2005 White Sox Thread

[MogulChamp]

Surprised there isn't one of these out yet considering all of us White Sox fans.

So let's hear it. Biggest disappointments? Biggest surprises? Or just tell us you hate the Pale Hose.

I definately have to say I am surprised by how balanced we are so far. We can beat you by the long ball, or with speed. I haven't even seen any small ball yet, but Podsednick sure can burn ya. Our Starting Pitching has been great, as has our defense. The only thing that has concerned me has been our bullpen. It scares me a bit, but the only game it's cost us is the Cleveland game. That may have been Ozzie's fault, using too many pitchers and wearing out Viscaino. Timo Perez was a questionable roster spot, but his upper deck shot vs the Twinkies will give him some lee-way.

Most surprising though is that it so far seems all of KW's moves look good. I am shocked. This team has a lot of new pieces the last couple of years, but so far KW has looked pretty good. I think the Brewers deal was a win-win for all involved.

All in all, I think it is going to be a great season. Tommorrow's game on ESPN should be great. The Burleyone vs Santana. Whatever happens though, we won this series.

[Dauis]

I'm not sold on the Milwaukee deal yet. I know you have to look at the fact that it freed up payroll to go out and get Hernandez, Pierzynski, Hermanson, etc., but I don't like the fact that we now have a .250 leadoff hitter. I know he's a great base-stealer, but what good will that do when his OBP is the same as some of the other guys' batting averages? I was a little worried about the offense the first 2 games, considering we didn't get a hit off of either starter. The pitching could be streaky, and with some of their health injuries, could potentially be a concern. Overall, I'm pleasantly surprised so far, and no matter what happens, it should be an interesting ride.

[JDOldSchool]

Originally Posted by MogulChamp

Most surprising though is that it so far seems all of KW's moves look good. I am shocked. This team has a lot of new pieces the last couple of years, but so far KW has looked pretty good. I think the Brewers deal was a win-win for all involved.

Scott Podsednik has a .238 average and .308 OBP through 6 games. He's shaping up to be the worst lead off hitter in the American League. This doesn't look good at all. Sure, he's 3 for 4 in stolen bases. Barely above the break-even point. In fact, I'm pretty sure none of those 3 stolen bases directly led to a run but that caught stealing definitely ruined an inning.

Vizcaino gave up 6 runs that one game, but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. He was likely out of gas. Mulligan for him.

Williams made a myriad bad moves this offseason: Dye was overpriced and not the best option. Hermanson is the biggest SOC in the bullpen. He's no better than Adkins, but about 7 times as expensive. The Lee trade was dumb any way you slice it. Signing Orlando Hernandez will blow up in his face. Sticking with Crede was a huge mistake.

Pierzynski was a steal, but the guy basically fell into Williams' lap. Iguchi looks solid so far.

Williams' entire run with this team gets no better than a D+ or C-. He's repeatedly shown his inability to build a team.

75 wins for the 2005 White Sox.

[JDOldSchool]

Originally Posted by Dauis

I know you have to look at the fact that it freed up payroll to go out and get Hernandez, Pierzynski, Hermanson, etc.,

This is factually inaccurate. If you look at the payroll from last year, the money that was lost, there was plenty of money to throw out a few million total for Iguchi, Pierzynsky and Dye. He just shouldn't have signed Hernandez or Hermanson.

Magglio's $14 million, Valentin's $5 million, Koch's $6+ million - all off the books this season.

[MogulChamp]

Originally Posted by JDOldSchool

Scott Podsednik has a .238 average and .308 OBP through 6 games. He's shaping up to be the worst lead off hitter in the American League. This doesn't look good at all. Sure, he's 3 for 4 in stolen bases. Barely above the break-even point. In fact, I'm pretty sure none of those 3 stolen bases directly led to a run but that caught stealing definitely ruined an inning.

Yes but when he is getting on base, he is creating runs. The game on Saturday he walked, stole second. Moved over to 3rd on a short fly ball, and scored on a wild pitch. In years past our team has been one of the worst baserunning teams in the league. We are putting a lot of pressure on opposing pitchers.

Originally Posted by JDOldSchool

Vizcaino gave up 6 runs that one game, but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. He was likely out of gas. Mulligan for him.

Out of gas is an understatement. He had 60+ pitches and a couple of innings. This loss can be attributed to Ozzie, he made some strange pitching moves with us up by 3+ runs.

Originally Posted by JDOldSchool

Williams made a myriad bad moves this offseason: Dye was overpriced and not the best option. Hermanson is the biggest SOC in the bullpen. He's no better than Adkins, but about 7 times as expensive. The Lee trade was dumb any way you slice it. Signing Orlando Hernandez will blow up in his face. Sticking with Crede was a huge mistake.

Dye is not the best option, he's no Maggs. But for this team KW built I feel this is the right guy. Good defense and a strong arm. Hermanson is maybe not a good signing, but he can also be a 6th starter. We weren't winning with Lee. Trading him brought in Podsednick and Viscaino. It also freed up payroll to sign Iguchi, Pierzynski, Hermanson and Hernandez. El Ducky has post season experience and I think he will add some chemistry to the team considering how many latin players are on the team. He will hopefully teach some of these young pitchers some things. Iguchi has been one of our most consistent players this year and also fits the new look Sox. Our pitching staff is a lot better because of AJ.

Originally Posted by JDOldSchool

Pierzynski was a steal, but the guy basically fell into Williams' lap. Iguchi looks solid so far.

Agree.

Originally Posted by JDOldSchool

Williams' entire run with this team gets no better than a D+ or C-. He's repeatedly shown his inability to build a team.

75 wins for the 2005 White Sox.

I thought he was a bad GM. He still may be. He does give up too much in his trades. However, I will give him the benefit of the doubt because this team seems to have a lot more balance than in years past. I honestly think we will win the division. Minnesota's defense looks a whole lot worse this year as opposed to years past. But we'll see.

*edit* Sure he paid a lot for Hermanson and Hernandez, but that is the trend. Pitcher salaries are skyrocketing. As a matter of fact this was a front page sports story in the USA Today sports section a week or so ago.

[eriqjaffe]

I'm just amazed that there are complaints about the Sox overpaying players.

[Meth_Lab_for_Rudy]

Why does the Gload only have one at bat? Any chance we could see him in Atlanta this year? We are going to need an OF after all.

[andjbock]

Can't add much, but I love Takatsu's 57 mph changer.

[JDOldSchool]

Originally Posted by MogulChamp

*edit* Sure he paid a lot for Hermanson and Hernandez, but that is the trend. Pitcher salaries are skyrocketing. As a matter of fact this was a front page sports story in the USA Today sports section a week or so ago.

This is why Billy Beane is nothing short of a genius. He trades two guys who either are overpaid or will be soon for young, talented starters (plus two solid relievers and an outfielder that will have the underrated tag by the end of this season).

The team may not have won with Lee, but it didn't lose because of him.

It's an outright lie that Lee's trade allowed the signings of others. The payroll with Lee and minus Podsednik and Vizcaino is less than $80 million. If Williams doesn't pay for Hermanson, it's even less. The argument that Lee was moved to free up salary doesn't work when A) the payroll wouldn't have been much higher than the "budget" and B) they just go and sign crappy players with the freed up money.

[JDOldSchool]

dola,

Through 8 games, the White Sox have scored 27 runs and given up 26. It's nothing short of complete luck that they're 6-2.

[Urth]

Originally Posted by JDOldSchool

dola,

Through 8 games, the White Sox have scored 27 runs and given up 26. It's nothing short of complete luck that they're 6-2.

Sample size, my man...sample size. Eight games in is a little too soon to apply Pythagorean Expected Wins formula. Besides, six of those runs given up were due to Viscaino's meltdown in Cleveland last Thursday, which most people seem to agree was due to Guillen leaving him in too long. It's also a bit too soon to evaluate the value of Podsednik as the new Pale Hose leadoff guy. Do you really expect him to hit .238 throughout the entire season? If April is the standard by which all players' performances are determined, then my fantasy pitching staff should be dominant, featuring D. Willis and Mr. Zero
...but I'm not counting on it.

Anyway, 1 1/2 times through the rotation and so far, I'm feelin' the love. No train wrecks yet, and even Contreras looks sharp. Maybe McCarthy will be ready when El-Dookie hits the wall, eh?

[eriqjaffe]

Originally Posted by Urth

Besides, six of those runs given up were due to Viscaino's meltdown in Cleveland last Thursday, which most people seem to agree was due to Guillen leaving him in too long.

And another three came in the form of those three solo homers in the top of the 9th of that same game - take those miserable two innings away, and it becomes a 10-run differential instead of a 1-run differential. Average game score?

Also, it's encouraging that the Sox are winning close games - and all of their games have been against two teams that many people picked to finish ahead of the Sox, if not to win the division outright.

And the Sox are 4-1 on the road at the moment, which is very encouraging.

But, yeah, sample size.

[Urth]

Originally Posted by andjbock

Can't add much, but I love Takatsu's 57 mph changer.

Mmmm...no. That would be his fastball.

[batted balls]

I agree with those of you that say it's way too early in the season to know what sort of team this is going to be. I'm on record in not liking the Carlos Lee trade. I just don't think they got all that much in return. Kenny Williams also way overpaid for Freddy Garcia. I'm betting Shingo won't be the closer by the end of May . . . I'm not sure who it will be and Ozzie sure doesn't know either.

But, let's face it Reinsdorf and company are running this club like it's a small market team even though Chicago is one of the largest markets in the country. I still have concerns over Ozzie's managing, but hey, I'll take 6-2 for a start any year.

P.S.

It didn't take Rooney and Farmer long to start whining about some outfielder with his sunglasses on his cap . . .

[JDOldSchool]

Originally Posted by Urth

Do you really expect him to hit .238 throughout the entire season?

Nah, more like .245-.250 with an OBP of around .310, making him my least favorite Sox player of all time.

[JDOldSchool]

Originally Posted by batted balls

But, let's face it Reinsdorf and company are running this club like it's a small market team even though Chicago is one of the largest markets in the country.

My second-favorite team does just fine being small market, isn't that right G&GH?

[Urth]

Originally Posted by JDOldSchool

Nah, more like .245-.250 with an OBP of around .310, making him my least favorite Sox player of all time.

Heh, well I think Ozzie Guillen himself batted leadoff for the Hose one year. I think hit a typical .270 or so, walking maybe 20 times that year. He actually made me pine for the good old days featuring Gary Redus at leadoff (or was it John Cangelosi?)

Anyways, I hope Pods finds a level of production higher than what you have him slated for, or he gets dropped to 7th in the order. Which means Iguchi gets to lead off, maybe.

[JDOldSchool]

Ninth game of the season and Everett gets hurt.

Have I mentioned that the Carl Everett trades are two of the top 5 reasons I want Kenny Williams to fall out of an airplane?

I must admit though, even I thought Everett would last until May before throwing himself face-first into a wall. That was unbelievably comical because it was one of those "this is going to be bad" plays...and sure enough...it was bad.

[MogulChamp]

Originally Posted by JDOldSchool

Ninth game of the season and Everett gets hurt.

Have I mentioned that the Carl Everett trades are two of the top 5 reasons I want Kenny Williams to fall out of an airplane?

I must admit though, even I thought Everett would last until May before throwing himself face-first into a wall. That was unbelievably comical because it was one of those "this is going to be bad" plays...and sure enough...it was bad.

I like Carl. I think he is a cheap, good, switch-hitter. I don't like the fact that KW traded for him twice. I agree that those were horrible moves.

The problem with this injury is Ozzie. From what I understand, Carl was in LF to give Pods some rest and to allow Gload to DH. Why not put either Ozuna or Timo in LF? This stinks and it's Ozzie's fault.

I also am very upset at Ozzie's use of "Mr. Zero" the last 2 games. Who cares if he blew his last couple saves vs Cleveland. He's still our closer. You don't see Torre benching Rivera vs the Red Sox do you? Hell no.

Ozzie had better get his head out of his butt, even though KW probably won't fire him, because he is probably the cheapest option out there.

[Jestor]

Ozzie doesn't strike me as too hot of a manager. He seems too much of a players' manager who has no clue what he's doing in terms of baseball strategy.

Not to say that players' managers are bad; they just need to be able to good tacticians, too and from what I've seen of Guillen, he ain't.