What is the penalty for tanking?

[Eckstein 4 Prez]

I'm just curious. My team is doing well enough to be in a league with a few whales. One of them had a 2-38 record and basically a rookie league roster, despite having risen to a pretty high league. I reported them and it seems they made a few changes - now they have a handful of gold pitchers, Oscar Charleston and Josh Gibson, and a rookie league roster. They've gone 7-5 with this pretty trashy team so now they are 9-43.

Honestly, since I'm not spending money on PT and am not going to, I don't care much about the dilution of points or whatever. What bothers me is having a league where 29 teams are trying to win and one team is trying to go 0-40. I'd just like to know if there are any real safeguards or if this player is just getting a slap on the wrist.

[professor ape]

Originally Posted by Eckstein 4 Prez

I'm just curious. My team is doing well enough to be in a league with a few whales. One of them had a 2-38 record and basically a rookie league roster, despite having risen to a pretty high league. I reported them and it seems they made a few changes - now they have a handful of gold pitchers, Oscar Charleston and Josh Gibson, and a rookie league roster. They've gone 7-5 with this pretty trashy team so now they are 9-43.

Honestly, since I'm not spending money on PT and am not going to, I don't care much about the dilution of points or whatever. What bothers me is having a league where 29 teams are trying to win and one team is trying to go 0-40. I'd just like to know if there are any real safeguards or if this player is just getting a slap on the wrist.

I believe that the first offense is pretty much a warning but it can escalate from there up to having the team booted.

[Warfsu]

What’s the benefit of tanking?

[Torgonius]

Originally Posted by Warfsu

What’s the benefit of tanking?

If you have a potent offensive team, wallowing in the lowest levels in a park built for offense, you can rack up huge amounts of PP beating up on weak and ghost teams through in game accomplishments.

PP generation this way drops off dramatically as you increase levels and face better competition.

[Kris Jardine]

To answer your question, there is no standard X, Y, Z in terms of how we handle a case. Each report is different and sometimes actions needs to be escalated based on the circumstances. It's more thought out than that

[Eckstein 4 Prez]

Originally Posted by Kris Jardine

To answer your question, there is no standard X, Y, Z in terms of how we handle a case. Each report is different and sometimes actions needs to be escalated based on the circumstances. It's more thought out than that

Thanks. I sort of suspected there wasn't a real standard.

I'd be pissed as hell if I were a person spending money on this because it's diluting the value of the points people buy. For me, this is basically a baseball card-opening game - I got lucky enough to get a couple historical 100s early on and sold them off for enough packs to be able to complete the live missions, which is why my freebie team has snuck into a gold league.

However, I do feel that as a responsible community member I should bring these shenanigans to broader attention. So, if any of you should come across owner bholmes555 - currently playing under the name "Krypton Vipers" - you should know that they are earning points through tanking instead of earning them honestly.

[HRBaker]

Originally Posted by Kris Jardine

To answer your question, there is no standard X, Y, Z in terms of how we handle a case. Each report is different and sometimes actions needs to be escalated based on the circumstances. It's more thought out than that

Kris,
I still find it hard to believe that a routine couldn't be added to the game that would require some minimal percentage of the teams total "value" be on the Active Roster at all times. If your total team roster is worth 800 (whatever that number was decided to mean) you would have to have at least 50% of it on your active roster at all times. If you tried to make a roster move that brought you under that value, you would get a message that would not allow it.This would, in effect, limit how much you could "dissolve" your active roster and basically do away with the tanking issue altogether.

[pstrickert]

Originally Posted by Eckstein 4 Prez

Thanks. I sort of suspected there wasn't a real standard.

In the past, once in a while, we'd see a team get banned. But we'd also see nothing happen to a team even though it was reported multiple times over a period of weeks or months. So, if there's a rhyme or reason, it's beyond me. I don't trust the process. It's one reason I spend far less time in PT than I used to. But that's just me.

[bailey]

Tanking is overrated as a means of earning PP. By far the best source of PP is winning packs in tournaments and that is completely legal.

[fredbeene]

sometimes i get tired of playing the same rosters and it is fun or was fun to see how low i could go and still win
sometimes you want to develop your defense....meh....
you could make counter arguement that i don't want to me in league of whales who bought their players......why should i be penalized because i don't make as much money to spend on the game??

[Tinkerman]

I never thought that having about 50% more cards than the total number of unique ones that there will be, would technically become more taboo than tanking.

[ncap99]

I wouldn't call it tanking, but I had a really rough start to this season (like 20-40 type start) and decided to do some positional training and things. I look at it as no different then pro teams do with playing youth over vets in many sports. Some might say I'm not doing my best to win and that qualifies as tanking, but I am trying to give myself a better chance to win down the road on an already pretty much lost season. I'll probably end up getting relegated and winning a lot of games next season but I still don't see that as a big issue.

I have seen the obvious tank squads that are running bronze players in gold+ leagues yet you look at their records over previous seasons and its a bunch of championships and .700+ winning %. I think that is pretty weak.

[stan-theman]

Suppose you had in your lineup 2-3 Pitchers rated thats say 97+ and Wed/Thurs they really suck 3-8 ,2-7 or something like that.And the only other Pitchers on your reserve are 60-70 rated would that be tanking for giving them a shot!Only way to see how they do is put them on main roster.I think in PT19 i had 69=Gwynn,Carew and Madlock and they were great !!

[Fenixdown]

Originally Posted by stan-theman

Suppose you had in your lineup 2-3 Pitchers rated thats say 97+ and Wed/Thurs they really suck 3-8 ,2-7 or something like that.And the only other Pitchers on your reserve are 60-70 rated would that be tanking for giving them a shot!Only way to see how they do is put them on main roster.I think in PT19 i had 69=Gwynn,Carew and Madlock and they were great !!

Those cards had ridiculous contact totals in a version that way overemphasized the contact stat.



Pitchers don't work that way, period. Bronze level pitchers have at least one incredibly low stat that will cause them to get absolutely destroyed by high level cards. Sorry, that's tanking.


But don't worry. Out of the Pockets doesn't punish tankers because they leave it to community reports to locate them. And as I pointed out last year, tankers don't get reported when they are tanking (this thread being an exception, not a rule). They get reported when they're back to a league where their .800 win percentage team is racking up several thousands of free PP. But since that season they didn't tank, Out of the Pockets does nothing. I reported two teams who were clearcut tankers and nothing ever happened to either of them. So....yeah.


Also, OP, odds are the team you reported didn't even make those changes because of a slap on the wrists from your report. Tankers have gotten smarter each year of PT. They make changes during the season to "appear" to not be tanking so if a report happens to come down, it "looks" like they weren't, and nothing happens.

[Hertston]

Originally Posted by HRBaker

Kris,
I still find it hard to believe that a routine couldn't be added to the game that would require some minimal percentage of the teams total "value" be on the Active Roster at all times. If your total team roster is worth 800 (whatever that number was decided to mean) you would have to have at least 50% of it on your active roster at all times. If you tried to make a roster move that brought you under that value, you would get a message that would not allow it.This would, in effect, limit how much you could "dissolve" your active roster and basically do away with the tanking issue altogether.

It would need a rather more complex algorithm as the 'worth' of the total roster is largely dependent on how you choose to collect cards. For example, many cards are acquired for collections with no intent of ever using them in-game. It's also perfectly legitimate to play as a trader, buying low and selling high at the appropriate time, which obviously could involve holding high value 'stock'.

The intent is to remove tanking, not stop people from playing as they wish. For example, many prefer 'theme teams' rather than 'best available' just for the challenge of trying to get the best out of them, or simply for the aesthetics. Somebody who, say, chooses to use only historical Dodgers players in the active roster shouldn't be penalized for collecting the MLB cards as well.

[Kris Jardine]

Originally Posted by HRBaker

Kris,
I still find it hard to believe that a routine couldn't be added to the game that would require some minimal percentage of the teams total "value" be on the Active Roster at all times. If your total team roster is worth 800 (whatever that number was decided to mean) you would have to have at least 50% of it on your active roster at all times. If you tried to make a roster move that brought you under that value, you would get a message that would not allow it.This would, in effect, limit how much you could "dissolve" your active roster and basically do away with the tanking issue altogether.

There is already an automated tanking check and warning system in game that was originally implemented in PT21. It's not perfect however, so there are still situations where manual reviews are required

[tentin_quarantino]

I think you should say the penalty for tanking is death, but when someone gets busted you should be like, okay, we'll let you off with a disqualification this time. That way everyone's happy, the tanker for not dying and everyone else because they got the DQ.

[HelpDodgers]

Originally Posted by warfsu

what’s the benefit of tanking?

pp

[SF Giants]

The warning means that you won't be able to buy/sell any cards and won't get any points.

Actually I got this warning more than two weeks ago and since that it wasn't lifted.

I did what some others were doing - bought good hitters and the worst pitchers. Goal was to stay in lower tier league and rack up more points. I repeated this on other accounts under the license. It wasn’t precisely tanking – as I was on 8-12 record in that time of ban ('warning'), plus I went 81-81 with same roster previous season. I feel that I didn't destroy fun for anyone in matter of facing super tough/ super weak opponent except for myself (ironically I stayed down in rookie just to rack up points and be competitive later).

Just to say out loud how I got triggered (assumably). The issue came when I started to collect some live cards for speculation on changing tier and I believe that I got triggered because of them. (many of those were Biebers and Chapmans)

After the warning I adjusted my roster right way, if that is forbidden then fine, no problem, I won't do it anymore. That's why the warning is there for, right? ... so I adjusted the roster and e-mailed to PT Support to lift the restrictions (in auction house and earning PPs). No reply. In three days I tried again. No reply. Then once again and yesterday for the forth time. No reply, no automatic lift of ban, no information about when the restriction will be removed ... nothing.
Did I deserve the warning? Based on the rules (which were sent to me by mail with the warning), I'd say yes. Did I deserve not to know if I will be ever able to fully play the game again? I think not...

[HRBaker]

When a company is purchased, chaos reigns. In my 42 year career at the same company, we were involved in two buyouts, and the two years after those buyouts were sheer chaos. Everyone is overworked and half the time no one knows who is responsible for what.


I suspect that's partially what's happening now within OOTP. If my experiences are any indication, this year will be a rough road until inner-office procedures settle out.


On the original issue, tanking has never been clearly defined. If we're ever going to make this a non-issue, either the game must stop it from happening or there must be a clear and concise definition of what it is. Otherwise, these discussions will drone on forever.