Incorrect runs charges to pitcher

ShagVT · 03-26-2002, 04:49 PM

Playing a 16 team custom league, dead-ball era.

One team's pitcher has this line:

52 GS
14-29
384.1 IP
430 HA
237 BB
322 K
104 2B
14 3B
76 HR
.283 avg
.376 obp
.519 slg

Now come the obviously wrong stats:
46 R
22 ER
0.52 ERA

There cannot be fewer runs scored than HR allowed. I wonder if the problem is that he gave up 301 R (255 + 46) and OOTP uses 8 bit short for holding runs allowed? This guy was pretty much hammered for 400 innings ... 300 runs might be a little high, but not totally implausible.

This was done using 4.0B.

My system is P2-400, 412MB RAM. I did this strictly in simulation mode, with no human controlled team.

Scott Vibert · 03-27-2002, 06:46 AM

I believe you have nailed what the problem is, but this tends not to be an issue with realistic pictcher use. Only the star pitchers for teams tended to pitch that frequently, in fact no Major League Pitcher that wasn't a hall of has thrown that many innings since the 1890's. (The pitchers in the majors that have include Ed Walsh, Grover Cleveland Alexander, Walter Johnson, none of whome gave up nearly that many runs in a season even with all those innings pitched.

So using 8 bit numbers and the 255 limit seemed reasonable given the real life history.

When Pierre's editor is back you should be able to fix some of the stats (or at least make them closer to what actually occurred).

ShagVT · 03-27-2002, 07:57 AM

Sure.

But the problem here is that this is just the game playing by itself. I'm just trying to build up a history in the league. If the pitcher is being over-used, it is a bug in the game's manager system over-using him. I just set up a fantasty league, set the era to deadball, and let it fly.

Perhaps this needs to be logged as two errors then. One for incorrect ERA calculation, and a second for poor use of pitchers in the dead-ball era / 3-man rotations.

Scott Vibert · 03-27-2002, 09:43 AM

[quote]Originally posted by ShagVT:
<strong>
Perhaps this needs to be logged as two errors then. One for incorrect ERA calculation, and a second for poor use of pitchers in the dead-ball era / 3-man rotations.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Except its not calculating the ERA incorrectly... the calculation is correct, its just the value stored is incorrect (because of the storage space issue).

The issue here is the conflict between the way players are generated in the initial pool and how pitchers were used during that period.

When you play a historical league in that era you'll notice the pitchers all import with high endurance and stellar ratings (7+). However when you create a custom league the game typically creates modern type pitchers, with decent (but not stellar) ratings and less endurance.

As a result when the game tries to use these pitchers in this fashion I suspect that what is happening is that the pitchers are tiring and getting hammered, and that some pitchers just plain weren't good enough to pitch that often and keep their stats to the numbers that seemed reasonable when perusing MLB history.

What I would suggest is checking the pitching rotations for the teams, if they are set to 3 man, try setting them to 4 man rotations, this should help things along... as the pitchers will get less starts and you shouldn't run into the data storage issue....

ShagVT · 03-27-2002, 10:51 AM

Sigh. It would get really old having to change the rotation size of every team in the league every season.

I realize you're offering me a workaround - thanks. I'm just not sure how much I like the workaround. The other option, I suppose, would be to edit the era so the typical rotation size is 4, right?

Hammer755 · 03-27-2002, 11:00 AM

[quote]Originally posted by ShagVT:
<strong>The other option, I suppose, would be to edit the era so the typical rotation size is 4, right?</strong><hr></blockquote>

That should work.

03-26-2002, 04:49 PM	#1
ShagVT Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 101	Incorrect runs charges to pitcher Playing a 16 team custom league, dead-ball era. One team's pitcher has this line: 52 GS 14-29 384.1 IP 430 HA 237 BB 322 K 104 2B 14 3B 76 HR .283 avg .376 obp .519 slg Now come the obviously wrong stats: 46 R 22 ER 0.52 ERA There cannot be fewer runs scored than HR allowed. I wonder if the problem is that he gave up 301 R (255 + 46) and OOTP uses 8 bit short for holding runs allowed? This guy was pretty much hammered for 400 innings ... 300 runs might be a little high, but not totally implausible. This was done using 4.0B. My system is P2-400, 412MB RAM. I did this strictly in simulation mode, with no human controlled team.

03-27-2002, 06:46 AM	#2
Scott Vibert Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: My Computer Posts: 8,210	I believe you have nailed what the problem is, but this tends not to be an issue with realistic pictcher use. Only the star pitchers for teams tended to pitch that frequently, in fact no Major League Pitcher that wasn't a hall of has thrown that many innings since the 1890's. (The pitchers in the majors that have include Ed Walsh, Grover Cleveland Alexander, Walter Johnson, none of whome gave up nearly that many runs in a season even with all those innings pitched. So using 8 bit numbers and the 255 limit seemed reasonable given the real life history. When Pierre's editor is back you should be able to fix some of the stats (or at least make them closer to what actually occurred).

03-27-2002, 07:57 AM	#3
ShagVT Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 101	Sure. But the problem here is that this is just the game playing by itself. I'm just trying to build up a history in the league. If the pitcher is being over-used, it is a bug in the game's manager system over-using him. I just set up a fantasty league, set the era to deadball, and let it fly. Perhaps this needs to be logged as two errors then. One for incorrect ERA calculation, and a second for poor use of pitchers in the dead-ball era / 3-man rotations.

03-27-2002, 09:43 AM	#4
Scott Vibert Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: My Computer Posts: 8,210	[quote]Originally posted by ShagVT: <strong> Perhaps this needs to be logged as two errors then. One for incorrect ERA calculation, and a second for poor use of pitchers in the dead-ball era / 3-man rotations.</strong><hr></blockquote> Except its not calculating the ERA incorrectly... the calculation is correct, its just the value stored is incorrect (because of the storage space issue). The issue here is the conflict between the way players are generated in the initial pool and how pitchers were used during that period. When you play a historical league in that era you'll notice the pitchers all import with high endurance and stellar ratings (7+). However when you create a custom league the game typically creates modern type pitchers, with decent (but not stellar) ratings and less endurance. As a result when the game tries to use these pitchers in this fashion I suspect that what is happening is that the pitchers are tiring and getting hammered, and that some pitchers just plain weren't good enough to pitch that often and keep their stats to the numbers that seemed reasonable when perusing MLB history. What I would suggest is checking the pitching rotations for the teams, if they are set to 3 man, try setting them to 4 man rotations, this should help things along... as the pitchers will get less starts and you shouldn't run into the data storage issue....

03-27-2002, 10:51 AM	#5
ShagVT Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 101	Sigh. It would get really old having to change the rotation size of every team in the league every season. I realize you're offering me a workaround - thanks. I'm just not sure how much I like the workaround. The other option, I suppose, would be to edit the era so the typical rotation size is 4, right?

03-27-2002, 11:00 AM	#6
Hammer755 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 2,348	[quote]Originally posted by ShagVT: <strong>The other option, I suppose, would be to edit the era so the typical rotation size is 4, right?</strong><hr></blockquote> That should work.