Any Chance we will see H2H?

[yanksfan3333]

I know this has been asked a million times, but again, I ask, where is the H2H we were promised? I stand here and state that I will not buy another version of OOTP until H2H is implemented into V6. This is ridiculous. So much for "one week after the release". Keep your word and support your product. Otherwise I will keep my money and support my bartender.

[Eckstein 4 Prez]

My money's on "no chance."

[jbmagic]

markus already said its coming out very soon...

http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...255#post816255

[rem]

Unless both players are using the same computer I think it's unlikely.

[Eckstein 4 Prez]

Originally Posted by jbmagic

markus already said its coming out very soon...

From the newsletter released 3/9/2004:

"Head to Head online play. This enables online league members to play their games head to head. The game results will be automatically uploaded to the league FTP server, so the league commissioner can easily import them and bring the league files up to date."

From Markus' post on 4/1/2004 updating everyone on the progress of OOTP6:

"OK, today I have been thinking about a possibility to get the game released sooner. The only real big feature that needs to be put in is the internet head-to-head mode. It is already 50% implemented, but I guess getting it done 100% and testing it properly will take 1 week.

So, the question is, I could leave this out of the initial release, and concentrate on it fully for the first big update, which usually is 2-3 weeks after release time.

What do you think, would you mind if I left this feature out of the initial release to get the game out sooner?"

From Markus' post on 4/5/2004:

"I will give the best I can to get the game done now without concentrating on H2H. Once that is done (next week), I will decide if I release the game without H2H, or spend an extra 7 days on the H2H before release."

From Markus' post on 4/14/2004:

"H2H will be in the first big update!"

After two months of people asking about H2H, and Markus avoiding the issue, we get this mea culpa of sorts on 6/10/2004:

"But every now and then I mention that a certain feature (most of the time it's something I am really excited about) will make it into the release version, and then for various reason I wasn't able to do it. Many times the reason is just simply lack of time (H2H), or simply that it would be way too complicated to put the feature in so that the cons outweight the pros (financial coefficient)."

Here's what we got on 6/24/2004:

"H2H will be part of the first big update... the move and all that has slowed down on my end, unlike years before, but now that 6.03 is out, and I have settled in, I will be able to devote time to coding the update. That has nothing to do with SI, by the way.

True, I said that it was implemented 50% at release time, and that was true from my point of view back then. I thought it'd be easier to implement, but I am sure that it will get into version 6 soon. Hope that helps!"

Then this is the 7/19/2004 update, which I think you referenced:

"Well, next up is the update, which unlike a patch, will add some more features along with the bug fixing. H2H is the primary feature that is planned for that update, but lots of small useful things will be part of it as well."

Personally, I think this has "about to be postponed until version 7" written all over it.

[ctorg]

Originally Posted by Eckstein 4 Prez

From the newsletter released 3/9/2004:

"Head to Head online play. This enables online league members to play their games head to head. The game results will be automatically uploaded to the league FTP server, so the league commissioner can easily import them and bring the league files up to date."

From Markus' post on 4/1/2004 updating everyone on the progress of OOTP6:

"OK, today I have been thinking about a possibility to get the game released sooner. The only real big feature that needs to be put in is the internet head-to-head mode. It is already 50% implemented, but I guess getting it done 100% and testing it properly will take 1 week.

So, the question is, I could leave this out of the initial release, and concentrate on it fully for the first big update, which usually is 2-3 weeks after release time.

What do you think, would you mind if I left this feature out of the initial release to get the game out sooner?"

From Markus' post on 4/5/2004:

"I will give the best I can to get the game done now without concentrating on H2H. Once that is done (next week), I will decide if I release the game without H2H, or spend an extra 7 days on the H2H before release."

From Markus' post on 4/14/2004:

"H2H will be in the first big update!"

After two months of people asking about H2H, and Markus avoiding the issue, we get this mea culpa of sorts on 6/10/2004:

"But every now and then I mention that a certain feature (most of the time it's something I am really excited about) will make it into the release version, and then for various reason I wasn't able to do it. Many times the reason is just simply lack of time (H2H), or simply that it would be way too complicated to put the feature in so that the cons outweight the pros (financial coefficient)."

Here's what we got on 6/24/2004:

"H2H will be part of the first big update... the move and all that has slowed down on my end, unlike years before, but now that 6.03 is out, and I have settled in, I will be able to devote time to coding the update. That has nothing to do with SI, by the way.

True, I said that it was implemented 50% at release time, and that was true from my point of view back then. I thought it'd be easier to implement, but I am sure that it will get into version 6 soon. Hope that helps!"

Then this is the 7/19/2004 update, which I think you referenced:

"Well, next up is the update, which unlike a patch, will add some more features along with the bug fixing. H2H is the primary feature that is planned for that update, but lots of small useful things will be part of it as well."

Personally, I think this has "about to be postponed until version 7" written all over it.

Good record keeping there.

Yeah, I'm not confident about it, but considering that OOTP7 isn't supposed to come out until at least late 2005, I could see it as part of a big spring update or something.

[sahyder1]

Originally Posted by ctorg

Good record keeping there.

Yeah, I'm not confident about it, but considering that OOTP7 isn't supposed to come out until at least late 2005, I could see it as part of a big spring update or something.

which would make it exactly one year late. We should've been told of what was going on and not given the notification that it was gonna be out in one week. The game is great but the ball was dropped big time on this is. It does hurt the long term credibility of the guy's word.

[ctorg]

Originally Posted by sahyder1

which would make it exactly one year late. We should've been told of what was going on and not given the notification that it was gonna be out in one week. The game is great but the ball was dropped big time on this is. It does hurt the long term credibility of the guy's word.

As much as I think Markus does a great job in general, I do have to say he's been very non-communicative about this particular issue. I think he regrets ever putting it on the table in the first place.

[Jeremy Weimer]

Like others have said in the thread, I don't see the H2H feature happening anytime soon. It may be included in an update for OOTP6 but that update doesn't seem to be coming anytime soon either. So we could be in for a long wait unless Markus has a surprise up his sleeve.

[sahyder1]

Originally Posted by Jeremy Weimer

So we could be in for a long wait unless Markus has a surprise up his sleeve.

Hey, I'm all for suprises, they are fun but this isn't the surprise people signed up for. This was supposed to be a done deal. You don't give a 1 week deadline and then just dodge the questions 5 months later. A surprise would be an additional feature. And to think some people voted for a delay of the release until H2H was in......we would've still been waiting.

[Greg B]

Before High Heat went under, I was one of the many requesting H2H Internet Manage Only Mode for online leagues for that product. Of course when High Heat went, so did the hope.

When I saw OOTP with plans to implement it, I couldn't help but get version 6. For use in an on-line league, I thought my prayers were finally answered.
Then I got the game, and without H2H it was like buying HH2004 and finding out it's without Manage Only mode all over again.

Who ever makes it first (whether EA, OOTP, Microsoft, whomever) to H2H Manage Only mode I expect will cash in quite handily. You would think with all the advances in our technology it could be done. I hope OOTP gets to it before EA or someone else.

[TigerGDK]

which would make it exactly one year late. We should've been told of what was going on and not given the notification that it was gonna be out in one week. The game is great but the ball was dropped big time on this is. It does hurt the long term credibility of the guy's word

As much as I think Markus does a great job in general, I do have to say he's been very non-communicative about this particular issue. I think he regrets ever putting it on the table in the first place.

You people really crack me up. Markus has already stated that the code was harder to implement then he first thought (when was the last time *you* coded an app that could perform securely across the internet while minimizing the chances of someone cheating?)

He has also updated us fairly regularly... I count at least 7 posts since March (or better than 1 post/month) updating us --- after a fashion --- about his progress (or lack of). Uncommicative? I'd hate to see what you expect...hourly play-by-play?

[sahyder1]

Originally Posted by TigerGDK

You people really crack me up. Markus has already stated that the code was harder to implement then he first thought (when was the last time *you* coded an app that could perform securely across the internet while minimizing the chances of someone cheating?)

He has also updated us fairly regularly... I count at least 7 posts since March (or better than 1 post/month) updating us --- after a fashion --- about his progress (or lack of). Uncommicative? I'd hate to see what you expect...hourly play-by-play?

I am not a programmer but I don't go around charging 35 bucks for not programming it either. If you can't do it don't promise it either and definitely don't charge for either. Face the real world....you can't go around promising things, charging for them and not delivering. It just doesn't work that way. If you want to be considered reliable in the future you definitely can't go around screwing the present. I mean I've referred tons of people who have gone ahead and bought the game (a few of them got it because they wanted the H2H feature for a weekly Game of the week in their sims) There's a HUGE difference between an hourly play-by-play and what is currently being given.

[I Am The Game]

So, those of us who don't work at McDonald's can't complain about the way they make their burgers? And tell them "it's not hard to actually melt the cheese all the way"?

I hate that "Well you don't program so don't complain about it" logic. When you pay for something, you have your right to "complain" about YOUR product your purchased.

If we used your logic, then we could say to you: "Hey, it's our $35 (or $26). Don't tell us how to complain about the way we use our $35."

[Jeremy Weimer]

^^^ What he said.

[ctorg]

Originally Posted by TigerGDK

You people really crack me up. Markus has already stated that the code was harder to implement then he first thought (when was the last time *you* coded an app that could perform securely across the internet while minimizing the chances of someone cheating?)

He has also updated us fairly regularly... I count at least 7 posts since March (or better than 1 post/month) updating us --- after a fashion --- about his progress (or lack of). Uncommicative? I'd hate to see what you expect...hourly play-by-play?

Was this post done specifically to be provacative or something?

Come on, anyone who knows anything about business knows that you don't go promising things and then not deliver. You erode customer confidence. And the updates Markus has made have been skimpy and have promised "soon", which obviously wasn't the case.

I personally have no stake in H2H play. I wouldn't use it if it were implemented and would buy the game with or without it. However, it has been a huge hit to Markus's credibility, as much as I like how he usually has handled everything.