Commish accountability tools?

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by f.montoya

Being that my proposal is only about a way of logging commish activity, your case may not be at all affected. The log could include more(or less) details showing exactly(or roughly) what the commissioner has edited(but not the values), meaning that there's but a record of commish editing showing publicly(or at least to that particular league).

Fidel,

I think your idea has a bunch of possibly problematic issues when you get into the locking and unlocking of various features. I also would think for some cases not even allowing the sim to run at all if there is no internet connection would be pretty bad for at least some commissioners.

If this is a huge issue, the simple solution would be similar to what I have to deal with at work for Auditing purposes. Every single change we make on the network is kept track of in an audit. Something similar could be done here, where a non-editable/non-deletable portion of the .dat file has an audit that keeps track of every user initiated change to the database (ie: modifying players ratings, player contracts, etc).

That way it doesn't likely break any other piece of the game or cause hurdles or issues, especially in cases where people don't even want this extra security. But the audit could be there for those that do have a desire for it.

[fhomess]

I think some of Fidel’s ideas are probably a good point to start off with when thinking about the discussion of how would one develop internal tools to OOTP that would track commissioner activities. I don’t think they all make sense in their current form, but that doesn’t mean that they wouldn’t lead to tools that would make sense. Editing an ammy draft pool before they’re drafted may not need auditing, but editing a fringe prospect into a star certainly might.

That said, count me among those that really wonders how big an issue this really is. I’m not sure I really think OOTP needs to have tools like these added to the game. I suspect that the vast majority of the online league commishes out there are on the up and up. I have no doubt that there are those who are cheating in their online leagues right now. I’ve seen it in the past, and the number of leagues that are active means that the odds are highly in the corner of some commishes not being trustworthy. To me, this type of behavior has never cast a bad light on OOTP itself. It has always cast a bad light on the individuals responsible. The reputation of OOTP doesn’t suffer. Obviously, it makes for a bad experience for those involved in the league. It could very well turn some folks off to OOTP, but I’ve not heard of that voiced. I’m also not sure what adding these tools really provides. I suppose it adds some peace of mind, but if you’re actually worried that your commish is cheating to the point where you’d want to review these types of audits, you probably ought to leave the league and join a different one. Once the suspicion of misuse is there, the seeds of a bad relationship are planted. It’s not that hard to find a league that’s been around for awhile and/or has a reputable commish. There are even a number of leagues that have commishes who don’t run a team in the league – which is generally an indication they’re not going to cheat. For those of us who’ve been around, if you see a league with some names you recognize, you can probably get a sense of the reputation of the league. For newbies, it’s a bit harder to know how to find a good league, but I don’t think it’s necessarily a good thing to advertise auditing tools in such a way that it appears that cheating is prevalent. Transparency is good, but not always good advertising.

So in short, while I don’t think the ideas are necessarily bad, I’d rather not see Markus spend time developing these tools. There are enough other improvements he can make to the user interface, in-game AI, financial model, etc, and this seems like a limited enough problem that I don’t see it as being particularly beneficial to develop.

[f.montoya]

Yeah, you guys are right. It really is a non-issue. In fact, the last time I saw one of those threads on the OOTP boards accusing a commish of cheating was about 4 years ago. Also, I've hosted hundreds of leagues over the years. One thing is for sure, commissioners put a lot of time, effort, money and love into their leagues. It really isn't logical to think that a person, giving so much of themselves in building something and watching it grow, would then think to undermine it.

That said, my previous posts were more directed at the feasibility of what was proposed in the opening post, not really the necessity. I'd suppose if there were a league with money involved, such tools/safeguards might be useful. Otherwise I agree. Markus should focus on features that are really important.

[coljesep]

This is just me personally... I'm not saying its right but.

I've run a sim league that runs on (old guys watch out) Front Page Sports 1998. Oh yeah, I said it haha. We are in year #18, and I've never owned a team.

Every online league I've joined where the commish owned a team didn't compare to the ones where the commish was just the commish. You can be the most honest person in the world as a commish but the bottom line is, if I owned a team in my own league, owners would either deal with me because they felt I was the commish and they didn't wanna tick me off OR they wouldn't deal with me because they didn't trust me.

So if you're having issues in an OOTP league where you have any doubts about a commish's actions, I'd suggest A) Quit the league and B) Shoot me a PM and I'll get ya in a league where the commish doesn't and never will own a team

[mcarlisle21]

Originally Posted by grommy

This is an even better idea in my opinion, because this keeps the commish's eyes off the ratings and data that no one else can see. I would think that even some commishes on the "up-and-up" take the occasional peek at players to see better granularity in their ratings, etc. without changing anything.

I can also say that I have NEVER taken a peek at the player editor to scout a player. Proudly running a clean league.

[Cooleyvol]

Originally Posted by grommy

I would think that even some commishes on the "up-and-up" take the occasional peek at players to see better granularity in their ratings, etc. without changing anything.

I take offense at you lumping people running leagues into one group merely b/c you, personally, have selected poorly in your online league past.

I, and many others, have been running leagues using this piece of software for many years longer than you've been a member of this forum without so much as a single thought of wrong doing.


Do your research the next time you wish to join an online league.

[ukhotstove]

I've been in a league before that Cooley as ran and in one at the moment, the first league I was ever in I think Fidel ran and I can go on and on with the names of commish that have ran leagues I've been in, and never once have I even thought they have cheated in the slightest.