League Totals in OOTP5

RetroLeague · 06-15-2003, 03:51 PM

I posted here once before about the high ERA's in most leagues that are running OOTP5 and someone mentioned to me to adjust the league totals to fix it. Well I did this and found a very interesting behavior that I thought I would post here and get some feedback on.

I made some adjustments, first I thought by lowering the Total number of Hits it would lower the offense in the league. I set the numbers as shown below:

Total At Bats: 165201
Total Hits: 35,200
Doubles: 6500
Triples: 800
Homeruns: 4,000
Walks: 10,000
Hitbatsmen: 748
Strikeouts: 42,000

With these numbers you would expect low ERA’s and Batting Averages.

Take a look at the real stats

League Page
League Batting Stats
League Pitching

So after seeing those numbers and finding that quite an odd situation I decided to go back the other direction. I put in the following stats;

Total at Bats: 165,201
Total Hits: 65,000
Doubles: 12,000
Triples : 1,500
Homeruns: 6,789
Walks : 26,000
Hitbatsmen: 2,300
Strikeouts: 21,000

You would think this would result in an offensive blowout, look at the stats though.

League Page
League Batting
League Pitching

So would anyone like to step up and explain this odd occurence to me?

mgadfly · 06-15-2003, 04:01 PM

Yeah, the explanation is that for some unknown and never fully explained reason, OOTP works counter to what one would think happens when you adjust the numbers.

I had a similar situation. So if you want no home runs adjust it up (make sense? NO! but that is how it works).

Want less hits, adjust the hit totals up.

Etc...

Anonymous Ghost · 06-15-2003, 04:01 PM

You have to raise the totals to get lower runs. It was the same in OOTP4.

twins15 · 06-15-2003, 05:41 PM

Geez, all that hitting and still nobody broke the HR record.

Bohica · 06-15-2003, 07:07 PM

Yeah, Like Ghost said to increase your league numbers you should lower the totals. And to decrease them you should raise your league total numbers!!

Markus Heinsohn · 06-16-2003, 05:40 AM

I explained this a while back...

Here we go again:

When you decrease the number of hits in the totals, the league average drops. I.E. from .260 to .240... now, a .270 hitter looks a lot better compared to a .240 league average, therefore he gets more hits! And vice versa. When you increase the number of hits in the totals, so that you have a .300 league average, the .270 hitter looks worse and gets fewer hits... makes sense?

holyroller · 06-16-2003, 05:47 AM

*scratches head*

If I said I didn't get it, would that make me a moron?

Markus Heinsohn · 06-16-2003, 05:51 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by holyroller
*scratches head*

If I said I didn't get it, would that make me a moron?

Yes

Basically the formula for determining wether the batter gets a hit is:

Chance of a hit = [pitcher opponents batting avg (park adjusted)] multiplied with [batter batting avg (park adjusted)] divided by [league total average]

The higer the league total average, the lower the hits in this formula, and vice versa.

tcblcommish · 06-16-2003, 07:19 AM

that's a good explanation, thank Markus... I have wondered that for a while. Makes sense to me now

RetroLeague · 06-16-2003, 11:45 AM

Well I sure didn't want to start a stir.

Fortunately with the posting of the formula it makes sense at least on how it is being used.

I guess my feedback at this point would be: Calling it league totals is misleading. To me when I think league totals, I am thinking that I should take the total number of hits in the league, divided by the total number of at bats and get the league average. That is not going to work that way. If I went through history and I used the totals each season as they were historically, my total league offense would get worse each season. Perhaps if you are going to call it league totals you should write a formula to modify the numbers input into a format of something that actually resembles the totals.

Thanks for explaining it Markus, at least now I can modify my numbers to achieve the numbers I want.

Matt from TN · 08-20-2003, 04:38 PM

is there anywhere to get a spreasheet (or website) that gives suggestions for league totals of different eras?

Example, I want to start a league in the 1900's... Do I need to adjust the totals or will the era settings and player ratings take care of this?

Also, how does "recalculate totals for historical accuracy" work? Does it go off the actual league totals from the season in question?

Bohica · 08-20-2003, 06:30 PM

You can go to your league totals at the end of each season and adjust accordingly. www.Baseball-reference.com has league totals for every season posted on their website.

koohead · 08-20-2003, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by holyroller
*scratches head*

If I said I didn't get it, would that make me a moron?

Not clutch at all

Gastric ReFlux · 08-21-2003, 03:19 PM

bumped for Matt dude

DevilsAdvocate · 08-24-2003, 04:17 AM

I believe there is a internal file within OOTP, that references historical league stats. Its not based on your leagues stats at all.

My solution, simply do not recalculate at all. unless you want to change the weighted value of the individual ratings

06-15-2003, 03:51 PM	#1
RetroLeague Bat Boy Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Ventura, Ca. Posts: 15	League Totals in OOTP5 I posted here once before about the high ERA's in most leagues that are running OOTP5 and someone mentioned to me to adjust the league totals to fix it. Well I did this and found a very interesting behavior that I thought I would post here and get some feedback on. I made some adjustments, first I thought by lowering the Total number of Hits it would lower the offense in the league. I set the numbers as shown below: Total At Bats: 165201 Total Hits: 35,200 Doubles: 6500 Triples: 800 Homeruns: 4,000 Walks: 10,000 Hitbatsmen: 748 Strikeouts: 42,000 With these numbers you would expect low ERA’s and Batting Averages. Take a look at the real stats League Page League Batting Stats League Pitching So after seeing those numbers and finding that quite an odd situation I decided to go back the other direction. I put in the following stats; Total at Bats: 165,201 Total Hits: 65,000 Doubles: 12,000 Triples : 1,500 Homeruns: 6,789 Walks : 26,000 Hitbatsmen: 2,300 Strikeouts: 21,000 You would think this would result in an offensive blowout, look at the stats though. League Page League Batting League Pitching So would anyone like to step up and explain this odd occurence to me?

06-15-2003, 05:41 PM	#4
twins15 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Area 51 Posts: 4,792	Geez, all that hitting and still nobody broke the HR record. __________________ "Ah man we're just hungry man" - Dovonte Edwards Bismarck Boy Scouts of the OTBL - league yes-man Ross Gload at baseball-reference.com Book Quotes and Book Lists

06-15-2003, 07:07 PM	#5
Bohica Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Fort Wayne, IN Posts: 226	Yeah, Like Ghost said to increase your league numbers you should lower the totals. And to decrease them you should raise your league total numbers!! __________________ "I cant say it enough, if you swing the bat you can be dangerous" Joe Nuxhall

06-16-2003, 05:47 AM	#7
holyroller Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: OTBL Forums Posts: 3,532	scratches head If I said I didn't get it, would that make me a moron? __________________ Back to work, but not drawing a paycheck. TonyJ et. al.'s alias “I confused it with the chicken’s neck,” Mocanu, who was admitted to the emergency hospital in Galati, was quoted as saying. “I cut it ... and the dog rushed and ate it.”

08-20-2003, 04:38 PM	#11
Matt from TN Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: In a funk.... Posts: 3,413	is there anywhere to get a spreasheet (or website) that gives suggestions for league totals of different eras? Example, I want to start a league in the 1900's... Do I need to adjust the totals or will the era settings and player ratings take care of this? Also, how does "recalculate totals for historical accuracy" work? Does it go off the actual league totals from the season in question? __________________ Set in Stone... Players Remain with Original Franchise

06-15-2003, 04:01 PM	#2
mgadfly Minors (Single A) Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Spokane Posts: 92	Yeah, the explanation is that for some unknown and never fully explained reason, OOTP works counter to what one would think happens when you adjust the numbers. I had a similar situation. So if you want no home runs adjust it up (make sense? NO! but that is how it works). Want less hits, adjust the hit totals up. Etc...

06-15-2003, 04:01 PM	#3
Anonymous Ghost All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 751	You have to raise the totals to get lower runs. It was the same in OOTP4.

06-16-2003, 05:40 AM	#6
Markus Heinsohn Developer OOTP Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Germany Posts: 24,805	I explained this a while back... Here we go again: When you decrease the number of hits in the totals, the league average drops. I.E. from .260 to .240... now, a .270 hitter looks a lot better compared to a .240 league average, therefore he gets more hits! And vice versa. When you increase the number of hits in the totals, so that you have a .300 league average, the .270 hitter looks worse and gets fewer hits... makes sense?

06-16-2003, 07:19 AM	#9
tcblcommish Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 3,439	that's a good explanation, thank Markus... I have wondered that for a while. Makes sense to me now

06-16-2003, 11:45 AM	#10
RetroLeague Bat Boy Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Ventura, Ca. Posts: 15	Well I sure didn't want to start a stir. Fortunately with the posting of the formula it makes sense at least on how it is being used. I guess my feedback at this point would be: Calling it league totals is misleading. To me when I think league totals, I am thinking that I should take the total number of hits in the league, divided by the total number of at bats and get the league average. That is not going to work that way. If I went through history and I used the totals each season as they were historically, my total league offense would get worse each season. Perhaps if you are going to call it league totals you should write a formula to modify the numbers input into a format of something that actually resembles the totals. Thanks for explaining it Markus, at least now I can modify my numbers to achieve the numbers I want.

08-20-2003, 06:30 PM	#12
Bohica Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Fort Wayne, IN Posts: 226	You can go to your league totals at the end of each season and adjust accordingly. www.Baseball-reference.com has league totals for every season posted on their website. __________________ "I cant say it enough, if you swing the bat you can be dangerous" Joe Nuxhall

08-21-2003, 03:19 PM	#14
Gastric ReFlux Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Member #3409 Posts: 8,350	bumped for Matt dude

08-24-2003, 04:17 AM	#15
DevilsAdvocate Bat Boy Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Belize Posts: 14	I believe there is a internal file within OOTP, that references historical league stats. Its not based on your leagues stats at all. My solution, simply do not recalculate at all. unless you want to change the weighted value of the individual ratings __________________ ________________________ Le veré en infierno