Double in bottom of 9th wins game!!...by 2?

rbhollow63 · 04-03-2004, 05:44 PM

I'm using OOTP5 with the latest patch. I had a situation where my team was trailing 4-3 in the bottom of the 9th. The bases were loaded and my batter hits a double driving in 3? runs for the win. Final score 4-6. Does anyone know if this is something that happens frequently? If it is a bug, it seems this one drastically needs to be addressed. Thanks for any response.

reds1 · 04-03-2004, 05:50 PM

Was there a throwing error on the play, allowing the 1st base runner to score?
Or perhaps he was a speedy runner that made it all the way from 1st to home.
I don't think it is necessarily a bug, as it can easily happen in RL.

Steve Kuffrey · 04-03-2004, 05:51 PM

Drastically? Well it is not a good thing but it is not a gamebreaker "IMO" but maybe I'd off.

Needs to be fixed, what version are you using?

In Cleveland, TN just down the road from me.

rbhollow63 · 04-03-2004, 06:20 PM

Steve,
I'm using OOTP5 with the last patch (not sure what the version number is). Maybe "drastically" is a little harsh. I don't mean to demean the game. It is pretty close to perfection as a baseball sim. I just never had heard of a game in the bottom of the ninth being won by more than a run when a homer isn't involved. I'm kind of on the fence about buying OOTP6 but I'll probably wind up getting it. Thanks for the quick response.

Le Grande Orange · 04-03-2004, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rbhollow63
I just never had heard of a game in the bottom of the ninth being won by more than a run when a homer isn't involved.

Not only that, but there was a time when even a home run would not allow a team to win in the bottom of the ninth (or extra) inning by more than one run. The batter was credited with only a hit equal to whatever number of bases was needed to get the baserunner to score the winning run. Any extra baserunners and runs scored by the home run were ignored.

A number of major league players lost home runs because of this rule.

reds1 · 04-03-2004, 06:35 PM

Dang, I overlooked the 'bottom of the ninth' part!

Hammer · 04-03-2004, 09:23 PM

LGO or anybody, any idea when that rule was changed?

Le Grande Orange · 04-03-2004, 10:42 PM

I believe the rule was changed starting with the 1920 season.

mlyons · 04-03-2004, 11:34 PM

I've seen it happen once in the 5.14 patch, too. The other little scoring bug that bothers me is when a runner's on third with less than two out and a fly ball is hit to the outfield. Occasionally, the outfielder will make a wild throw home to try to get the runner who's tagging up, and the game will score it as an error, rather than a sacrifice fly, with no RBI going to the hitter. I'm fairly sure that this would never get charged as an error in a real game, unless a runner on first or second advanced on the play. Even then, it would still count as a sac fly and an RBI.

Steve Kuffrey · 04-04-2004, 01:16 AM

Just as a followup, I've seen it a time or two but not to the extreme. It is something that I hope is corrected in v6 however.

gom · 04-04-2004, 01:05 PM

LOL! The rule was changed about a decade ago, not 1920.

Bluenoser · 04-04-2004, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gom
LOL! The rule was changed about a decade ago, not 1920.

http://www.baseball-almanac.com/rulechng.shtml

Scroll down the page until you come to 1920. It's the 3rd rule change of 5 that year.

Dagrims · 04-05-2004, 02:04 PM

It would be interesting to see a player try to get a cheap home run exploiting this rule. Say it's the bottom of the ninth, there's a man on third, and it's tied. The infield and outfield are both drawn in and the batter pokes a line drive to the gap, plating the winning run. He decides to keep running since the outfielders are coming into the dugout, knowing the game has been lost. He rounds the bases and touches home plate. Is there any rule that says this run would not count, as it's an inside the park home run?

Gastric ReFlux · 04-05-2004, 02:20 PM

This sucks. Up until I read the threadstarting post, I have loved OOTP5.

Now I just.can't.believe.it.any.more.

Hard, hard to breathe.

If this isn't fixed in 6, there'll be hell to pay.

Jonzard · 04-05-2004, 02:52 PM

Wasn't a ground rule double? If it was 2 runs instead of 3. .... that would make sense.

Bluenoser · 04-05-2004, 03:09 PM

This is from the MLB Rulebook -

GAME ENDING HITS (f) Subject to the provisions of 10.07 (g), when the batter ends a game with a safe hit which drives in as many runs as are necessary to put his team in the lead, he shall be credited with only as many bases on his hit as are advanced by the runner who scores the winning run, and then only if the batter runs out his hit for as many bases as are advanced by the runner who scores the winning run. NOTE: Apply this rule even when the batter is theoretically entitled to more bases because of being awarded an "automatic" extra base hit under various provisions of Playing Rules 6.09 and 7.05. (g) When the batter ends a game with a home run hit out of the playing field, he and any runners on base are entitled to score.

So basically once the winning run crosses the plate, the rest don't count except in the case of a homerun.

danwaechter · 04-05-2004, 11:13 PM

I'm not exactly clear on those rules. It seems to me that in the case of a ground rule double, the batter cannot be credited with a single as the rules say(the way i interpret atleast), and if there were runners on 2nd and 3rd, it seems logical to me that both would count. How is that any different from a home run?

rbhollow63 · 04-07-2004, 07:07 PM

It was not a ground rule double; just a glitch in the program I guess. Like Steve says hopefully this will be resolved in version 6.

JDOldSchool · 04-07-2004, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by danwaechter
I'm not exactly clear on those rules. It seems to me that in the case of a ground rule double, the batter cannot be credited with a single as the rules say(the way i interpret atleast), and if there were runners on 2nd and 3rd, it seems logical to me that both would count. How is that any different from a home run?

Look at it like this... A home run is a home run. It would make sense that it shouldn't just count as a single. A ground rule double, however, lands within the field of play. Because of that, it's really no different than a hit that bounces off the wall. As soon as that first run scores, the game is over. It doesn't make much sense that the game would continue once it's over. Also, I'm sure players wouldn't like getting robbed of home runs in this fashion, but having a double changed to a single is not much of an issue.

Anybody remember a few years ago when Robin Ventura hit a game winning homer in the playoffs or world series, but he stopped after reaching first base so he was officially credited with a single? Oops!

dougaiton · 04-08-2004, 05:03 AM

I've seen this happen with a non-ground rule double. An error by the outfielder on a bases loaded single meant that all baserunners advanced one base, so after the guy from third won the game, the guy on second going to third was advanced automatically in.

This problem was actually reported twice way back in 2002, again for OOTP4, and three times for OOTP5. So while it is definetly a known issue, I'd be surprised if anyone remembers it this time next year when OOTP7 is being prepared

Some threads:
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...t=bases+loaded
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...t=bases+loaded
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...t=bases+loaded
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...t=bases+loaded
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...t=bases+loaded
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...=scoring+error
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...threadid=44465

04-03-2004, 05:44 PM	#1
rbhollow63 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Cleveland, TN Posts: 45	Double in bottom of 9th wins game!!...by 2? I'm using OOTP5 with the latest patch. I had a situation where my team was trailing 4-3 in the bottom of the 9th. The bases were loaded and my batter hits a double driving in 3? runs for the win. Final score 4-6. Does anyone know if this is something that happens frequently? If it is a bug, it seems this one drastically needs to be addressed. Thanks for any response.

04-03-2004, 05:50 PM	#2
reds1 Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2002 Location: Winnipeg Posts: 3,919	Was there a throwing error on the play, allowing the 1st base runner to score? Or perhaps he was a speedy runner that made it all the way from 1st to home. I don't think it is necessarily a bug, as it can easily happen in RL. __________________ United Leagues of Braeland

04-03-2004, 05:51 PM	#3
Steve Kuffrey Administrator Join Date: Jul 1999 Location: S.E. TN - Georgia born and raised Posts: 17,023	Drastically? Well it is not a good thing but it is not a gamebreaker "IMO" but maybe I'd off. Needs to be fixed, what version are you using? In Cleveland, TN just down the road from me. __________________ Steve Kuffrey DABS Atlanta Braves - 2008 Eastern Division Champ *DBLC Atlanta Braves - 2011, 2014 East Division Champ, 2012, 2013 NL Wildcard Baseball Maelstrom-Montreal Expos-2013 Tourney winner, 2014 WC Team Sparky's League - Tampa Bay D'Rays Epicenter Baseball League - Astros 2014 The CBL Rewind - Phillies '95

04-03-2004, 06:20 PM	#4
rbhollow63 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Cleveland, TN Posts: 45	Steve, I'm using OOTP5 with the last patch (not sure what the version number is). Maybe "drastically" is a little harsh. I don't mean to demean the game. It is pretty close to perfection as a baseball sim. I just never had heard of a game in the bottom of the ninth being won by more than a run when a homer isn't involved. I'm kind of on the fence about buying OOTP6 but I'll probably wind up getting it. Thanks for the quick response. Last edited by rbhollow63; 04-11-2004 at 08:33 AM.

04-03-2004, 06:35 PM	#6
reds1 Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2002 Location: Winnipeg Posts: 3,919	Dang, I overlooked the 'bottom of the ninth' part! __________________ United Leagues of Braeland

04-03-2004, 09:23 PM	#7
Hammer Major Leagues Join Date: May 2002 Location: Horicon, Wi Posts: 330	LGO or anybody, any idea when that rule was changed?

04-03-2004, 10:42 PM	#8
Le Grande Orange Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Up There Posts: 15,644	I believe the rule was changed starting with the 1920 season.

04-03-2004, 11:34 PM	#9
mlyons Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Philadelphia Posts: 3,725	I've seen it happen once in the 5.14 patch, too. The other little scoring bug that bothers me is when a runner's on third with less than two out and a fly ball is hit to the outfield. Occasionally, the outfielder will make a wild throw home to try to get the runner who's tagging up, and the game will score it as an error, rather than a sacrifice fly, with no RBI going to the hitter. I'm fairly sure that this would never get charged as an error in a real game, unless a runner on first or second advanced on the play. Even then, it would still count as a sac fly and an RBI. __________________ Things can always be worse.

04-04-2004, 01:16 AM	#10
Steve Kuffrey Administrator Join Date: Jul 1999 Location: S.E. TN - Georgia born and raised Posts: 17,023	Just as a followup, I've seen it a time or two but not to the extreme. It is something that I hope is corrected in v6 however. __________________ Steve Kuffrey DABS Atlanta Braves - 2008 Eastern Division Champ *DBLC Atlanta Braves - 2011, 2014 East Division Champ, 2012, 2013 NL Wildcard Baseball Maelstrom-Montreal Expos-2013 Tourney winner, 2014 WC Team Sparky's League - Tampa Bay D'Rays Epicenter Baseball League - Astros 2014 The CBL Rewind - Phillies '95

04-04-2004, 01:05 PM	#11
gom Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 291	LOL! The rule was changed about a decade ago, not 1920. __________________ Commissioner of TalkSox Baseball League

04-05-2004, 02:04 PM	#13
Dagrims Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 3,827	It would be interesting to see a player try to get a cheap home run exploiting this rule. Say it's the bottom of the ninth, there's a man on third, and it's tied. The infield and outfield are both drawn in and the batter pokes a line drive to the gap, plating the winning run. He decides to keep running since the outfielders are coming into the dugout, knowing the game has been lost. He rounds the bases and touches home plate. Is there any rule that says this run would not count, as it's an inside the park home run? __________________ "Read books, get brain."

04-05-2004, 02:20 PM	#14
Gastric ReFlux Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Member #3409 Posts: 8,350	This sucks. Up until I read the threadstarting post, I have loved OOTP5. Now I just.can't.believe.it.any.more. Hard, hard to breathe. If this isn't fixed in 6, there'll be hell to pay.

04-05-2004, 02:52 PM	#15
Jonzard Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,647	Wasn't a ground rule double? If it was 2 runs instead of 3. .... that would make sense. __________________ For a scientist must indeed be freely imaginative and yet skeptical, creative and yet a critic. There is a sense in which he must be free, but another in which his thought must be very precisely regimented; there is poetry in science, but also a lot of bookkeeping. — Sir Peter B. Medawar FTB

04-05-2004, 03:09 PM	#16
Bluenoser Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: In The Moment Posts: 14,147	This is from the MLB Rulebook - GAME ENDING HITS (f) Subject to the provisions of 10.07 (g), when the batter ends a game with a safe hit which drives in as many runs as are necessary to put his team in the lead, he shall be credited with only as many bases on his hit as are advanced by the runner who scores the winning run, and then only if the batter runs out his hit for as many bases as are advanced by the runner who scores the winning run. NOTE: Apply this rule even when the batter is theoretically entitled to more bases because of being awarded an "automatic" extra base hit under various provisions of Playing Rules 6.09 and 7.05. (g) When the batter ends a game with a home run hit out of the playing field, he and any runners on base are entitled to score. So basically once the winning run crosses the plate, the rest don't count except in the case of a homerun.

04-05-2004, 11:13 PM	#17
danwaechter Minors (Single A) Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 67	I'm not exactly clear on those rules. It seems to me that in the case of a ground rule double, the batter cannot be credited with a single as the rules say(the way i interpret atleast), and if there were runners on 2nd and 3rd, it seems logical to me that both would count. How is that any different from a home run?

04-07-2004, 07:07 PM	#18
rbhollow63 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Cleveland, TN Posts: 45	It was not a ground rule double; just a glitch in the program I guess. Like Steve says hopefully this will be resolved in version 6.

04-08-2004, 05:03 AM	#20
dougaiton Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Location: Posts: 3,414	I've seen this happen with a non-ground rule double. An error by the outfielder on a bases loaded single meant that all baserunners advanced one base, so after the guy from third won the game, the guy on second going to third was advanced automatically in. This problem was actually reported twice way back in 2002, again for OOTP4, and three times for OOTP5. So while it is definetly a known issue, I'd be surprised if anyone remembers it this time next year when OOTP7 is being prepared Some threads: http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...t=bases+loaded http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...t=bases+loaded http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...t=bases+loaded http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...t=bases+loaded http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...t=bases+loaded http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...=scoring+error http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...threadid=44465 __________________ tThis shower of clowns My park-adjusted, historically split Born in '69 league file! (also at Joe's wonderful site +BBSC)