Wow…It’s really Dead

[thehef]

Originally Posted by Brad K

And the criticized historical forum has recently lit up with posts about historical settings Its not just reports on the progress of saves as stated previously. Nothing personal about that either.

True. Although my point about the historical forums wasn't criticism, but just observation that the reason for less discussion - overall, if not at the moment - about settings, workarounds, etc., has been the progress that OOTP has made on the historical side. Many things we just don't need to talk about anymore...

And I say this from the perspective that I don't share the overall dim view that some do of the state of the forums. It's certainly different than it was 8 or 10 or even 4 years ago. But it is what it is... I certainly miss reading and participating in discussions where Chuck (Spritze) was involved. No doubt about that!

[Anonymous Ghost]

Originally Posted by RchW

I'm still playing and enjoying OOTP 23 albeit at a reduced level. I don't post much anymore because I have some changed priorities in life along with difficulty using a keyboard plus other physical issues.

In 2019 I was diagnosed with Parkinson's Disease. Although I was considering retirement I loved my job and was considered an expert in my field. It soon became obvious that I couldn't do it safely and with the quality required. I retired late in 2020.

This is not a "poor me" post. I'm doing ok, no financial worries and I still walk ok. I still read posts almost every day. I do miss the long detailed threads about the game that were generally in a better spirit than now. I miss the engagement I once had, but those damn priorities.....

QQ, if you don't mind. Are there any assistive technologies that help you use your keyboard and mouse? My dad recently had neck surgery for a severely compressed nerve and while it addressed most of his symptoms, he still has pretty bad tremors in his right hand when he uses a mouse. He's been looking at software called "Steady Mouse."

[Brad K]

Page three of this forum, first 20 threads have 132 replies.

Page three same forum in OOTP 17 first 20 threads have 109 replies.

[Brad K]

Originally Posted by thehef

True. Although my point about the historical forums wasn't criticism, but just observation that the reason for less discussion - overall, if not at the moment - about settings, workarounds, etc., has been the progress that OOTP has made on the historical side. Many things we just don't need to talk about anymore...

And I say this from the perspective that I don't share the overall dim view that some do of the state of the forums. It's certainly different than it was 8 or 10 or even 4 years ago. But it is what it is... I certainly miss reading and participating in discussions where Chuck (Spritze) was involved. No doubt about that!

I think the reason the threads on historical saves are in the historical forum is because they're generally not attempts at dynasties so they don't belong in that forum, and they're not fictional, so that leaves the historical forum.

[Cole]

Originally Posted by jimmysthebestcop

2 cool features I have not seen elsewhere deployed like this are players mood for singing and resigning contracts. And player skill traits. These are on field skills like power pitcher , work horse pitcher, good eye etc.

Unless I'm missing something in how it actually works (I've looked briefly at the Zen games but haven't actually played them to any great length yet), isn't everything you describe in OOTP also?

Players either do or don't want to sign or re-sign with certain teams, depending on a number of factors including their own personalities and moods, etc. And player skill traits, sounds like a more gimmicky version of what already exists in terms of ratings/player types in OOTP, no?

[MathBandit]

Originally Posted by Cole

Unless I'm missing something in how it actually works (I've looked briefly at the Zen games but haven't actually played them to any great length yet), isn't everything you describe in OOTP also?

Players either do or don't want to sign or re-sign with certain teams, depending on a number of factors including their own personalities and moods, etc. And player skill traits, sounds like a more gimmicky version of what already exists in terms of ratings/player types in OOTP, no?

ZenGM is a fun gimmicky browser game that explicitly disregards realism in favour of being a fun gimmicky browser game. Anyone comparing it to OOTP in any meaningful way is being pretty disingenuous.

[jimmysthebestcop]

Originally Posted by MathBandit

ZenGM is a fun gimmicky browser game that explicitly disregards realism in favour of being a fun gimmicky browser game. Anyone comparing it to OOTP in any meaningful way is being pretty disingenuous.

I don't think I would categorize it as disregarding realism. It's based on the MLB but it isn't a replica or close to a replica. It takes the baseball mogul approach to MLB/baseball.

It takes a more simplistic approach but I dont think it lacks realistic simulations, stats, ratings, or finances. It is far from arcadey. I don't think the only qualification for realism is official MLB clone.

Out of baseball there are plenty of sim management games. The point of my posts is to give the Colonel options if he is burnt out on OOTP

It honestly might have better finances and trade logic than ootp. The sim speed certainly cannot be beat. Sure it's more simplistic and less all encompassing. No minors or stadiums or licenses etc.

But it is also a tighter prigramy, has real difficulty settings and extended challenge modes for further difficulty.

There is a lot of overlap between zengm, baseball mogul and ootp. Ootp diverges because of its complexity, licenses and sandbox. The question comes down to what each user wants. If you want the ultimate baseball sandbox it's ootp. If you want to manage the action it's ootp. But if you crave other things fun, entertainment, speed, and difficulty then it might be zengm or even mogul.

Ootp might be the only MLB sim.in town but there are more baseball games. Even the astonishing sports games get a lot of love online. Mostly mobile but I think baseball and basketball have computer PC versions. I haven't played them myself but only heard good things about them.

[MathBandit]

Originally Posted by jimmysthebestcop

I don't think I would categorize it as disregarding realism. It's based on the MLB but it isn't a replica or close to a replica. It takes the baseball mogul approach to MLB/baseball.

It takes a more simplistic approach but I dont think it lacks realistic simulations, stats, ratings, or finances. It is far from arcadey. I don't think the only qualification for realism is official MLB clone.

Out of baseball there are plenty of sim management games. The point of my posts is to give the Colonel options if he is burnt out on OOTP

It honestly might have better finances and trade logic than ootp. The sim speed certainly cannot be beat. Sure it's more simplistic and less all encompassing. No minors or stadiums or licenses etc.

But it is also a tighter prigramy, has real difficulty settings and extended challenge modes for further difficulty.

There is a lot of overlap between zengm, baseball mogul and ootp. Ootp diverges because of its complexity, licenses and sandbox. The question comes down to what each user wants. If you want the ultimate baseball sandbox it's ootp. If you want to manage the action it's ootp. But if you crave other things fun, entertainment, speed, and difficulty then it might be zengm or even mogul.

Ootp might be the only MLB sim.in town but there are more baseball games. Even the astonishing sports games get a lot of love online. Mostly mobile but I think baseball and basketball have computer PC versions. I haven't played them myself but only heard good things about them.

I've never played it, just going off of their own FAQ:

If I give a player more playing time, will he improve faster?
No. I'm not convinced that playing time really matters for player development. [...] ZenGM Baseball is a video game. Its primary purpose is to be fun, not to be realistic.

Why are contracts in ZenGM Baseball so simple?
Contracts in ZenGM Baseball are indeed quite simple. They pay the same amount every season, they are all fully guaranteed with no player/team options, there are no restricted free agents [...] That's certainly unrealistic. I completely understand people who wish that every little contract rule from the real world was included. But I am wary of making the contract system too complicated. Sometimes there is a tradeoff between complexity and fun

[jimmysthebestcop]

You never played it? Come on how could you discuss it then?

Again it depends how you define realistic. Realistic as in MLB then no. Realistic as in terms of results as opposed to say aracedy then yes.

But honestly MLB, realistic, arcadey all comes second to entertainment for me.

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by MathBandit

I've never played it, just going off of their own FAQ:

If I give a player more playing time, will he improve faster?
No. I'm not convinced that playing time really matters for player development. [...] ZenGM Baseball is a video game. Its primary purpose is to be fun, not to be realistic.

Why are contracts in ZenGM Baseball so simple?
Contracts in ZenGM Baseball are indeed quite simple. They pay the same amount every season, they are all fully guaranteed with no player/team options, there are no restricted free agents [...] That's certainly unrealistic. I completely understand people who wish that every little contract rule from the real world was included. But I am wary of making the contract system too complicated. Sometimes there is a tradeoff between complexity and fun

I'm not sure what dude's deal is TBH but there is very little in straight-up baseball terms that really and truly competes with OOTP in terms of the GM side of things. I think the closest you get is Baseball Mogul and it's just not anywhere near the same level. It was a few steps behind 10-15 years ago and quite frankly OOTPdev is much, much bigger than Mogul (which is I think a one-man operation) and it's fallen way behind. If for some reason one refused to associate oneself with OOTP, I guess Mogul's the game you'd go for. Puresim is also out there somewhere but that game hasn't been updated, period, in like 20 years.

If you're into other basebally things, if not GM sims then single-season replays, Diamond Mind Baseball and Strat-O-Matic both put out very good games which, TBH, are probably a tick better than OOTP in what they do. Action! PC Baseball also does work in this regard; I've never played it but I have played their basketball and football games extensively so I'm sure Dave Koch puts out a good baseball product as well. Like I said, there is no GM mode to those games though. You buy a season, you play that season, and when you're done you buy another season and play it.

[Rain King]

Originally Posted by Syd Thrift

I'm not sure what dude's deal is TBH but there is very little in straight-up baseball terms that really and truly competes with OOTP in terms of the GM side of things. I think the closest you get is Baseball Mogul and it's just not anywhere near the same level. It was a few steps behind 10-15 years ago and quite frankly OOTPdev is much, much bigger than Mogul (which is I think a one-man operation) and it's fallen way behind. If for some reason one refused to associate oneself with OOTP, I guess Mogul's the game you'd go for. Puresim is also out there somewhere but that game hasn't been updated, period, in like 20 years.

If you're into other basebally things, if not GM sims then single-season replays, Diamond Mind Baseball and Strat-O-Matic both put out very good games which, TBH, are probably a tick better than OOTP in what they do. Action! PC Baseball also does work in this regard; I've never played it but I have played their basketball and football games extensively so I'm sure Dave Koch puts out a good baseball product as well. Like I said, there is no GM mode to those games though. You buy a season, you play that season, and when you're done you buy another season and play it.

An interesting development is that Clay Dreslough, the guy behind Baseball Mogul, has recently also created a Card & Dice game that is arguably the best out there (although this is kind of a booming industry right now as far as the number of quality games available).

http://seasonticketbaseball.com/

[MathBandit]

Originally Posted by jimmysthebestcop

You never played it? Come on how could you discuss it then?

Again it depends how you define realistic. Realistic as in MLB then no. Realistic as in terms of results as opposed to say aracedy then yes.

But honestly MLB, realistic, arcadey all comes second to entertainment for me.

You've apparently never played any edition of OOTP since OOTP18 based on your many comments about playing the same game for 6 years, but you certainly have a lot to say about OOTP23.

Also, again, because I have the ability to read their FAQ where the dev says he doesn't want realism, he wants a fun video game.

[jimmysthebestcop]

Originally Posted by MathBandit

You've apparently never played any edition of OOTP since OOTP18 based on your many comments about playing the same game for 6 years, but you certainly have a lot to say about OOTP23.

Also, again, because I have the ability to read their FAQ where the dev says he doesn't want realism, he wants a fun video game.

You really rehasing that. Get a new story.

[MathBandit]

A new story from being bold enough to call a game unrealistic, when the dev of the game says "[it] is a video game. Its primary purpose is to be fun, not to be realistic", and that the financial model is "indeed quite simple" and "certainly unrealistic" because "there is a tradeoff between complexity and fun"?

Yes, how dare I comment that a game like that is comparable to OOTP in the same way that Mario Kart is a competitor for F1 Manager 2022.

[jimmysthebestcop]

Originally Posted by MathBandit

A new story from being bold enough to call a game unrealistic, when the dev of the game says "[it] is a video game. Its primary purpose is to be fun, not to be realistic", and that the financial model is "indeed quite simple" and "certainly unrealistic" because "there is a tradeoff between complexity and fun"?

Yes, how dare I comment that a game like that is comparable to OOTP in the same way that Mario Kart is a competitor for F1 Manager 2022.

Reading comprehension bro it escapes you. The rehashing story is the one where talk about me buying the same version of ootp. That's what I quoted.

Way to deflect

[MathBandit]

Originally Posted by jimmysthebestcop

Reading comprehension bro it escapes you. The rehashing story is the one where talk about me buying the same version of ootp. That's what I quoted.

Way to deflect

You've been very vocal about having not played any games with changes since OOTP18. I find it odd, but who am I to judge you for re-buying the same game every year.

[jimmysthebestcop]

Originally Posted by MathBandit

You've been very vocal about having not played any games with changes since OOTP18. I find it odd, but who am I to judge you for re-buying the same game every year.

Again new story bro it's played out

[MathBandit]

Originally Posted by jimmysthebestcop

Again new story bro it's played out

It is. That's why most of us choose to buy a new version every year. But again, you do you.