AL and NL Managers of the year.

benchwarmer · 11-10-2004, 05:22 PM

Rangers manager Buck Showalter and Braves manager Bobby Cox take home the honors of Manager Of The Year, 2004!

Karros270 · 11-10-2004, 05:24 PM

Good choices. Seems fair.

Green & Gold Heart · 11-10-2004, 05:34 PM

Those were my picks - Showalter especially deserved it. I'm glad east coast bias didn't result in a Francona win.

Dagrims · 11-10-2004, 05:35 PM

Showalter's a decent choice, but if you're going to vote for a manager of a team that didn't even make the playoffs, why not Trammell instead?

Green & Gold Heart · 11-10-2004, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dagrims

Showalter's a decent choice, but if you're going to vote for a manager of a team that didn't even make the playoffs, why not Trammell instead?

The Rangers traded the (arguably) best player in the game and managed to improve and actually contend for the wild card down to the wire.

EDIT: They had more of a shot at the division than wild card, actually. BoSox had it locked up early.

Green & Gold Heart · 11-10-2004, 05:38 PM

Wow... I just looked at the results. The AL race was close.Showalter 101, Gardenhire 91.

CMH · 11-10-2004, 05:40 PM

I agree, good choices. You can make an argument for other guys, but overall you can't be disappointed with these selections.

Dagrims · 11-10-2004, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Green & Gold Heart

The Rangers traded the (arguably) best player in the game and managed to improve and actually contend for the wild card down to the wire.

EDIT: They had more of a shot at the division than wild card, actually. BoSox had it locked up early.

Detroit improved by 29 wins, Texas by 18. A-Rod's stats this season weren't that much better than Soriano's, so Texas at least got a competent replacement (and Michael Young's stats were nearly as good). I'm not going to argue against Showalter since he did a great job, but Trammell deserved a vote or two at least.

cknox0723 · 11-11-2004, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dagrims

Detroit improved by 29 wins, Texas by 18. A-Rod's stats this season weren't that much better than Soriano's, so Texas at least got a competent replacement (and Michael Young's stats were nearly as good). I'm not going to argue against Showalter since he did a great job, but Trammell deserved a vote or two at least.

Fascinating topic, I think -- Trammell's team may have improved more, but wasn't that almost all entirely due to bringing in Rodriguez, Guillen, Johnson, et al.? Should the manager get credit for that?

What does separate a good manager from a bad one? Was Francona a bad manager because the Sox underperformed their Pythag projections this year? How about Cox, since the Braves choked in the first round again?

I think -- I hope -- some statheadzzzz smarter than me try studying this area a bit in the next few years. Too many questions, not enough answers -- but it's still fascinating.

My votes, by the way -- Piniella and Tracy.

Vris · 11-11-2004, 07:33 PM

Detroit had to improve, right? No matter who they brought in. 119 losses last year? If they didn't do better than that, they might as well been the team to contract.

Both deserve the award. Showalter did a great job with Texas, making them contend when they weren't. Cox for doing the same thing. Isn't that what a Manager of the Year does?

rudel.dietrich · 11-11-2004, 07:41 PM

Spot on choices

Eckstein 4 Prez · 11-11-2004, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vris

Detroit had to improve, right? No matter who they brought in. 119 losses last year? If they didn't do better than that, they might as well been the team to contract.

Agreed, which is why Showalter was the right choice. Got to disagree with the punmaster on this one.

Skipaway · 11-11-2004, 07:55 PM

Why didn't La Genius win?

Dagrims · 11-11-2004, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eckstein 4 Prez

Agreed, which is why Showalter was the right choice. Got to disagree with the punmaster on this one.

I think that Showalter was a very good choice. I also think that Trammell did a better job than Torre or Francona and should have received a few votes.

bulldog55 · 11-11-2004, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cknox0723

Fascinating topic, I think -- Trammell's team may have improved more, but wasn't that almost all entirely due to bringing in Rodriguez, Guillen, Johnson, et al.? Should the manager get credit for that?

What does separate a good manager from a bad one? Was Francona a bad manager because the Sox underperformed their Pythag projections this year? How about Cox, since the Braves choked in the first round again?

I think -- I hope -- some statheadzzzz smarter than me try studying this area a bit in the next few years. Too many questions, not enough answers -- but it's still fascinating.

My votes, by the way -- Piniella and Tracy.

My thoughts exactly. What makes Tony La Russa so deserving of finishing second outside of the fact that he got to sit and watch one of the greatest offenses in history win a ton of games and make him look brilliant?

markwookungfu · 11-11-2004, 08:52 PM

NL - Dusty
AL - I dunno maybe Francona or Showalter

benchwarmer · 11-11-2004, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markwookungfu

NL - Dusty
AL - I dunno maybe Francona or Showalter

LOL....

+1

rudel.dietrich · 11-11-2004, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markwookungfu

NL - Dusty
AL - I dunno maybe Francona or Showalter

best.joke.oftheday.

knuckler · 11-12-2004, 04:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bulldog55

My thoughts exactly. What makes Tony La Russa so deserving of finishing second outside of the fact that he got to sit and watch one of the greatest offenses in history win a ton of games and make him look brilliant?

Hate to make it seem like I'm defending LaRussa, because I'm not, but greatest offenses of all-time? The Cardinals weren't even in the top five in major league baseball this year in terms of runs per game. Their 5.28 average per game is no where near the top marks all-time, even in the DH-less National League. The fact that LaRussa finds players like Matheny, Taguchi, and Cedeno useful speaks enough about why he doesn't deserve the award.

ctorg · 11-12-2004, 11:46 AM

NL - Whitey Herzong
AL - Earl Weaver

I'm shocked that neither of them were even considered.

11-10-2004, 05:22 PM	#1
benchwarmer Banned Join Date: May 2004 Location: Red Sox Nation Posts: 1,461	AL and NL Managers of the year. Rangers manager Buck Showalter and Braves manager Bobby Cox take home the honors of Manager Of The Year, 2004!

11-10-2004, 05:24 PM	#2
Karros270 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 2,392	Good choices. Seems fair. __________________ now everybody's praying...don't prey on me

11-10-2004, 05:35 PM	#4
Dagrims Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 3,827	Showalter's a decent choice, but if you're going to vote for a manager of a team that didn't even make the playoffs, why not Trammell instead? __________________ "Read books, get brain."

11-11-2004, 07:33 PM	#10
Vris Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: somewhere where I don't know where I am Posts: 3,251	Detroit had to improve, right? No matter who they brought in. 119 losses last year? If they didn't do better than that, they might as well been the team to contract. Both deserve the award. Showalter did a great job with Texas, making them contend when they weren't. Cox for doing the same thing. Isn't that what a Manager of the Year does? __________________ None Blog it.

11-11-2004, 07:55 PM	#13
Skipaway Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Where you live Posts: 11,017	Why didn't La Genius win? __________________ Jonathan Haidt: Moral reasoning is really just a servant masquerading as a high priest.

11-10-2004, 05:34 PM	#3
Green & Gold Heart Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 5,242	Those were my picks - Showalter especially deserved it. I'm glad east coast bias didn't result in a Francona win.

11-10-2004, 05:38 PM	#6
Green & Gold Heart Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 5,242	Wow... I just looked at the results. The AL race was close.Showalter 101, Gardenhire 91.

11-10-2004, 05:40 PM	#7
CMH Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5,057	I agree, good choices. You can make an argument for other guys, but overall you can't be disappointed with these selections.

11-11-2004, 07:41 PM	#11
rudel.dietrich Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Zürich, Switzerland Posts: 8,608	Spot on choices

11-11-2004, 08:52 PM	#16
markwookungfu Registered User Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: chicago Posts: 70	NL - Dusty AL - I dunno maybe Francona or Showalter

11-12-2004, 11:46 AM	#20
ctorg Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Queens, NY Posts: 9,848	NL - Whitey Herzong AL - Earl Weaver I'm shocked that neither of them were even considered. __________________ My music "When the trees blow back and forth, that's what makes the wind." - Steven Wright Fjord emena pancreas thorax fornicate marmalade morpheme proteolysis smaxa cabana offal srue vitriol grope hallelujah lentils