New Pitching Model

[oman19]

"A revamped pitching model that more accurately reflects pitching in the real world, where close to 90% of pitchers are typically drafted as starters and later become relievers for various reasons. The new pitching model brings with it a host of positive changes that we'll discuss in depth in Road to Release."

First I've heard of this!!!!!!!! Make this or the expanded playoffs your first RTR article oh please oh please oh please.

I have not pre-ordered yet but between this, the expanded playoffs, and the interactive storylines. You might just get me yet.

[Markus Heinsohn]

Well, it's one of those surprises.

Seriously, it work great and finally makes the pitching model even more realistic.

Edit: Yes, we will have a RTR article about it...

[oman19]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Well, it's one of those surprises.

Seriously, it work great and finally makes the pitching model even more realistic.

Edit: Yes, we will have a RTR article about it...

What a suprise it is. Honestly sometimes it's like you and your team read my mind on what I want. These 3 things have really got my level of excitement up.

Really can't wait to hear about the pitching model. I always complain about the number of high level MR's in the draft and the league in general. Really hope this remedies that!!!!!!!!! Will you kind of tell us what to be looking for in a starter or leave it to us for trial and error. As most OOTP players know for a guy to be considered a SP he should have 3 pitches and stamina above 10 on a 1-20 scale as it stands right now.

As it is now I never notice storylines in the game. Will you now recieve a message or something asking you to make a decision?

[Markus Heinsohn]

Well, of course pitchers with three pitches of high talent are the most likely to develop into good starters. However, there may also be cases when pitchers with two great pitches and a really poor off-speed pitch 'gets it' during the minors and develops a decent offspeed pitch. In contrast you will also have pitchers whose primary offspeed pitch never develops and eventually disappears, forcing a move to the bullpen.

Other changes to the pitching system include:
- Injury has more effect on stamina now, some pitchers recover after a serious injury, others don't, forcing a move to the pen after a series of injuries (think John Smoltz).
- Shorter pitchers (< 5"11') generally get generated with lower stamina (of course there are exceptions though) and have a worse chance to develop more stamina in the future.
- The overall rating calculation (stars) for middle relievers & closers has changed, both are no longer compared to only pitchers with the same role, but rather now compared to all relief pitchers. That means you will no longer find 5-star MR that often since they are now compared to a ground which includes the closers.
- Salary demand has been recoded for middle relievers and closers, it's now much more realistic.

Regarding storylines, yes, you will get a personal message if a storyline needs feedback from you.

Regarding

[Matt Arnold]

Sweet. Although I wish you'd announced this earlier, or else I'd have pre-ordered when we got 5 bucks off. Now I'll probably be too excited by this and pay full price.

[cephasjames]

Originally Posted by UWHabs

Sweet. Although I wish you'd announced this earlier, or else I'd have pre-ordered when we got 5 bucks off. Now I'll probably be too excited by this and pay full price.

Full price is just fine, especially when you by 10 copies.

[oman19]

Marcus thank you. I love the height thing. It adds another layer of things to look at when drafting a Pitcher.

[ike121212]

I've been hoping for this kind of change ever since the move to individual pitches. I can't wait to try it. It's a true game-changer for me.


Does height really have a relationship to stam or effectiveness? Seems questionable, so I poked around a little bit. No big surprise that SABR explored the topic.


Does a Pitcher's Height Matter

"As you can see in table 1 (Starting Pitching Effectiveness), the data show no evidence of a statistically significant correlation, for starting pitchers, between height (in inches) and any of the customary measures of pitching effectiveness."

[oman19]

WIll stamina be something we will be able to see tracked in the player development or scouting reports like we do with Control, Stuff and Potential now?

Would be nice to be able to see a player took a hit on stamina and should be heading to the pen now becuase of an injury or whatever. Or vice versa where all of othe sudden someone gets a bump and maybe we should think about moving him from the pen to the rotation

Just a thought

[ike121212]

This study made me a laugh a little. Height had no impact, but fat had a significant advantage over thin.

Category R/G SO/G BB/G HR/G Survival Tall 0.07 -0.30 -0.22 0.05 0.291 Short -0.18 -0.53 -0.25 0.03 0.292 Fat -0.13 -0.44 -0.21 0.06 0.345 Thin -0.13 0.20 0.18 0.07 0.217 Overall 0.03 -0.48 -0.16 0.04 0.300

[Bluenoser]

Originally Posted by oman19

WIll stamina be something we will be able to see tracked in the player development or scouting reports like we do with Control, Stuff and Potential now?

Would be nice to be able to see a player took a hit on stamina and should be heading to the pen now becuase of an injury or whatever. Or vice versa where all of othe sudden someone gets a bump and maybe we should think about moving him from the pen to the rotation

Just a thought

Stamina is tracked already - I've seen a number of times were I get reports of increases/decreases in stamina.

I don't think we should get is a message telling us or recommending we move a guy to the pen or rotation. Think real life here, managers use stats and things like that. Watch your pitchers, if they lose stamina then you should be thinking about it and same if they gain stamina.

[kq76]

close to 90% of pitchers are typically drafted as starters and later become relievers for various reasons

Next to league associations, this is what I'm most looking forward to in OOTP13. I'm so tired of seeing so many RPs in the draft with very little chance at ever developing into SPs.

- Injury has more effect on stamina now, some pitchers recover after a serious injury, others don't, forcing a move to the pen after a series of injuries (think John Smoltz).

Nice!

- Shorter pitchers (< 5"11') generally get generated with lower stamina (of course there are exceptions though) and have a worse chance to develop more stamina in the future.

Not nice. I'm not "shorter", but I don't like that shorter people get tagged with things like this. If there was indisputable evidence to show this was warranted then okay. As comparison, I'm in the "let's have a clutch rating" camp and many people say "let's not because there's no evidence", but I'd argue that clutch is a fun personality rating that you can choose to believe has an effect or might not, but this height feature is a definite.

- The overall rating calculation (stars) for middle relievers & closers has changed, both are no longer compared to only pitchers with the same role, but rather now compared to all relief pitchers. That means you will no longer find 5-star MR that often since they are now compared to a ground which includes the closers.

That's a decent start, but I'd rather we get rid of MRs and CLs altogether and just have RPs. When I'm looking for a RP, I don't care what label they've been tagged with, I just want to filter by RP.

Why don't we have SU and MU roles? Because it'd be dumb to, just like having MRs and CLs is.

- Salary demand has been recoded for middle relievers and closers, it's now much more realistic.

I gather they'll demand more? Fair enough.

[Bluenoser]

Originally Posted by kq76

That's a decent start, but I'd rather we get rid of MRs and CLs altogether and just have RPs. When I'm looking for a RP, I don't care what label they've been tagged with, I just want to filter by RP.

I agree with this but think it should be taken a step further. Eliminate pre-determined roles altogether. No SP, MR, or CL, just a P designation.

One can look at a kids stats to see what role he played in collage/HS. One can look at # of pitches, quality of pitches, stamina, competition, etc to make a determination on where to try him at in rookie ball. As he progresses, your assesment of him also does.

This would be more realistic imo. I realize you get the odd Strasburg type who skips the minors, but those are very few and far between.

[boshk]

hopefully this fixes the problem of teams having 80% pitchers on their rosters as well. its really annoying to see a 25 man roster have 8 hitters and 17 pitchers, and then an additional 15 reserve players being all pitchers.

Originally Posted by kq76

Not nice. I'm not "shorter", but I don't like that shorter people get tagged with things like this. If there was indisputable evidence to show this was warranted then okay. As comparison, I'm in the "let's have a clutch rating" camp and many people say "let's not because there's no evidence", but I'd argue that clutch is a fun personality rating that you can choose to believe has an effect or might not, but this height feature is a definite.

i agree with the short comments, just because they are short, they are just as likely to pitch 9 innings a game 200 innings a year as someone who is 7 feet tall.

as for clutch players; there may or may not be any evidence for it, but torii hunter was baseball's anti-clutch when he played for the twins.

[turkeybird86]

Originally Posted by Bluenoser

This would be more realistic imo. I realize you get the odd Strasburg type who skips the minors, but those are very few and far between.

I think you mean Mike Leake.

[endgame]

At least one height observation: MLB Innings Pitched by Pitcher's Height

And this one for the statistically inclined- I do not number among them -that seems to lend itself to the idea that height does not essentially matter with regard to specific skills. In my quick read of what was apparent, I'm not sure the findings directly assess the idea directly of IP, however, or stamina as the game presents it, and Markus did say there were exceptions. Notice the cutoff he chose was 5'11, just like Pedro, often cited as the poster-child of the short successful starter, so maybe that benchmark isn't without some merit: http://sabr.org/research/does-pitcher-s-height-matter

[Marinersfan51]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Well, of course pitchers with three pitches of high talent are the most likely to develop into good starters. However, there may also be cases when pitchers with two great pitches and a really poor off-speed pitch 'gets it' during the minors and develops a decent offspeed pitch. In contrast you will also have pitchers whose primary offspeed pitch never develops and eventually disappears, forcing a move to the bullpen.

Other changes to the pitching system include:
- Injury has more effect on stamina now, some pitchers recover after a serious injury, others don't, forcing a move to the pen after a series of injuries (think John Smoltz).
- Shorter pitchers (< 5"11') generally get generated with lower stamina (of course there are exceptions though) and have a worse chance to develop more stamina in the future.

Its like you read my suggestion, but made it a million times better, that's why you're the developer.

[Biggio509]

Originally Posted by UWHabs

Sweet. Although I wish you'd announced this earlier, or else I'd have pre-ordered when we got 5 bucks off. Now I'll probably be too excited by this and pay full price.

You can still preorder got an email just a day or two saying you could. Pre-order hasn't ended what ended was the deadline for the drawing for prizes. Just click the pre-order link and it says you can add to cart for $39.99 still.

[Spanky]

Markus, I've been asking about this for years. Where is the real live bullpen? You the game is not much fun if the manager simply has to throw a couple of relivers in the bullpen and leave them there until needed.

It would be great if they lost stamina the longer they were warming up. This should be an easy thing to do. Without a "live bullpen" feature the game loses realism. And, as much as I love baseball and your game, I've all but lost interest in playing."

Please consider this feature now or in the near future.

Spanky

[Markus Heinsohn]

Originally Posted by Spanky

It would be great if they lost stamina the longer they were warming up. This should be an easy thing to do.

They do already!