Armando Galarraga has a Perfect Game stolen from him by an ump

[cephasjames]

Originally Posted by RchW

There is no rule to allow for this. The Tigers can't protest 'cause they won the game. Any reversal would open a can of worms as it would say that certain "outs" are more important than others when all should be equal.

If this was reversed, think of the stink if the same botched play occurred on the first batter and a pitcher then went on to retire 27 in a row. Based on the precedent set by a reversal that subsequent game would have to be ruled a perfect game too.

Much as I sympathize with Detroit a reversal should never happen.

That out was more important than others. That out was historic. 21 times out of how many games? Yeah, that out was way bigger than 1000s of other outs.

[cephasjames]

Originally Posted by Tony M

More to the point, what was Jason Arnold doing attempting to make contact and then running full pelt when the previous 26 at bats have all ended in an out. Doesn't he realise that the 'rules' say you shouldn't try and break up a no-hitter/perfect game...

this

[David Watts]

Originally Posted by Sdpm100

Going back to the perfect game bit, it shows you how poor quality MLB is if you're getting the likes of Dallas Braden and Armando Galarraga throwing perfect games within weeks of each other, yet have no real previous evidence to suggest they're one of the all-time bests. I realise some that have aren't either, but two in such a short time seems overly strange. Plus there must have been about half-a-dozen perfect games taken into the eighth inning already this season.

No offense, but that is just silly. Throwing a no-hitter or a perfect game has never had anything to do with a pitcher being considered one of the all-time best.

[Tony M]

Originally Posted by David Watts

No offense, but that is just silly. Throwing a no-hitter or a perfect game has never had anything to do with a pitcher being considered one of the all-time best.

To be fair, it also has nothing to do with the pitcher being 'special' on that occasion either. Unless the pitcher throws 81 pitches, all of which are swung on and missed there will be an element of luck in it. A batter could have started his swing 0.01 seconds later and that difference in where the ball is struck could send it several feet to the left of where it could have gone and thus not be an out. The first baseman could get his fingertips to a put out and find it goes into his glove on this occasion where as on another day it pops out.

Events like this should be about the team. The whole team contributed to the fact that no opposition batters got to first base, not just the pitcher.

[jbergey22]

Case and point is Don Larsen pitching a perfect game in the World Series. He was nothing more than an average MLB pitcher. All it takes is one day having better than average stuff and a lot of breaks going your way.

[CommishJoe]

1st -- They can't reverse this call. There's no rule allowing them to do so.
2nd -- It wasn't an error. Not even close
3rd -- When you watch the replay in real time speed, it wasn't THAT horrible of a call. It's the instant replay that makes it look horrendous.

Bottom line, Joyce made a mistake on a split second decision. It's gonna happen, unfortunately, since he is human. What I'm impressed with is how Joyce and Galarraga handled the aftermath. Heck, Galarraga didn't even say anything to Joyce after he made the call. 99.9% (yes my own statistic) of pitchers in that situation would have been in the umpire's face. Galaragga put his hands out, then smiled, then walked away. Ultimate class shown by both guys.

[Sdpm100]

Originally Posted by David Watts

No offense, but that is just silly. Throwing a no-hitter or a perfect game has never had anything to do with a pitcher being considered one of the all-time best.

So you must think it is coincidence that three happen in two months plus all these other near-misses?

What I meant is if any old chump can throw a perfect game then there should be more of them and more similar streaks.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Sdpm100

So you must think it is coincidence that three happen in two months plus all these other near-misses?

What I meant is if any old chump can throw a perfect game then there should be more of them and more similar streaks.

No because its like winning the lotto. Everything has to go right. If you look at the list of perfect games perhaps you can make the case that 5 of them were/are great pitchers.

Perfect game - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[CommishJoe]

The last 2 paragraphs of an article on CNNSI sum up my feelings about this perfectly:

Galarraga pitched a perfect game on Wednesday night in Detroit. I’ll always believe that. I think most baseball fans will always believe that. But, more than anything, it seems that Galarraga will always believe it. The way he handled himself after the game, well, that was something better than perfection. Dallas Braden’s perfect game was thrilling. Roy Halladay’s perfect game was art. But Armando’s Galarraga’s perfect game was a lesson in grace.

And when my young daughters ask, “Why didn’t he get mad and scream about how he was robbed?” I think I will tell them this: I don’t know for sure, but I think it’s because Armando Galarraga understands something that is very hard to understand, something we all struggle with, something I hope you will learn as you grow older: In the end, nobody’s perfect. We just do the best we can.

[David Watts]

Originally Posted by Sdpm100

So you must think it is coincidence that three happen in two months plus all these other near-misses?

What I meant is if any old chump can throw a perfect game then there should be more of them and more similar streaks.

So in 68 when Bob Gibson was 22-9 with a 1.12 ERA, I assume he threw multiple no-hitters/perfect games? How many did Guidry throw in 78 when he went 25-3, 1.74?

[CONN CHRIS]

Originally Posted by CommishJoe

The last 2 paragraphs of an article on CNNSI sum up my feelings about this perfectly:

I agree with Joe. As a Detroit fan, I am sort of happy with the way this turned out (now that I've had a night's sleep). It exposed a bit of Galarraga's character that I might have not otherwise been able to see. I like what I saw.

[bwburke94]

What the heck... Jim Joyce is the second-worst umpire in MLB. Joe West is the worst.

[Sdpm100]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

No because its like winning the lotto. Everything has to go right. If you look at the list of perfect games perhaps you can make the case that 5 of them were/are great pitchers.

Perfect game - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I understand all that, including in my original post you seem to have been upset towards, where I said a number of them on the list were not ATG's.
All I said was it seems rather odd that people are willing to sweep the number of chances under the carpet as coincidence when it has never happened before in 140 years of play, so quickly after various scandals in the game. It just looks suspicious.

[Sdpm100]

Originally Posted by David Watts

So in 68 when Bob Gibson was 22-9 with a 1.12 ERA, I assume he threw multiple no-hitters/perfect games? How many did Guidry throw in 78 when he went 25-3, 1.74?

What has this got to do with anything I said? I'm on about the closeness of them recently, not the players if they happened once in a blue moon.

[CBL-Commish]

Originally Posted by Sdpm100

I understand all that, including in my original post you seem to have been upset towards, where I said a number of them on the list were not ATG's.
All I said was it seems rather odd that people are willing to sweep the number of chances under the carpet as coincidence when it has never happened before in 140 years of play, so quickly after various scandals in the game. It just looks suspicious.

Suspicious? Why? In what way? Do you think MLB has suddenly seen a collapse in hitting talent? In what way? Runs scored are only down a tick from recent seasons? Even if you're right, what could possibly explain this? Or do think something more nefarious is afoot? Did Bud instruct various teams to make outs on purpose to stir up interest in the sport?

This is tinfoil hat kind of stuff.

[Leo_The_Lip]

If you believe bad umpiring calls should be reversed, then there still have been only two perfect games thrown this year.

Why? Because Halladay threw ball four, not once, but twice (at least, from the TV recap that I watched) during his game. The ump called both pitches strikes, and the batter later made out.

If you reverse the Joyce call, you absolutely must reverse the poor ball-strike calls that enabled Halladay to go into the record books.

Sorry, boys, you can't have it both ways. It is either human imperfection or machine perfection. No cherry picking. That is the worst of situations.

[Sdpm100]

Originally Posted by CBL-Commish

Suspicious? Why? In what way? Do you think MLB has suddenly seen a collapse in hitting talent? In what way? Runs scored are only down a tick from recent seasons? Even if you're right, what could possibly explain this? Or do think something more nefarious is afoot? Did Bud instruct various teams to make outs on purpose to stir up interest in the sport?

This is tinfoil hat kind of stuff.

I've already outlined my "theory" (more a thought) in post #37, the post the two in this thread have then taken exception to. According to BBRef, the AL batting average is down eight points on last season, with the NL down two points.
Maybe "interesting" is a better word than "suspicious", although I don't see what this hostility is all about from posters here, when all I said was that there are all these perfect game opportunities in such a short period of time and maybe it says something more than just pure coincidence, as it would be a record.

[cephasjames]

Originally Posted by Leo_The_Lip

It is either human imperfection or machine perfection. No cherry picking. That is the worst of situations.

I think they should use androids for umps, personally. "Data, you're behind the plate tonight. Lore, you're at first."

[Jason]

Originally Posted by CONN CHRIS

I agree with Joe. As a Detroit fan, I am sort of happy with the way this turned out (now that I've had a night's sleep). It exposed a bit of Galarraga's character that I might have not otherwise been able to see. I like what I saw.

MLB deciding whether to review blown call that costs Armando Galarraga of Detroit Tigers perfect game - ESPN

I agree with the assertions about Galarraga's character.

MLB is reviewing it and Selig could overrule the ump...if there's justice, this kid should get his perfect game.

[David Watts]

Originally Posted by Sdpm100

I've already outlined my "theory" (more a thought) in post #37, the post the two in this thread have then taken exception to. According to BBRef, the AL batting average is down eight points on last season, with the NL down two points.
Maybe "interesting" is a better word than "suspicious", although I don't see what this hostility is all about from posters here, when all I said was that there are all these perfect game opportunities in such a short period of time and maybe it says something more than just pure coincidence, as it would be a record.

Hostility? Wow, I simply didn't agree with you. I think "interesting" is definitely a better word.