EC Needs Computer Advice

[Eugene Church]

Originally Posted by Brad K

I drove those cars in the 90s when ABS and airbags were just coming in. The 69 models had shoulder belts and collapsable steering columns, and door guard beams showed up in 72. They had a weight advantage over newer cars. Compared to newer options I considered them acceptably safe at the time. Today, maybe not.

Sorry to get off-topic and sorry for the digression.

EC is going to preach a little bit high up on my bully pulpit... here's some words of wisdom from an old codger for you young 'uns.

Live modestly and save.

Have only 1 or 2 credit cards... but pay them off at the end of each month... NEVER PAY INTEREST... if you can't pay for it at the end of the month... DON'T BUY IT !

Of course buying a car and a house are exceptions to this rule... but get a modest car and a modest house... and drive the car 10 years or so... and stay in the modest house... no need to get a 2000 to 4000 square foot house.

One of the ways my wife reached the financial security that we have today is because we didn't take expensive vacations every year... we lived in a modest $55,000 for 25 years (1200 square feet)... we would buy a small Toyota Corolla and drive it 10 or 15 years, then buy a new one... this started in 1971... after 20 years of driving the small cars, we decided to splurge and get a midsize 1994 Camry... then a 2003 Camry... the 1994 at 175,000 miles started to cost up money to maintain it... same thing happened in 2017 at 200,000 miles on the 2003... when we bought a new Camry... we just didn't buy a new car every 3, 4, 5 years like many people do... in the late 1980s my wife began to save for a new car... we paid down $6000 down on the 1994... also paid $12,000 down for the 2003 and paid $20,000 cash for the 2017.

Oh, yes, I must say part of our financial success is we never had children... I know children are a blessing from God and I'm glad that all of you got happiness from them... but it just wasn't for my wife and me... we both said we didn't want to have kids when we first started dating... could be we came from broken homes that greatly influenced us in our decision.

We have never regretted our decision.

[Eugene Church]

Just got some good news... my old computer guy, who had semi-retired from computer building... I had asked for his advice on this new computer and he volunteered to help me... he is going to do the research for me and recommend a PC that will probably be less expensive and will do the job for me... and be able to handle future improvements to OOTP for the next 5 years.

He has built my last 3 computers... they all worked well for the last 15 years.

I think he will get a combination SSD and spin drive like many of you have suggested... he is frugal, but he will get me a good, solid, well-built and advanced computer that should last me a few years with really good performance.

Will let you know what he comes up with.

[NoOne]

HDD have what's called SMART (acronym.. google, lol). A freeware program like CrystalDiskInfo (link below) can show you if your drive is failing. Some are worse than others. C4 or C5 are likely impending doom, for example.

A failing drive may go into "PIM mode" which just means it's going REALLY slow to ensure proper error correction due to various SMART reported problems. Probably 1% of normal speed, or 1mB/s. You would notice this all over from time to boot up to any program loading. On surface, sounds like you have a dying hdd. do check, though. Once things load into RAM, it would operate "normally". the intial loading is where it'll slow down. (hdd/ssd are very literally storage only, no work is done there. that happens after loaded into RAM) so, you can use this concept to further determine if it is your drive or something else causing the slowdown.

Some bad sectors happen that don't indicate impending doom. may need to reinstall game if one of those sectors took a dump while containing data for ootp. Take a peak at hours of use in the freeware app (link below). I've had some fail as fast as 30k hours and others approaching 50k with no problem.

https://crystalmark.info/en/ --- Freeware... tiny and simple app. it's possible your computer came with something similar.. windows may even have it buried somewhere.

If you buy a new pc...

Definitely don't hesitate to get an SSD. i have one of the older ones that's not as robust as the new ones and it's fine 7 years deep. About 1/4th of supposed TB of writes it was rated for -- again any newer product is even more robust than my old crucial 256gb mx100. Makes pagefile work better too.

The 2nd PC listed might give you a few extra years of suitable simulation speed, and therefore longevity of PC and potentially lower cost per year of ownership. OotP is the most resource intensive things you do. This will determine how long the PC lasts. The requirements are not high, so it should last a long while.

It also has a bit more cushion for RAM. 8gb is fine today, but i'd wager windows 10 + ootp + a media player is pushing 6-7gb? You don't want to be using 100% of your physical RAM. It'll function better with a little cushion, which may be needed "soon."

Win 10 is a good reason.. how many years will the be supporting windows 7 with security updates? i'm not sure... have to google it. old pcs often lack some security feature to install win 10.

as far as brand... if you don't build it yourself, and it's not some alienware or similarly expensive brand... flip a coin. hp/dell kinda meh products, but plenty good enough for your uses. They use cheaper parts. no way around it.

The third one is only an i5, but newer generation. i'd look that up on some benchmark sites to get a better idea of quality difference. As far as the onboard graphics being a higher number... it is still "onboard" graphics, meaning it;s not going to make much of a difference. if OotP ever requires more, all three of these options would likely need an upgrade within same timeframe. Adding a gpu is very simple and can be a small cost relative to your uses, if ever needed in firt place

I would want to spot check difference of ddr3 vs ddr4 on usebenchmark.. make all other parts equal. i doubt it's worth +$300 from entry option. Plus, only 8gb.. this is going to be aproblem within 5 years i bet. (it's finally coming.. 8gb has been plenty for a long, long time when it comes to PC's... this time it is happening soon.)

Building one is easy nowadays. most things can only fit into 1 spot. could spend that same 500-600 and get more machine for your dollar. If you spent 800-900 you'd be building a 3d gaming pc that would put the $920 option 3 to shame... utter shame... ... douse it with kerosene and watch it melt.

https://www.userbenchmark.com/ -- real world comparison of a ton of parts.. can "virtually" build any 2 pc you are looking at and compare real world results. make a more informed decision about what your additional investment provides. Or, compare parts to build your own.

CPU and RAM always get the glitz, but most important part is the MOBO (motherboard). They are not all created equally. Often times the pre-built stuff advertises parts and specs connected to a mobo that is a bottleneck. This is where they often cut costs on the pre-built stuff.. some custom knock-down version of a mobo you can buy on market mass produced for dell or hp et al.. You wouldn't need a super fancy one, but even a entry or midlevel will likely outperform anything you find in a dell or hp... again, could keep it to similar cost too. win-win

Youtube vids abound... a friend who can do it?.. really doesn't take much technical skill nor knowledge nowadays. no jumpers to set. all plug-n-play.. no reasonable way you can crosswire something....just a thought.

Originally Posted by Eugene Church

I need your advice... I am computer illiterate... have very little knowledge of computers.

Hope it is OK to post this here... moderators, delete it if you need to.

When I opened the game today... it first crashed... I followed the instructions on the screen and it came on, but it took several minutes to open and then would take a minute to change each screen.

I decided the best thing to do was shut it down and buy a new computer... I know nothing about computers other than an Intel i3 processor is not as good as an i5 or i7... I think I need at least 512 GB of hard drive... at least 4 GB RAM... currently have an Intel i5 processor, 1 TB of hard drive and 8 GB of RAM.

Should I get Solid State Drive?

I could however go on the OOTP website and navigate OK... the internet seemed to be OK once I go on it.

Looks like I need a new computer... my computer is processing very slowly... takes 10 minutes to boot up... from the desktop to the internet takes 30 seconds... once I get on the internet, it is fine.

After a game crash, OOTP took 2-3 minutes to load... and 30 seconds to load the next screen... I just shut it down and decided to get a new computer.

All I do on the computer is search the internet, store my music library of 7500 mp3 files and play OOTP... nothing else.

Do I need a $500 computer or and $800 computer?... prefer desktop PC because they can be upgraded easier that the All-in-One PC.

Should I buy a Dell or HP PC for $500 or should I go higher around 800$ with better processors or graphics card?... my past 3 computers were built by a IT guy and they worked well, but he doesn't do repairs anymore... they cost around $700.

Should I purchase the Dell or HP extended warranties and for how long... 1 year, 2 year or 3 year... or not at all?

All I do is surf the internet and play OOTP.
Do I need a good graphics card?.
Intel or AMD processor?
Dell or HP?

Here are 3 PC that I have looked at:

Inspiron Desktop
Inspiron Desktop
4.0 (1633)
Est. Value $684.98 Est. Value is Dell’s estimate of product value based on industry data, including the prices at which third-party retailers have offered or valued the same or comparable products, in its most recent survey of major online and/or off-line retailers. Third-party retailer data may not be based on actual sales.
Dell Price $619.99
Save $64.99 (9%)
FREE Shipping
10th Gen Intel® Core™ i5-10400 processor
Windows 11 Home
Intel® UHD Graphics 630 with shared graphics memory
512GB M.2 PCIe NVMe Solid State Drive
8GB, 8Gx1, DDR4, 2666MHz

Inspiron Desktop PC
$779.99
Save $74.99 (9%)
FREE Shipping
10th Gen Intel® Core™ i7-10700 processor
Windows 11 Home
Intel® UHD Graphics 630 with shared graphics memory
512GB M.2 PCIe NVMe Solid State Drive
12GB, 8Gx1 + 4Gx1, DDR4, 2933MHz


XPS 8950
New XPS Desktop
$919.99
Free Shipping
12th Gen Intel® Core™ i5-12600K processor
Windows 11 Home
Intel® UHD Graphics 770 with shared graphics memory
8GB DDR5, 1x8GB, at 4400MHz; up to 128GB
1TB 7200RPM SATA 6Gb/s

Hope you can help me with your advice.

Happy New Year !

[Brad K]

Originally Posted by Eugene Church

I know children are a blessing from God and I'm glad that all of you got happiness from them...

Children are a pain in the butt. However parent's brains are wired so that once the kids are grown the parents forget all the crap and only remember the fun stuff. And then they tell their children that children are a joy and have plenty. Without this self deception humans wouldn't last long.

[Brad K]

Originally Posted by Eugene Church

Just got some good news... my old computer guy, who had semi-retired from computer building... I had asked for his advice on this new computer and he volunteered to help me... he is going to do the research for me and recommend a PC that will probably be less expensive and will do the job for me... and be able to handle future improvements to OOTP for the next 5 years.

He has built my last 3 computers... they all worked well for the last 15 years.

I think he will get a combination SSD and spin drive like many of you have suggested... he is frugal, but he will get me a good, solid, well-built and advanced computer that should last me a few years with really good performance.

Will let you know what he comes up with.

Great news EC.

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by Brad K

Children are a pain in the butt. However parent's brains are wired so that once the kids are grown the parents forget all the crap and only remember the fun stuff. And then they tell their children that children are a joy and have plenty. Without this self deception humans wouldn't last long.

Your mileage is definitely different than mine.

[Reed]

Originally Posted by Brad K

Children are a pain in the butt. However parent's brains are wired so that once the kids are grown the parents forget all the crap and only remember the fun stuff. And then they tell their children that children are a joy and have plenty. Without this self deception humans wouldn't last long.

I guess it all depends. My wife has cancer and her memory is not like it use to be. My son lives 2 miles away and he has us come over once a week for dinner and just to visit. One of my daughters lives 6 miles a week and she takes my wife to some of her appointments to give me a break. My daughter that lives 4 states away calls once a week just to see how things are going.
But kids certainly aren’t for everyone, especially if you aren’t going to invest time in them. When they were small I was their softball and soccer coach and my wife read to them and we both helped them with schoolwork, etc.. But way to many have kids that shouldn’t be having them IMO.

[Brad K]

Originally Posted by Sweed

Your mileage is definitely different than mine.

My kids are wonderful! (I've forgotten the troubles. ) The only person I've know with perfect kids is my brother. Oh wait, there was the problem with the son procrastinating about everything... LOL

[Eugene Church]

Reed, Sweed, Brad K and NoOne... sounds like a law firm.
Sorry, guys... I already have a pretty good law firm: Dewey, Cheatum and Howe.

Thanks for your help... you guys helped me get a good deal on a pretty fair computer, I think... but, more so, something my old reliable gaming computer guy is happy with.

I haggled with HP and Dell and saved $67 on the basic price... both wanted $1349 at first... HP came down to $1282... so I bought it.

My frugal computer friend redesigned and lowered the specs and saved me over $340 off of the highest priced unit that I priced and was going to order until he told me he would help me.

Here is what I am getting:

HP Pavilion Gaming Desktop
TG01-2285T

Operating system
Windows 11 Home
Processor
Intel® Core™ i7-11700 (2.5 GHz base frequency, up to 4.9 GHz with Intel® Turbo Boost Technology, 16 MB L3 cache, 8 cores)[6,7]
Memory
16 GB DDR4-2933 MHz RAM (2 x 8 GB)
Graphics
Integrated: Intel® UHD Graphics 750
Discrete: NVIDIA® GeForce RTX™ 3060 (12 GB GDDR6 dedicated)
Storage
256 GB PCIe® NVMe™ M.2 SSD
Video connector
1 HDMI; 3 DisplayPort™
Wireless technology
Realtek RTL8822CE 802.11a/b/g/n/ac (2x2) Wi-Fi® and Bluetooth® 5 combo
Memory slots
2 DIMM
Secondary storage
2 TB 7200 rpm SATA HDD
Memory card device
HP 3-in-1 memory card reader
Network interface
Integrated 10/100/1000 GbE LAN
Power supply
500 W Gold efficiency power supply

[Eugene Church]

Special thanks to NoOne for that wonderfully detailed advice... you taught me a lot.
Do you think EC could start building gaming computers for the OOTP Community?

Sorry, NO WAY... I know just enough about computers to be dangerous.

I want to thank all of you for your help and advice... and patience, too... this has been quite a trip the last week or two.
Very much appreciate each and everyone of you.
All of you are a blessing to me... a Godsend.

May each of you be blessed by our Creator.

[Reed]

You did good. I think you will be very happy with it for a long time.

[Hammercraft]

Originally Posted by Eugene Church

Processor
Intel® Core™ i7-11700 (2.5 GHz base frequency, up to 4.9 GHz with Intel® Turbo Boost Technology, 16 MB L3 cache, 8 cores)[6,7]
Memory
16 GB DDR4-2933 MHz RAM (2 x 8 GB)

In my experience OOTP performs better almost solely based on processor quality, with RAM a secondary concern. You won't be disappointed with this choice.

[Eugene Church]

Originally Posted by Hammercraft

In my experience OOTP performs better almost solely based on processor quality, with RAM a secondary concern. You won't be disappointed with this choice.

Thanks for the reply... experience is the best teacher.

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by Hammercraft

In my experience OOTP performs better almost solely based on processor quality, with RAM a secondary concern. You won't be disappointed with this choice.

Okay, that’s true, but since EC is also starting a new family, he should also endeavor to get enough RAM to use Microsoft Word when those kids get into kindergarten in 5-6 years.

[Eugene Church]

Originally Posted by Syd Thrift

Okay, that’s true, but since EC is also starting a new family, he should also endeavor to get enough RAM to use Microsoft Word when those kids get into kindergarten in 5-6 years.

EC will certainly seek help from all you well-experienced fathers at that time... I will be 87-88 at that time and will need lots of help in raising my little rascals.

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by Eugene Church

EC will certainly seek help from all you well-experienced fathers at that time... I will be 87-88 at that time and will need lots of help in raising my little rascals.

Tony Randall had his first child when he was 77!

[Eugene Church]

Originally Posted by Syd Thrift

Tony Randall had his first child when he was 77!

Syd, now you've got me motivated and excited.

Just wait until next year... there may be more than just OOTP24 springing into the world.

Maybe I can wine and dine my wife and get lucky... who knows, maybe I am as good ONCE as I ever was.

[Eugene Church]

Thanks to all y' all, EC enjoying my new HP computer.
Just played my first games tonight.

It is so fast... My, Oh, My... it is so nice... I really think the animation has gotten smoother and is not as choppy as it was... am I just imagining it's better?
The double plays look like Tinker tot Evers to Chance are playing again... smooth as glass.

Would a much better graphics card smooth out the animation?

Anyway, I love it... Thanks a bunch to all y' all... couldn't have done it without your help and advice.

Just one final question for all y 'all.

What should I name my first child?.

[Syd Thrift]

Ootpy

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by Eugene Church

Thanks to all y' all, EC enjoying my new HP computer.
Just played my first games tonight.

It is so fast... My, Oh, My... it is so nice... I really think the animation has gotten smoother and is not as choppy as it was... am I just imagining it's better?

Would a much better graphics card smooth out the animation?

Anyway, I love it... Thanks a bunch to all y' all... couldn't have done it without your help and advice.

Just one final question for all y 'all.

What should I name my first child?.

Awesome