View from a LONG Time customer

[mickey7]

I purchased the original DOS version of OOTP and every single yearly through OOTP 2020, as well as FHM 4 and FHM 6 and ITP and your old boxing game (twice). When this company started it was the MOST customer oriented game company I had ever seen----no longer true !!! I stuck with this company through it's struggles with thing s like OOTP 6 and the problems that have never been addressed like trade AI, graphics issues ever since the introduction of facegen and many others. But OOTP 2019 was not much different than 18 and 20 almost identical to 19----it has become obvious that the company has succumbed to the almighty dollar (or Mark) and only gives a damn about the revenue from Perfect Team (horrible game, total sell out) OOTP is going by the wayside through disinterest by the developer. That coupled with the recent total betrayal of the customer base in regards to the Football game has forced my decision to NOT purchase OOTP 21 or any more of your products !!!

[Westheim]

Originally Posted by mickey7

it has become obvious that the company has succumbed to the almighty dollar (or Mark)

It's Euros now.

[HerbD]

What happened with the football game? I haven't seen that.

[quillenl]

Originally Posted by HerbD

What happened with the football game? I haven't seen that.

Topic was locked... and this one will be too if we chat about it too much.

Short version... it did not work out and is off the table.

That said, to the OPs point...

The developers have assured us no resources are being pulled away from the core game and no features are being lost. Despite that I miss...
- Signatures I could get by playing Challenge Mode. I can only get a signature in Perfect Team now.
- A Challenge Mode "play history" I could share via the web website interface and Leaderboards.
-The Spritze High School database, which while not official, may as well have been which allowed Random Debut play with real players coming in automatically at Minor League appropriate ages and stats. Broken when new attributes were added to the database.
- Working Ghost Players making minor leagues with Historical Databases result in reasonable stats (players get over fatigued now causing grossly inflated offensive numbers unless you can field a Minor League Pitching Staff of 11+ real players).

It seems small but I used to play exclusively Spritze database as I loved that style. With version 20 I could not get it to work quite right and shifted my play to primarily challenge mode. A few months into 21, and no answers to questions about Challenge Mode being fixed... I stopped playing that mode. Now I am playing the Core Game with my fingers crossed (half joking but it has not been a good track record for what I have played the game for).

I don't think they have sold out at all, and I honestly believe they think the core game is benefitting. In many ways it is (3D animations probably being one, and Live rosters being another)... it just happens that some of us have been playing in a way that we see where it is not aging well the last 3 releases. Clearly the OP amongst those folks

[mickey7]

quillenl, I assume that the developers that are assuring us that no resources are being pulled away from the base game are the SAME DEVELOPERS that spent the last 6 years assuring us that they would produce a football game for us----right ???? Maybe you need to take a look at what their assurances mean ????

[stevem810]

You know, the company doesn't owe us anything. It's theirs to do as they wish, and to invest in what can sustain the overall health and solvency of the company.

It's easy to criticize P.T. (I don't care for it), but a lot of people are playing it so it resonates with users. And, sometimes initiatives like the football just don't work out. You turn the page and move on.

I think OOTP does an outstanding job of providing entertainment. When I look at what they do right, and weigh it against their shortcomings, no contest.

[TheMaus2]

It's also within your rights to not buy the new OOTP game! I'm sure you refusing to give them your $40 will sway them into putting $40,000 into resources for FOF9 again...

[SerbianEagle]

Originally Posted by mickey7

I purchased the original DOS version of OOTP and every single yearly through OOTP 2020, as well as FHM 4 and FHM 6 and ITP and your old boxing game (twice). When this company started it was the MOST customer oriented game company I had ever seen----no longer true !!! I stuck with this company through it's struggles with thing s like OOTP 6 and the problems that have never been addressed like trade AI, graphics issues ever since the introduction of facegen and many others. But OOTP 2019 was not much different than 18 and 20 almost identical to 19----it has become obvious that the company has succumbed to the almighty dollar (or Mark) and only gives a damn about the revenue from Perfect Team (horrible game, total sell out) OOTP is going by the wayside through disinterest by the developer. That coupled with the recent total betrayal of the customer base in regards to the Football game has forced my decision to NOT purchase OOTP 21 or any more of your products !!!

I've also owned every single version of the OOTP game, plus all other releases they had.

I am sorry, but its hard to take your post seriously. Have you ever been involved in business and/or ran a company of your own? Based on this post, I'll say probably not.

How do you think companies survive? On clean air? No, on revenue or as you call it "the mighty dollar". It astounds me how people think that others should minimize their profit for our own enjoyment because somehow we are entitled to it. Why should Markus work for free, or why should he minimize his profits?

Unless you work for free, then you too have succumbed to the might dollar or euro, depending on where you are. I don't think you work for free because you wouldn't have internet access and definitely would not have a means of purchasing this game.

Bottom line, whether you want to buy games or not is your call. What is not your call is how the company is ran. That privilege belongs to Markus.

I don't know Markus, but I am a business owner and its sickening how many people have an overall sense of entitlement and treat business owners as their possessions.

[CBeisbol]

Originally Posted by TheMaus2

It's also within your rights to not buy the new OOTP game! I'm sure you refusing to give them your $40 will sway them into putting $40,000 into resources for FOF9 again...

Maybe not one, but if enough do...

Originally Posted by SerbianEagle

I am sorry, but its hard to take your post seriously. Have you ever been involved in business and/or ran a company of your own? Based on this post, I'll say probably not.

You sound like the type of business owner that I'd try to avoid giving my money even if I liked the product.

Because a customer that tells you why they aren't satisfied is an opportunity to understand and improve. Much better than just losing customers and then trying to figure out why. I'll take customers who tell me what their issues are so I have a chance to decide whether or not I should address them.

If customers aren't happy about something, why wouldn't you want to know?

Why don't you post the name of your business so I can make sure that I don't accidentally patronize it.

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by mickey7

quillenl, I assume that the developers that are assuring us that no resources are being pulled away from the base game are the SAME DEVELOPERS that spent the last 6 years assuring us that they would produce a football game for us----right ???? Maybe you need to take a look at what their assurances mean ????

No, it’s literally not the SAME DEVELOPERS. They brought in a DIFFERENT DEVELOPER and he wasn’t able to get the game together in enough time. The SAME DEVELOPERS did have their resources stretched, but not by PT, which also uses DIFFERENT DEVELOPERS, but OOTPGo, which has features people have been asking for (chiefly the ability to play the game on other media besides a desktop or laptop) for several versions now.

[SerbianEagle]

Originally Posted by CBeisbol

Maybe not one, but if enough do...



You sound like the type of business owner that I'd try to avoid giving my money even if I liked the product.

Because a customer that tells you why they aren't satisfied is an opportunity to understand and improve. Much better than just losing customers and then trying to figure out why. I'll take customers who tell me what their issues are so I have a chance to decide whether or not I should address them.

If customers aren't happy about something, why wouldn't you want to know?

Why don't you post the name of your business so I can make sure that I don't accidentally patronize it.

Re-read my post.

[CBeisbol]

Originally Posted by SerbianEagle

Re-read my post.

No idea what you think I missed.
I stand by my original post

Again, can you please inform me of the name of your business.
I don't want to support you

[DJ_Jak_32]

Originally Posted by CBeisbol

No idea what you think I missed.
I stand by my original post

Again, can you please inform me of the name of your business.
I don't want to support you

You clearly did not understand what he said, and thankfully are not a business owner either......typical CBeisbol, another unnecessary post by you and are just here to flex his keyboard muscles.

Let me explain it to you.....As a business owner also, you do want and appreciate the customer feedback, something the OP did to a point. He gave his reasons why he was unhappy, but like every entitled customer, used the threat of not every buying another product.....yes it is his right, but when you hear that as the person receiving the criticism, that usually shuts out anything more you have to say.

If we gave in or did everything that a small percentage of customers that complain wanted, we would be out of business. You can never make everyone happy, but if you are going to complain and make demands, make sure you have all the facts (something the OP does not have).

Either way, I agree with some of what the OP said, I also have purchased every version going back to the DOS version and yes some things have been neglected for other new features, they are a small shop of 3 or 4 developers and are people with families and social lives and cannot spend 24/7 working on a game.

[CBeisbol]

Originally Posted by DJ_Jak_32

Let me explain it to you....As a business owner also...when you hear that as the person receiving the criticism, that usually shuts out anything more you have to say.

Don't project your personal faults on to me

You ...thankfully are not a business owner either......

Citation requested

If we gave in or did everything that a small percentage of customers that complain wanted, we would be out of business.

Thank you for explaining something to me that I explicitly addressed

Originally Posted by CBeisbol

I'll take customers who tell me what their issues are so I have a chance to decide whether or not I should address them.

[DJ_Jak_32]

Originally Posted by CBeisbol

Citation requested

Don't need one, based on your posts on here, you wouldn't handle criticism well, you would attack the customer how you attack people on here....oh wait, forgot you're just a keyboard warrior.

Originally Posted by CBeisbol

Thank you for explaining something to me that I explicitly addressed

No actually you pretty much said the exact same thing I said......

Either way, you made another unnecessary and arrogant comment to someone like you usually do to make yourself feel better....we have been over this, you are nothing but a keyboard warrior who likes to come on here and say rude and arrogant comments to people who you do not agree with....or to try and push your social and political agenda (subtly) on a forum that has nothing to do with either. Stay in the Off-Topic section if you want to do that.....

[CBeisbol]

Originally Posted by DJ_Jak_32

Don't need one,

Citation requested

based on your posts on here, you wouldn't handle criticism well, you would attack the customer how you attack people on here....oh wait, forgot you're just a keyboard warrior.

I've only ever had one disgruntled customer threaten to shoot me

No actually you pretty much said the exact same thing I said......

No
You said the exact same thing I said

Either way, you made another unnecessary and arrogant comment to someone like you usually do to make yourself feel better....we have been over this, you are nothing but a keyboard warrior who likes to come on here and say rude and arrogant comments to people who you do not agree with....or to try and push your social and political agenda (subtly) on a forum that has nothing to do with either. Stay in the Off-Topic section if you want to do that.....

Genuine curiosity
Why don't you call out SerbianEagle for the same thing?

Here's the rude, unnecessary and arrogant comment

Originally Posted by SerbianEagle

I am sorry, but its hard to take your post seriously. Have you ever been involved in business and/or ran a company of your own? Based on this post, I'll say probably not.

And the social agenda

its sickening how many people have an overall sense of entitlement and treat business owners as their possessions.

Any other reason than that you agree with him?

[mickey7]

Serbian Eagle let's just say I'd be happy to compare my business successes over the last 45 years to yours without fear !!!!!