Teach

athkatla · 10-09-2005, 06:51 AM

Hi guys, I'm one of those rare Brits that like baseball.

Whilst I understand the basic rules of the game, there is a lot I don't understand in this very indepth simulation. Abbreviations are a big problem for me, but I have some documents I can refer to when needed. However my first question is what is the meaning of having the word teach in brackets underneath a players positon in the Minor Leagues Lineup screen?

I have a feeling this will be my first of many questions, so please bear with me, as I am a big fan of baseball, and also a big fan of SI Games.

jazzrack · 10-09-2005, 07:07 AM

it simply means that they don't not yet know how to play that position and are learning it. After a certain amont of time (different for each player/position & some may never learn) they will get a range rating & fielding %.

while they can also learn a new position at the ML level they learn much better in the minors

welcome to the game

BaseballMan · 10-09-2005, 07:31 AM

But keep in mind that you just cant switch a player to any position and have him learn the position. You can try and have a slow low range first baseman learn ss but chances are they he will never develop into a good ss becasue he just doesnt have the basic skills for that position. Its easier to switch to some postions than it is for other postions. Like ss can switch to 2b easier than say an outfielder.

Have you found any of the links to baseball sites that give you more information on the history of the game? If not just ask and and someone will help you out.
The members here also have some good debates on different areas of the game.
Baseball has an amazing history. Whether with fictional or real players you will find that you can create your own history of baseball with this game.

athkatla · 10-09-2005, 08:13 AM

Hi guys, thanks for those prompt replies, I thought it was maybe something to do with learning a new position, just wanted to make sure.

Is there any written document that gives you an idea of what attributes players need to switch from one position to another? Oh and whaat does it mean when it says of a certain player that 'he doesn't harm his glove' , or words similar to that?

kq76 · 10-09-2005, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by athkatla

Is there any written document that gives you an idea of what attributes players need to switch from one position to another?

There's a concept known as the defensive spectrum (1B-LF-RF-3B-CF-2B-SS with C being a special case) and the farther right you go the more difficult the position. However, it's also generally accepted that it's easier to go from similar positions, like from SS to 2B and 3B or from CF to RF and LF, as there are similarities in how you read and go after the ball, etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by athkatla

Oh and whaat does it mean when it says of a certain player that 'he doesn't harm his glove' , or words similar to that?

I don't recall that off hand, but it's probably in the player scouting report and means he has a good glove / he doesn't make many errors. EDIT: You can probably confirm whether it means good or bad by looking at that player's fielding %s.

athkatla · 10-09-2005, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kq76

There's a concept known as the defensive spectrum (1B-LF-RF-3B-CF-2B-SS with C being a special case) and the farther right you go the more difficult the position. However, it's also generally accepted that it's easier to go from similar positions, like from SS to 2B and 3B or from CF to RF and LF, as there are similarities in how you read and go after the ball, etc.

I don't recall that off hand, but it's probably in the player scouting report and means he has a good glove / he doesn't make many errors. EDIT: You can probably confirm whether it means good or bad by looking at that player's fielding %s.

Ahh, I think I see that, it's like having a 3 man midfield in football (soccer to you guys

), 2B SS 3B and a 3 man defence, RF CF LF, the two groups of players play in similar areas of the pitch/field, whatever you call it.

By that I mean the 2 basemen and the SS play in an area adjacent to each other, as do the RF CF and LF.

The mention of the glove is in the scouting report, and mainly I've seen that mentioned for pitchers.

kq76 · 10-09-2005, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by athkatla

Ahh, I think I see that, it's like having a 3 man midfield in football (soccer to you guys

), 2B SS 3B and a 3 man defence, RF CF LF, the two groups of players play in similar areas of the pitch/field, whatever you call it.

By that I mean the 2 basemen and the SS play in an area adjacent to each other, as do the RF CF and LF.

Yes.

And also like I believe in futbol the center or middle guys in each line (C, 2B, SS, CF for baseball and GK, CM, CF for futbol) are the most important and demanding positions as they touch the ball the most and have to make the most athletic plays.

One other note. SSs and 3Bs generally need good IF arms as they both have to throw across the diamond (to 1B) a lot. Same with CFs and RFs as they have to throw to home and 3B a lot.

Quote:

Originally Posted by athkatla

The mention of the glove is in the scouting report, and mainly I've seen that mentioned for pitchers.

Ahh yes, the pitchers. I wouldn't worry about a pitcher's defense much. There's some great fielding Ps like Greg Maddux, but the vast majority rarely touch the ball and if they do they usualy just slow it down.

BaseballMan · 10-09-2005, 04:12 PM

I agree. A pitcher who can field good isnt worth giving up a pitcher who can actually pitch. Thats one of the things you have to think about in Baseball. Do you want to keep a great hitter or do you need a better defensive player?
Just take a look at Ernie Banks and Ozzie Smith's stats. Both are hall of famers but though Bank's 512 hrs jump out at you, Ozzie's stats probably dont amaze you till you hear what others in baseball have said about his defensive play. He was a great defensive SS which is why they called him "The Wizard of OZ".

Btw are you playinmg with fictional players or real players?
Fictional is fun. I use it for my college league. But using real players can be fun too. You just have to keep in mind that Babe Ruth may not develop into the same Babe Ruth as real life. There is the Lahman database you can use to get real players but the problem is that it will import players based on their position in the player's first year in the leagues. So Jimmie Foxx would import has a catcher though he played more at first base. Good news is that you can edit the database as you like or you could use one of the lahman databases that has been improved. Ankit has a couple of databases. One that i like is the one he has based on career totals. He has taken out all the one year players and have players coming in at the position they played the most.

athkatla · 10-10-2005, 04:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BaseballMan

Btw are you playinmg with fictional players or real players?

Umm, I'm not quite sure on that! I started my game with the Standard League option, is that the one with real players? I would actually like to play with real players if at all possible.

BaseballMan · 10-10-2005, 02:00 PM

You can always have 2 leagues and use fictional in one and real players in the other.

You have to use the lahman database or a lahman database that someone has edited. You can find the lahman database at http://www.baseball1.com.
Dont get the access one. Get the comma-delimited version.
Then just create a folder called stats and unzip the file there. Then you just give the game the location and you can import real players, start historical leagues with real players. Start custom leagues with real players.

But you probably want one of Ankits databases if you want players playing closer to real life. Lahman is just like a master database that has all the stats but the problem is that if you start a league in 1904 well then Ty Cobb debuts in 1905 but because his real life rookie stats were that great it kinda
makes him suck in ootp. So ankit has changed his debut year and he also has a database based on career totals. But keep in mind you can edit the lahman database yourself as well. Even so remember that you may still not have Willie Mays become Wille Mays because it still depends on how Mays will deveop within your league. His real stats may give him better ratings to satrt with than say an average real life player but it doesnt guarantee Mays will be
great. But thats another thing that makes ootp a great game.

GoCubsAndJays · 10-10-2005, 05:51 PM

You don't NEED the Lahman database to use real players. That's just if you want to use historical players.

Qwerty75 · 10-10-2005, 07:18 PM

The "Standard League" default has real players with their names changed (so you can pick out Randy Johnson as Imax Higginbotham or whatever on the Yankees). If you want real names with the cyber-players on the real teams, there are several versions of roster sets around that you can download.

BaseballMan · 10-10-2005, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoCubsAndJays

You don't NEED the Lahman database to use real players. That's just if you want to use historical players.

I am not sure that is correct. Because i have always assumed that historical players were real players and that yes the standard league may use real players with names changed but then again wouldnt that make them fictional players? After all ootp doesnt know names.

I have always understood there to be fictional and historical/real players. Still it would probably be easier to use a roster set or edited database or for him to edit the database as he likes than trying to change every name. I am pretty sure someone has probably already done that. But then again i have hardly bothered with standard league because i like custom and historical leagues.

battists · 10-10-2005, 10:02 PM

Incidentally, I think that pitcher's scouting report line is more like "He won't hurt you with his glove." This means he's not a bad fielder, for a pitcher. His fielding % (3-digit number usually between .900 and .999) will probably be comparitively higher than other pitchers.

Of course, I don't think there are many people who pay much attention to fielding ability when it comes to pitchers.

Keep the questions coming! Don't let these so-called experts overwhelm you!

Steve

BaseballMan · 10-10-2005, 10:34 PM

I dont know if anyone is an expert at this game. There are those who have played since ootp1 or ootp2 and they are still finding new things to enjoy in the game or new ways to play etc. This isnt your average throw to 1st twenty times in a row Triple Play game.

athkatla · 10-11-2005, 03:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by battists

Incidentally, I think that pitcher's scouting report line is more like "He won't hurt you with his glove." This means he's not a bad fielder, for a pitcher. His fielding % (3-digit number usually between .900 and .999) will probably be comparitively higher than other pitchers.

Of course, I don't think there are many people who pay much attention to fielding ability when it comes to pitchers.

Keep the questions coming! Don't let these so-called experts overwhelm you!

Steve

Yes, that is the line I've seen for pitchers, thanks. So with fielding the closer the players percentage is to 999 the better fielder he is right? Also, his range, arm and hands attributes have an effect on his fielding ability?

Qwerty75 · 10-11-2005, 03:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by athkatla

Yes, that is the line I've seen for pitchers, thanks. So with fielding the closer the players percentage is to 999 the better fielder he is right? Also, his range, arm and hands attributes have an effect on his fielding ability?

Range is how many batted balls the fielder gets to (relative to the average, according the scale you're using); fld.% is how many errors he makes on those balls. There isn't a "hands" attribute in the game currently, though I suspect it may change in the next version.

battists · 10-11-2005, 08:47 AM

I believe the game actually calculates it somewhat like this, which is not unlike the real world:

When a ball is hit (let's say a ground ball), the game calculates the trajectory. The player tries to field it, and the first thing that comes into play is his range. If he has a high range, he has a better change of reaching a ball that isn't right at him. If he is within range, then he attempts to field it. The fielding % is the % chance he has at successfully fielding it. So, if he has a .990 fielding percentage, he has a 99% chance of fielding it.

Once he fields it, arm strength comes into play when he throws the ball to first. I'm sure that some sort of calculation determines how quickly the runner made it to first (based on the player's speed), and how long the throw takes to get there.

So, all 3 (arm strength, range, fielding %) factor into the calculation. But, such numbers are much more important, say, for a shortstop, who is going to field many more balls in a game than a pitcher.

10-09-2005, 06:51 AM	#1
athkatla Bat Boy Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: England, UK Posts: 17	Teach Hi guys, I'm one of those rare Brits that like baseball. Whilst I understand the basic rules of the game, there is a lot I don't understand in this very indepth simulation. Abbreviations are a big problem for me, but I have some documents I can refer to when needed. However my first question is what is the meaning of having the word teach in brackets underneath a players positon in the Minor Leagues Lineup screen? I have a feeling this will be my first of many questions, so please bear with me, as I am a big fan of baseball, and also a big fan of SI Games. __________________ Win at all costs!

10-09-2005, 07:07 AM	#2
jazzrack Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: still kicking Posts: 3,229	it simply means that they don't not yet know how to play that position and are learning it. After a certain amont of time (different for each player/position & some may never learn) they will get a range rating & fielding %. while they can also learn a new position at the ML level they learn much better in the minors welcome to the game __________________ . "Never confuse composure for ease" Was once Head Cheese of Corporate League Baseball

10-09-2005, 08:13 AM	#4
athkatla Bat Boy Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: England, UK Posts: 17	Hi guys, thanks for those prompt replies, I thought it was maybe something to do with learning a new position, just wanted to make sure. Is there any written document that gives you an idea of what attributes players need to switch from one position to another? Oh and whaat does it mean when it says of a certain player that 'he doesn't harm his glove' , or words similar to that? __________________ Win at all costs! Last edited by athkatla; 10-09-2005 at 08:14 AM.

10-10-2005, 07:18 PM	#12
Qwerty75 All Star Reserve Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 817	The "Standard League" default has real players with their names changed (so you can pick out Randy Johnson as Imax Higginbotham or whatever on the Yankees). If you want real names with the cyber-players on the real teams, there are several versions of roster sets around that you can download. __________________

10-09-2005, 07:31 AM	#3
BaseballMan Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 6,641	But keep in mind that you just cant switch a player to any position and have him learn the position. You can try and have a slow low range first baseman learn ss but chances are they he will never develop into a good ss becasue he just doesnt have the basic skills for that position. Its easier to switch to some postions than it is for other postions. Like ss can switch to 2b easier than say an outfielder. Have you found any of the links to baseball sites that give you more information on the history of the game? If not just ask and and someone will help you out. The members here also have some good debates on different areas of the game. Baseball has an amazing history. Whether with fictional or real players you will find that you can create your own history of baseball with this game.

10-09-2005, 04:12 PM	#8
BaseballMan Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 6,641	I agree. A pitcher who can field good isnt worth giving up a pitcher who can actually pitch. Thats one of the things you have to think about in Baseball. Do you want to keep a great hitter or do you need a better defensive player? Just take a look at Ernie Banks and Ozzie Smith's stats. Both are hall of famers but though Bank's 512 hrs jump out at you, Ozzie's stats probably dont amaze you till you hear what others in baseball have said about his defensive play. He was a great defensive SS which is why they called him "The Wizard of OZ". Btw are you playinmg with fictional players or real players? Fictional is fun. I use it for my college league. But using real players can be fun too. You just have to keep in mind that Babe Ruth may not develop into the same Babe Ruth as real life. There is the Lahman database you can use to get real players but the problem is that it will import players based on their position in the player's first year in the leagues. So Jimmie Foxx would import has a catcher though he played more at first base. Good news is that you can edit the database as you like or you could use one of the lahman databases that has been improved. Ankit has a couple of databases. One that i like is the one he has based on career totals. He has taken out all the one year players and have players coming in at the position they played the most.

10-10-2005, 02:00 PM	#10
BaseballMan Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 6,641	You can always have 2 leagues and use fictional in one and real players in the other. You have to use the lahman database or a lahman database that someone has edited. You can find the lahman database at http://www.baseball1.com. Dont get the access one. Get the comma-delimited version. Then just create a folder called stats and unzip the file there. Then you just give the game the location and you can import real players, start historical leagues with real players. Start custom leagues with real players. But you probably want one of Ankits databases if you want players playing closer to real life. Lahman is just like a master database that has all the stats but the problem is that if you start a league in 1904 well then Ty Cobb debuts in 1905 but because his real life rookie stats were that great it kinda makes him suck in ootp. So ankit has changed his debut year and he also has a database based on career totals. But keep in mind you can edit the lahman database yourself as well. Even so remember that you may still not have Willie Mays become Wille Mays because it still depends on how Mays will deveop within your league. His real stats may give him better ratings to satrt with than say an average real life player but it doesnt guarantee Mays will be great. But thats another thing that makes ootp a great game.

10-10-2005, 05:51 PM	#11
GoCubsAndJays All Star Reserve Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 839	You don't NEED the Lahman database to use real players. That's just if you want to use historical players.

10-10-2005, 10:02 PM	#14
battists Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 18,506	Incidentally, I think that pitcher's scouting report line is more like "He won't hurt you with his glove." This means he's not a bad fielder, for a pitcher. His fielding % (3-digit number usually between .900 and .999) will probably be comparitively higher than other pitchers. Of course, I don't think there are many people who pay much attention to fielding ability when it comes to pitchers. Keep the questions coming! Don't let these so-called experts overwhelm you! Steve

10-10-2005, 10:34 PM	#15
BaseballMan Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 6,641	I dont know if anyone is an expert at this game. There are those who have played since ootp1 or ootp2 and they are still finding new things to enjoy in the game or new ways to play etc. This isnt your average throw to 1st twenty times in a row Triple Play game.

10-11-2005, 08:47 AM	#18
battists Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 18,506	I believe the game actually calculates it somewhat like this, which is not unlike the real world: When a ball is hit (let's say a ground ball), the game calculates the trajectory. The player tries to field it, and the first thing that comes into play is his range. If he has a high range, he has a better change of reaching a ball that isn't right at him. If he is within range, then he attempts to field it. The fielding % is the % chance he has at successfully fielding it. So, if he has a .990 fielding percentage, he has a 99% chance of fielding it. Once he fields it, arm strength comes into play when he throws the ball to first. I'm sure that some sort of calculation determines how quickly the runner made it to first (based on the player's speed), and how long the throw takes to get there. So, all 3 (arm strength, range, fielding %) factor into the calculation. But, such numbers are much more important, say, for a shortstop, who is going to field many more balls in a game than a pitcher.