Value Contract?

NoOne · 03-07-2018, 12:33 AM

financial environment: 30-32M is a ~max salary 99% of the time.

Signed this guy going into age 25 2069 season for 7years 8.75M. He had 2 seasons of starting at ~130 ops+ and ~4.7WAR. 305/358/515 and 327/362/515 slashes. Then, 3 MVP seasons followed. Lost to an 11.4WAR CF in '71. We'll see if i cna get a ~3 year contract extension or in FA. if i had known he'd be this good, i'd have waited another 2 years before buying up arb years... assuming he was interested. plus, it would have been ~16-20M or more per year.

One Post Wonder · 03-09-2018, 12:13 AM

I really doubt that a guy like that would agree to a 3 year contract. Maybe Team Options would keep the length at least somewhat manageable though.

Also while his last season was great, it was a slight drop from his previous years. Not a big deal ordinarily, but it is a big deal if he's trying to sign a megabucks contract. I'd be looking closely at his defensive and BB/K numbers and make sure he's not starting to decline.

If he won't sign a 3-5 year contract, I'd probably trade him. You'd literally be able to get any player in the league that you want. His value is never going to be higher. If this is a solo league you could even resign him and trade him at 30 or 31.

NoOne · 03-09-2018, 05:13 PM

you'd be surprised... also, 7 is max, so it's not as difficult in my league.

i see alot of expensive older guys only getting 2-3 years. the trick is not being the first person to offer them a contract.

it won't be an extension.. he'll ask for 7years ~25-30M for sure. i'll let him hit FA and see what happens... "31" might be too young.

stats dropped but his ratings are the same = same player regardless of 1 season's results.

i'll trade in last year if he doesn't maintain consistent numbers.. i consider all 4 of those years ~equal. i don't see a dropoff at all from the perspective of the player's ability.. it's a normal range of results for his ratings.

i never use options. they make it more costly to sign. there are ways to reduce # of years sought.. like i said, don't be the first, but also offer a 1 or 2 contracts the guy doesn't like... they typically will change their demand a bit... which is typically shorter in duration and you can knock off another year if needed too.

same with IAFA in july... if you are first to offer, you basically need to double it to get them to sign... if you are the 2nd or third to offer you can double a much smaller value and get them signed much more cheaply.

they high-demand iafa guys may not work this way, obviously.. once you get to cap, it's just non-money factors deciding between teams.

i signed this guy a bit too young... but when i clicked and saw "8.75M" as the demand... i broke a rule i typically adhere too... all contracts are timed with purpose... either age or up-and-coming prospect etc etc.. 1-2year overlap can easily be traded away. age is key for their first non-arbitration contract... i shoot for ~32 as the last year.. thnk this guy is just turning 31 in his last year. i'd go as high as 33 with the truly amazing ratings like his.

but, if he decrapifies at 30-31, i won't feel bad at all abut missing those 1-2 years. the guys that have further to fall are more liekly to eke out that 1 last good year at an older age.

One Post Wonder · 03-10-2018, 06:32 PM

Ah, you set up a bit differently than me. I use 10 year max contracts and therefore big stars will almost always ask for 7-9 years. With team options, I can get that down to 5 years, so I'm a big fan of those options. It's more money per year, but I don't mind paying big money for a performer. I absolutely hate paying for dead space though.

In my experience, if a player doesn't like my demand he'll often ask for more than his original offer! I think the negotiation process in OOTP still needs a bit of work. So I don't generally push too hard in negotiations.

With me, I'm really pitching/defense oriented. I have no doubt that this player will continue to hit until probably his mid 30's at least. But a lot of such players, their defense becomes unacceptable to me way before that. An average defender can enter what I consider to be 'terrible' territory by the time he's 30 or 31. That's the thing that worries me a lot about the long term signings. I just can't play, say a LF with a range of 35/100, even if he is Babe Ruth with the bat.

I definitely should be more adaptable. This solo run I'm doing right now with the Cubs is one of the first times I've ever run a somewhat offensive-oriented team in a hitters park, even though I've been playing OOTP for over 15 years and have probably simmed several thousand seasons.

NoOne · 03-10-2018, 09:19 PM

i trade while they have value.

an option is typically worst way to lose talent, because no compensation reward in those situations. i guess it's a good "oh s%%t" button. that doesn't discount the fact you get nothing in return each time.

there are easy ways to avoid financial problems or forcing your hand. that sort of situation should never happen. TCR-related aside. that should easily be abosrbed based on how infrequently it will occur.

what's dead space?

my players never get that old except when i am corrupted by an attachment to a particular career. i used to play with 10 year max contracts... it doesn't affect what i do, just the timing of it shifts a couple years. i made that change for the AI's sake.

03-07-2018, 12:33 AM	#1
NoOne Banned Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,273 Infractions: 0/2 (4)	Value Contract? financial environment: 30-32M is a ~max salary 99% of the time. Signed this guy going into age 25 2069 season for 7years 8.75M. He had 2 seasons of starting at ~130 ops+ and ~4.7WAR. 305/358/515 and 327/362/515 slashes. Then, 3 MVP seasons followed. Lost to an 11.4WAR CF in '71. We'll see if i cna get a ~3 year contract extension or in FA. if i had known he'd be this good, i'd have waited another 2 years before buying up arb years... assuming he was interested. plus, it would have been ~16-20M or more per year. Attached Images Last edited by NoOne; 03-07-2018 at 12:35 AM.

03-09-2018, 05:13 PM	#3
NoOne Banned Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,273 Infractions: 0/2 (4)	you'd be surprised... also, 7 is max, so it's not as difficult in my league. i see alot of expensive older guys only getting 2-3 years. the trick is not being the first person to offer them a contract. it won't be an extension.. he'll ask for 7years ~25-30M for sure. i'll let him hit FA and see what happens... "31" might be too young. stats dropped but his ratings are the same = same player regardless of 1 season's results. i'll trade in last year if he doesn't maintain consistent numbers.. i consider all 4 of those years ~equal. i don't see a dropoff at all from the perspective of the player's ability.. it's a normal range of results for his ratings. i never use options. they make it more costly to sign. there are ways to reduce # of years sought.. like i said, don't be the first, but also offer a 1 or 2 contracts the guy doesn't like... they typically will change their demand a bit... which is typically shorter in duration and you can knock off another year if needed too. same with IAFA in july... if you are first to offer, you basically need to double it to get them to sign... if you are the 2nd or third to offer you can double a much smaller value and get them signed much more cheaply. they high-demand iafa guys may not work this way, obviously.. once you get to cap, it's just non-money factors deciding between teams. i signed this guy a bit too young... but when i clicked and saw "8.75M" as the demand... i broke a rule i typically adhere too... all contracts are timed with purpose... either age or up-and-coming prospect etc etc.. 1-2year overlap can easily be traded away. age is key for their first non-arbitration contract... i shoot for ~32 as the last year.. thnk this guy is just turning 31 in his last year. i'd go as high as 33 with the truly amazing ratings like his. but, if he decrapifies at 30-31, i won't feel bad at all abut missing those 1-2 years. the guys that have further to fall are more liekly to eke out that 1 last good year at an older age. Last edited by NoOne; 03-09-2018 at 05:19 PM.

03-10-2018, 06:32 PM	#4
One Post Wonder All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 538	Ah, you set up a bit differently than me. I use 10 year max contracts and therefore big stars will almost always ask for 7-9 years. With team options, I can get that down to 5 years, so I'm a big fan of those options. It's more money per year, but I don't mind paying big money for a performer. I absolutely hate paying for dead space though. In my experience, if a player doesn't like my demand he'll often ask for more than his original offer! I think the negotiation process in OOTP still needs a bit of work. So I don't generally push too hard in negotiations. With me, I'm really pitching/defense oriented. I have no doubt that this player will continue to hit until probably his mid 30's at least. But a lot of such players, their defense becomes unacceptable to me way before that. An average defender can enter what I consider to be 'terrible' territory by the time he's 30 or 31. That's the thing that worries me a lot about the long term signings. I just can't play, say a LF with a range of 35/100, even if he is Babe Ruth with the bat. I definitely should be more adaptable. This solo run I'm doing right now with the Cubs is one of the first times I've ever run a somewhat offensive-oriented team in a hitters park, even though I've been playing OOTP for over 15 years and have probably simmed several thousand seasons. Last edited by One Post Wonder; 03-10-2018 at 06:34 PM.

03-09-2018, 12:13 AM	#2
One Post Wonder All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 538	I really doubt that a guy like that would agree to a 3 year contract. Maybe Team Options would keep the length at least somewhat manageable though. Also while his last season was great, it was a slight drop from his previous years. Not a big deal ordinarily, but it is a big deal if he's trying to sign a megabucks contract. I'd be looking closely at his defensive and BB/K numbers and make sure he's not starting to decline. If he won't sign a 3-5 year contract, I'd probably trade him. You'd literally be able to get any player in the league that you want. His value is never going to be higher. If this is a solo league you could even resign him and trade him at 30 or 31.

03-10-2018, 09:19 PM	#5
NoOne Banned Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,273 Infractions: 0/2 (4)	i trade while they have value. an option is typically worst way to lose talent, because no compensation reward in those situations. i guess it's a good "oh s%%t" button. that doesn't discount the fact you get nothing in return each time. there are easy ways to avoid financial problems or forcing your hand. that sort of situation should never happen. TCR-related aside. that should easily be abosrbed based on how infrequently it will occur. what's dead space? my players never get that old except when i am corrupted by an attachment to a particular career. i used to play with 10 year max contracts... it doesn't affect what i do, just the timing of it shifts a couple years. i made that change for the AI's sake.