.

This doesn't mean there can't\won't be financial improvements but, IMHO, means we won't see a "big, bright, new" financial model as a key release feature. Instead it will probably always(?) be small improvements from version to version.

In the end I get my money's worth from OOTP every year. YMMV.

oh I think there are a ton of financial$ in PT


LOL

[Kobeck]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

Not anymore Sweed. Obviously you know me as one of those people who would like to see augmented front office features....but now with what's going on (at it could very well potentially get worse) the ability to take those "BIG STEPS" is now gone. I really don't plan on making OOTP a part of my lobbying experience any longer unless something drastically changes (or goes back to the way it was). So, no worries....but in all honesty I think the best days of OOTP are behind us at this point.

agreed, although I am not sacrifice hitting just yet

[Kobeck]

Originally Posted by rudel.dietrich

I have been here a long time and made a lot of suggestions in my almost two decades here.

The game has grown into a direction that does not personally suit me. Less of a GM/front office sim and more of a baseball universe simulator with a heavy dose of gatcha card collecting mechanics.
And that is fine. I am just one person. I don't expect them to develop the game just for me.

I check on every version but I am turning into an every third year purchaser due to how little the game changes.
But again, those are changes I find personally meaningful.
Others may find that the changes are more for them.

wish there was a thumbs up button

[Pelican]

Originally Posted by MathBandit

You can be sad and upset that one specific league isn't in your universe without also pretending that that's a more meaningful restriction to customization than zero ability to play any year prior to the current one and an editor that needs to be purchased in order to be used.

True, and this loss seems to have been the result of extortion by *** or whatever they call themselves, and not some unilateral decision by OOTP.

[Pelican]

Originally Posted by Rain King

That is a decision that is completely legitimate if it is the best thing for you.

Keep in mind that any “unethical behavior” was on the part of greedy licensing folks, and not on the part of OOTP. Nothing unethical about refusing what amounts to extortion.