HOF or not?

sabrtoothtiger · 07-18-2014, 11:54 PM

Looking through league history, making automatic HOF inductions... does this player deserve to be in the HOF? Does the Gale Sayers rule apply?

Flirted with .400 3 times and was in the middle of his best season yet when he suffered a career ending injury.

Has anyone else seen potential greats have careers cut short?

Questdog · 07-18-2014, 11:57 PM

Major League rule is that a player needs to play 10 seasons to be eligible.

jpeters1734 · 07-19-2014, 08:07 AM

nah, I'd say if he played a full season for those 3 seasons then maybe

JMDurron · 07-19-2014, 11:33 AM

Nope, this guy goes into the Nomar Garciaparra Memorial "What if he had stayed healthy?!?" Hall of Pain.

Where Kirby Puckett should be...

Honorable_Pawn · 07-19-2014, 11:54 AM

Nope.

1,065 hits ain't gonna git 'er done

ThatSeventiesGuy · 07-19-2014, 11:59 AM

Nope. Eight or nine seasons, sure. Only six? Sample size is a bit too small.

With a bat like that, though, I'd be tempted to "uninjure" the guy after he missed a season or two.

Honorable_Pawn · 07-19-2014, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThatSeventiesGuy

With a bat like that, though, I'd be tempted to "uninjure" the guy after he missed a season or two.

Not me, I love when this happens. The what-ifs are fun to me. I would consider naming the rookie of the year award after him though.

ThatSeventiesGuy · 07-19-2014, 12:33 PM

My rule for "career ending" injuries of a guy in his prime tends to be that he misses the rest of the season plus the next, then maybe I edit him back to the land of the healthy. This is in my league that's currently in 2038, so I just say medical advances worked for him.

Giants44 · 07-19-2014, 02:35 PM

Wow, those were some dominant impressive seasons. Lifetime .378 is unreal, even in a short career.

I would say his "real life" chances to make hall of fame would depend on two things:

1. did his team win championships (2+ titles would really increase his chances,especially because Col is not a team with a lot of championships)
2. was he a big\likeable personality (obviously hard to tell from game, but in real life I think this matters a lot) Watching Kirby Puckett was fun in a way that watching Jim Rice was not)

dmacgreg37 · 07-19-2014, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giants44

Wow, those were some dominant impressive seasons. Lifetime .378 is unreal, even in a short career.

I would say his "real life" chances to make hall of fame would depend on two things:

1. did his team win championships (2+ titles would really increase his chances,especially because Col is not a team with a lot of championships)
2. was he a big\likeable personality (obviously hard to tell from game, but in real life I think this matters a lot) Watching Kirby Puckett was fun in a way that watching Jim Rice was not)

As said above, his "real life" chances would be 0% due to the 10 year rule.

I'd be choked though to have this guy fall out of my league. Would consider editing him back in after a year and a half.

OakDragon · 07-19-2014, 02:47 PM

I guess I'm the lone softie in that I'd put him in my Hall. That's a long enough and impressive enough (in combo) career for me.

ThatSeventiesGuy's comment though, made me think maybe there ought to be a setting where after 2050 or so, CEI's don't happen.

jwinn66 · 07-19-2014, 03:24 PM

Hopefully CEI's go away. I'd live to see artificial ligaments,etc. not sure though that there's be any chance of this guy getting in the HOF. He'd possibly get a display in Cooperstown along with other "almost" HOFers. But no plaque.

hfield007 · 07-19-2014, 03:36 PM

Ungodly war for not even finishing seasons.

I think it comes down to whether you value ability or longevity more. I guess perfection would be finding a nice balance. But look at Sandy Koufax, a great run for 5-6 years and nothing else of great value.

Honorable_Pawn · 07-19-2014, 04:59 PM

I don't think players (now or in the future) should be allowed to play with artificial ligaments. It could give them a competitive edge. If steroids are banned then so should artificial ligaments. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

So, what does this have to do with the topic? Well, since I feel that artificial ligaments should also be banned then I disagree with "un-retiring" players for this reason. However, if you are willing to allow steroids (bump up the league-modifiers) then maybe I would reconsider.

Tram2Whitaker · 07-20-2014, 12:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwinn66

Hopefully CEI's go away. I'd live to see artificial ligaments,etc. not sure though that there's be any chance of this guy getting in the HOF. He'd possibly get a display in Cooperstown along with other "almost" HOFers. But no plaque.

In OOTP, the most common CEIs I've seen have been torn Labrums, concussions, and fractured skulls. Not necessarily ligaments or tendons.

As far as artificial ligaments being an unfair advantage, how unfair is it that players careers have been extended through the miracle of Tommy John surgery? Further, the magic of high speed filmography that allow players to nitpick minute flaws in their mechanics, as well as scouting every player in the league; wouldn't that be an advantage that wasn't available to the likes of Ty Cobb and Babe Ruth?

Questdog · 07-20-2014, 01:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tram2Whitaker

In OOTP, the most common CEIs I've seen have been torn Labrums, concussions, and fractured skulls. Not necessarily ligaments or tendons.

As far as artificial ligaments being an unfair advantage, how unfair is it that players careers have been extended through the miracle of Tommy John surgery? Further, the magic of high speed filmography that allow players to nitpick minute flaws in their mechanics, as well as scouting every player in the league; wouldn't that be an advantage that wasn't available to the likes of Ty Cobb and Babe Ruth?

It's not a question of having an advantage over Cobb and Ruth, it is a question of having an advantage over your peers......

tejdog1 · 07-20-2014, 02:25 AM

What ifs are a part of real life baseball, too.

Kerry Wood, Mark Prior, etc... Nomah...

That, IMO, is what makes OOTP great (just not when it happens to me lol)

hineighbor · 07-20-2014, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sabrtoothtiger

Has anyone else seen potential greats have careers cut short?

Yes! Very tragic story. In my first year as GM, I signed an Japanese international free agent by the name of Kiminobu Takahashi. This guy turned out to be the Asian Mike Trout (but better)! I hit the jackpot! He was going to lead my team to multiple World Series championships!

And then he suffered a career-ending injury at age 23.

I retired his number and he's now a bench coach for my team. What a shame, though

07-18-2014, 11:54 PM	#1
sabrtoothtiger Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 137	HOF or not? Looking through league history, making automatic HOF inductions... does this player deserve to be in the HOF? Does the Gale Sayers rule apply? Flirted with .400 3 times and was in the middle of his best season yet when he suffered a career ending injury. Has anyone else seen potential greats have careers cut short? Attached Images

07-19-2014, 11:59 AM	#6
ThatSeventiesGuy Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Midland, MI Posts: 3,426	Nope. Eight or nine seasons, sure. Only six? Sample size is a bit too small. With a bat like that, though, I'd be tempted to "uninjure" the guy after he missed a season or two. __________________ https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/...00&postcount=1

07-19-2014, 12:33 PM	#8
ThatSeventiesGuy Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Midland, MI Posts: 3,426	My rule for "career ending" injuries of a guy in his prime tends to be that he misses the rest of the season plus the next, then maybe I edit him back to the land of the healthy. This is in my league that's currently in 2038, so I just say medical advances worked for him. __________________ https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/...00&postcount=1

07-19-2014, 02:35 PM	#9
Giants44 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: San Francisco Bay Area Posts: 2,408	Wow, those were some dominant impressive seasons. Lifetime .378 is unreal, even in a short career. I would say his "real life" chances to make hall of fame would depend on two things: 1. did his team win championships (2+ titles would really increase his chances,especially because Col is not a team with a lot of championships) 2. was he a big\likeable personality (obviously hard to tell from game, but in real life I think this matters a lot) Watching Kirby Puckett was fun in a way that watching Jim Rice was not) __________________ "In a text sim - Immersion is everything" -Me "Judge a man not by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character" -Martin Luther King "Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts." -Einstein "The man who views the world at 50 the same as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life." -Muhammad Ali "Baseball statistics are like a girl in a bikini. They show a lot, but not everything." -Toby Harrah

07-20-2014, 02:25 AM	#17
tejdog1 All Star Starter Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Danbury, CT Posts: 1,648	What ifs are a part of real life baseball, too. Kerry Wood, Mark Prior, etc... Nomah... That, IMO, is what makes OOTP great (just not when it happens to me lol) __________________ It's amazing How you make your face just like a wall How you take your heart and turn it off How I turn my head and lose it all And it's unnerving How just one move puts me by myself There you go just trusting someone else Now I know I put us both through hell ~Matchbox 20, "Leave" Everyone knows it's spelled "TRAID", not trade

07-18-2014, 11:57 PM	#2
Questdog Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: In a dark, damp cave where I'm training slugs to run the bases...... Posts: 16,142	Major League rule is that a player needs to play 10 seasons to be eligible.

07-19-2014, 08:07 AM	#3
jpeters1734 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Juust a bit outside... Posts: 6,237	nah, I'd say if he played a full season for those 3 seasons then maybe

07-19-2014, 11:33 AM	#4
JMDurron All Star Starter Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 1,262	Nope, this guy goes into the Nomar Garciaparra Memorial "What if he had stayed healthy?!?" Hall of Pain. Where Kirby Puckett should be...

07-19-2014, 11:54 AM	#5
Honorable_Pawn Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Tampa Bay Posts: 6,407	Nope. 1,065 hits ain't gonna git 'er done

07-19-2014, 02:47 PM	#11
OakDragon Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: San Jose, CA USA Posts: 3,494	I guess I'm the lone softie in that I'd put him in my Hall. That's a long enough and impressive enough (in combo) career for me. ThatSeventiesGuy's comment though, made me think maybe there ought to be a setting where after 2050 or so, CEI's don't happen.

07-19-2014, 03:24 PM	#12
jwinn66 Minors (Double A) Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 159	Hopefully CEI's go away. I'd live to see artificial ligaments,etc. not sure though that there's be any chance of this guy getting in the HOF. He'd possibly get a display in Cooperstown along with other "almost" HOFers. But no plaque.

07-19-2014, 03:36 PM	#13
hfield007 All Star Starter Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 1,713	Ungodly war for not even finishing seasons. I think it comes down to whether you value ability or longevity more. I guess perfection would be finding a nice balance. But look at Sandy Koufax, a great run for 5-6 years and nothing else of great value.

07-19-2014, 04:59 PM	#14
Honorable_Pawn Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Tampa Bay Posts: 6,407	I don't think players (now or in the future) should be allowed to play with artificial ligaments. It could give them a competitive edge. If steroids are banned then so should artificial ligaments. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. So, what does this have to do with the topic? Well, since I feel that artificial ligaments should also be banned then I disagree with "un-retiring" players for this reason. However, if you are willing to allow steroids (bump up the league-modifiers) then maybe I would reconsider.