Pitching Starts

henry296 · 04-11-2017, 06:53 AM

With the MLB QuickStart, I'm seeing too many pitchers make 30 plus starts. About 80-90 in my sims compared to about 60 last year. I've already turned up injuries to realistic. I tried playing with the evaluation settings to get the AI to look more at current stats to bench more starters and try other stuff but that hasn't helped much.

I've thought about increasing injuries more and playing with the injuries file to get more did DTD injuries. Any other ideas to get more rosters moves?

jabail · 04-11-2017, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by henry296

With the MLB QuickStart, I'm seeing too many pitchers make 30 plus starts. About 80-90 in my sims compared to about 60 last year. I've already turned up injuries to realistic. I tried playing with the evaluation settings to get the AI to look more at current stats to bench more starters and try other stuff but that hasn't helped much.

I've thought about increasing injuries more and playing with the injuries file to get more did DTD injuries. Any other ideas to get more rosters moves?

I posted the same issue in the bug reports forum, but nothing was resolved. The next thing I might try is reducing starting pitcher stamina and seeing if that's the issue. Maybe starters are getting rested too quickly?

NoOne · 04-11-2017, 05:42 PM

it's probably a results of "real" palyers.

that's difficult to plan for in comparison to the fictionally created players that they hand-pick min/max/mean/range etc..

there's probably too many 'over-rated' real players OR the backups are that much worse so that real players play more over the first 10-15 years etc..

i gues si should have asked - comparing to last years first few years, too? or ~15-20+ years into a 2016 real league? the latter applies, the previous would be a clear difference from last year -- but not neccessarily 'wrong' .. what's frequency of RL sp with ~30+ starts year-to-year using a large enough sample?

it's also possible that last year was the "off" one.

henry296 · 04-11-2017, 09:04 PM

My season was from the first season of the 2017 QuickStart. I looked at 2015 MLB and it was 66 over 30 and 68 in 2014. The real trend is slight decreases each year.

I just simmed with very high injuries and it wa 78 in my sim. Also interesting in 2015 MLB 314 pitchers made a start vs 250 in the sim. That is almost two more per team. I think teams don't make enough performance related lineup changes.

Last year the pirates use daily 10 starters by the all star break. Some of that was injury but also benching bad players and bringing up prospects.

Rain King · 04-12-2017, 09:28 AM

What is your injury setting?

Lukas Berger · 04-12-2017, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rain King

What is your injury setting?

Important question there! Are you guys using the realistic modern day injury setting? If not, it's going to result in more players playing more than they do irl.

If you are using that setting, we might need to look at making a few tweaks.

henry296 · 04-12-2017, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lukas Berger

Important question there! Are you guys using the realistic modern day injury setting? If not, it's going to result in more players playing more than they do irl.

If you are using that setting, we might need to look at making a few tweaks.

I've actually cranked up to the High setting and still seeing too many starts.

jabail · 04-12-2017, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by henry296

I've actually cranked up to the High setting and still seeing too many starts.

I also cranked it all the way up to test it and got the same results.

Lukas Berger · 04-12-2017, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by henry296

I've actually cranked up to the High setting and still seeing too many starts.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jabail

I also cranked it all the way up to test it and got the same results.

What're the actual numbers you guys are seeing? Do they change at all from what's mentioned above?

henry296 · 04-12-2017, 11:32 AM

Lukas,

One more fact, I ran a 2016 historical sim last night with High injuries and had over 100 pitchers make 30 starts. Pretty much every team had 4 starters make all of their starts. This is related to a post I made about historical injuries on the Historical sim forum.

Lukas Berger · 04-12-2017, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by henry296

Lukas,

One more fact, I ran a 2016 historical sim last night with High injuries and had over 100 pitchers make 30 starts. Pretty much every team had 4 starters make all of their starts. This is related to a post I made about historical injuries on the Historical sim forum.

Hmm, that definitely doesn't seem right.

Lukas Berger · 04-12-2017, 11:39 AM

I am seeing the same thing in my sims, my last 2017 quickstart sim had 96 pitchers starting over 30 games. All of my sims seem to have more than 90 guys at 30+ starts.

So I think we'll definitely have to take a look at this.

Rain King · 04-12-2017, 01:28 PM

Another question, what are your evaluation settings? If they are really high on Ratings they may not be removing pitchers who are not performing well from the rotation.

henry296 · 04-12-2017, 08:58 PM

Most of these tests are default or more weight in stats.

Orcin · 04-13-2017, 08:57 AM

I hope the people complaining about too many injuries are reading this thread. Perhaps we could put the two groups together for a round table discussion... fun or realism?

Lukas Berger · 04-13-2017, 09:08 AM

Markus made some tweaks to help with this.

He also had this to say, which makes sense to me:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

However, this is more a (complicated) AI issue, as in real life managers experiment much more with the rotation, something which the AI cannot mirror.

henry296 · 04-13-2017, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lukas Berger

Markus made some tweaks to help with this.

He also had this to say, which makes sense to me:

Thanks for following up and making the adjustment.

I understand Markus' thought on that topic and which gets to one of my other threads on In Season Development. How do we get the AI to tinker more as that would truly replicate a real life manager. The Scouting System provides some means for a human manager to tinker based on relying more on stats then ratings.

PhillieFever · 04-13-2017, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orcin

I hope the people complaining about too many injuries are reading this thread. Perhaps we could put the two groups together for a round table discussion... fun or realism?

People have been complaining about too many injuries for years! Fact is however that most of the complainers simply don't realize how many injuries there really are in baseball. Using the normal setting for instance almost always results in injuries being much lower than real life, including long term 60 day DL types.

henry296 · 04-13-2017, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhillieFever

People have been complaining about too many injuries for years! Fact is however that most of the complainers simply don't realize how many injuries there really are in baseball. Using the normal setting for instance almost always results in injuries being much lower than real life, including long term 60 day DL types.

Since last Friday, 18 players have been placed on the DL in real life.

Lukas Berger · 04-13-2017, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by henry296

Thanks for following up and making the adjustment.

I understand Markus' thought on that topic and which gets to one of my other threads on In Season Development. How do we get the AI to tinker more as that would truly replicate a real life manager. The Scouting System provides some means for a human manager to tinker based on relying more on stats then ratings.

I'm not really sure what would do that to be honest!

04-11-2017, 06:53 AM	#1
henry296 All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 514	Pitching Starts With the MLB QuickStart, I'm seeing too many pitchers make 30 plus starts. About 80-90 in my sims compared to about 60 last year. I've already turned up injuries to realistic. I tried playing with the evaluation settings to get the AI to look more at current stats to bench more starters and try other stuff but that hasn't helped much. I've thought about increasing injuries more and playing with the injuries file to get more did DTD injuries. Any other ideas to get more rosters moves?

04-12-2017, 11:39 AM	#12
Lukas Berger OOTP Developments Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Nice, Côte d'Azur, France Posts: 21,128	I am seeing the same thing in my sims, my last 2017 quickstart sim had 96 pitchers starting over 30 games. All of my sims seem to have more than 90 guys at 30+ starts. So I think we'll definitely have to take a look at this. __________________ lukas@ootpdevelopments.com PreOrder Out of the Park Baseball 26! Need to upload files for us to check out? Instructions can be found here Last edited by Lukas Berger; 04-12-2017 at 11:46 AM.

04-11-2017, 05:42 PM	#3
NoOne Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,236	it's probably a results of "real" palyers. that's difficult to plan for in comparison to the fictionally created players that they hand-pick min/max/mean/range etc.. there's probably too many 'over-rated' real players OR the backups are that much worse so that real players play more over the first 10-15 years etc.. i gues si should have asked - comparing to last years first few years, too? or ~15-20+ years into a 2016 real league? the latter applies, the previous would be a clear difference from last year -- but not neccessarily 'wrong' .. what's frequency of RL sp with ~30+ starts year-to-year using a large enough sample? it's also possible that last year was the "off" one.

04-11-2017, 09:04 PM	#4
henry296 All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 514	My season was from the first season of the 2017 QuickStart. I looked at 2015 MLB and it was 66 over 30 and 68 in 2014. The real trend is slight decreases each year. I just simmed with very high injuries and it wa 78 in my sim. Also interesting in 2015 MLB 314 pitchers made a start vs 250 in the sim. That is almost two more per team. I think teams don't make enough performance related lineup changes. Last year the pirates use daily 10 starters by the all star break. Some of that was injury but also benching bad players and bringing up prospects.

04-12-2017, 09:28 AM	#5
Rain King Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 2,982 Infractions: 1/0 (0)	What is your injury setting?

04-12-2017, 11:32 AM	#10
henry296 All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 514	Lukas, One more fact, I ran a 2016 historical sim last night with High injuries and had over 100 pitchers make 30 starts. Pretty much every team had 4 starters make all of their starts. This is related to a post I made about historical injuries on the Historical sim forum.

04-12-2017, 01:28 PM	#13
Rain King Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 2,982 Infractions: 1/0 (0)	Another question, what are your evaluation settings? If they are really high on Ratings they may not be removing pitchers who are not performing well from the rotation.

04-12-2017, 08:58 PM	#14
henry296 All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 514	Most of these tests are default or more weight in stats.

04-13-2017, 08:57 AM	#15
Orcin Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Indiana Posts: 9,847 Infractions: 1/0 (0)	I hope the people complaining about too many injuries are reading this thread. Perhaps we could put the two groups together for a round table discussion... fun or realism?