Editor potential doesn't match export talent

jfalesi · 04-05-2014, 03:35 PM

I have a question that may just be scratching the surface of a larger issue I've been wondering about. I recently undertook the effort to create my 2014 Yahoo fantasy team in OOTP14. I've done this before via importing historical players and been unsatisfied with the results, so I used a different tactic this time: I imported each player from his youngest year in the league and modified his potential ratings to match his prime years, using the "Create potential ratings based on stats" option. I did this because I wanted to simulate the "best-case" scenario in which all my players came into the majors at the same time and form a dynasty. However, after editing everyone's potential ratings and exporting rosters in csv format, I noticed that the "talent" ratings in the exported data do not match the "potential" ratings in the game - even for attributes I did not modify, such as individual pitch potential.

For example, as you can see in the images below, although Hishashi Iwakuma's "Stuff" and "Control" potential in the editor match the "talent_stuff" and "talent_control" ratings in the export, none of the other values match. Granted, they're not off by much, but still, there's something else going on here. So... what's going on? What else is affecting the exported values, which presumably are the values that the game engine uses for player development?

This is probably related to a more general question about player development - is there a way to keep imported players' development linked to their initial potential ratings as opposed to being modified by the players' real-life performance in subsequent years? I always wanted to see what Bo Jackson would do if he hadn't been injured playing football, but whenever I import him, his yearly potential ratings always change based on his real-life performance, thus requiring yearly modifications. I believe that what I'm looking for is equivalent to creating a fictional player - along with a player development model - that is as close as possible to the imported player's "best-case" potential. My current work-around is to create a bunch of random fictional players and select the one that's closest to the real player's ideal ratings, but it would be nice if there was a less time-consuming method.

Thanks,
-Jamie

jfalesi · 04-05-2014, 03:39 PM

Forgot to post the images

Questdog · 04-05-2014, 04:33 PM

Been a while since I messed with this, but the problem is that Stuff is built upon the pitch ratings. You can't just set them both to what you want them. Can't remember if the game will fix stuff to match the pitch ratings or vice versa, but it looks like it changed your pitch ratings to match your stuff.

jfalesi · 04-07-2014, 02:27 PM

I think you're right, Questdog.

Related question:

Can I assume that if I change the potential ratings of a random "created" player to match those of a player from real life that I'd like to emulate (say, by importing Troy Tulowitzki's best season), that the created player will then develop naturally according to the game's player development algorithms (and talent change randomness settings)? That is, will drastically changing a player's potential ratings for eye, power, etc. cause the development process to do weird things?

I guess what I'm asking is, if I take two created players - say, one with all-star potential and one with scrub potential - and make them both average across the board, will they develop appreciably differently? Do the initially created potential values impact the player's development even AFTER I've modified them according to my whims?

A more direct way to ask the question, for which the answer is probably proprietary, is how does the player development engine work?

-Jamie

Questdog · 04-07-2014, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfalesi

I think you're right, Questdog.

Related question:

Can I assume that if I change the potential ratings of a random "created" player to match those of a player from real life that I'd like to emulate (say, by importing Troy Tulowitzki's best season), that the created player will then develop naturally according to the game's player development algorithms (and talent change randomness settings)? That is, will drastically changing a player's potential ratings for eye, power, etc. cause the development process to do weird things?

I guess what I'm asking is, if I take two created players - say, one with all-star potential and one with scrub potential - and make them both average across the board, will they develop appreciably differently? Do the initially created potential values impact the player's development even AFTER I've modified them according to my whims?

A more direct way to ask the question, for which the answer is probably proprietary, is how does the player development engine work?

-Jamie

If you take two very different players and set their potentials to be the same while leaving the actual ratings as they are, the players will not develop the same (nor could they). But they will both tend to head to the same place. Although the development engine insures that in all probability they both won't end up at the same place.

Make sense?.....hope not.....

In other words, if you take Ray Oyler and give him Ernie Banks' potential ratings, good ol' Ray will try to turn himself into Ernie Banks, but he may or may not make it. He'll for sure (most probably) get better than he was though.....and he may even get better than Ernie. A lot depends on the age of the player when you change the potentials too.

jfalesi · 04-07-2014, 03:32 PM

Makes sense. Will run some Monte Carlos to see what happens. Are you an OOTP developer?

Questdog · 04-07-2014, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfalesi

Makes sense. Will run some Monte Carlos to see what happens. Are you an OOTP developer?

No, just a beta team member.

Wooly · 04-12-2017, 07:44 PM

When the ratings values in the CSV do not match the Editor (but are close), does anyone know which are more valid? Is it possible the editor values are not actually up to date without re-scouting the players, so the CSV values are actually the most current ratings?

I rarely find the CSV values are the same as the editor, even though they are usually close. I don't know why that would be, except for a delay in scouting or something.

04-05-2014, 03:35 PM	#1
jfalesi Bat Boy Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 15	Editor potential doesn't match export talent I have a question that may just be scratching the surface of a larger issue I've been wondering about. I recently undertook the effort to create my 2014 Yahoo fantasy team in OOTP14. I've done this before via importing historical players and been unsatisfied with the results, so I used a different tactic this time: I imported each player from his youngest year in the league and modified his potential ratings to match his prime years, using the "Create potential ratings based on stats" option. I did this because I wanted to simulate the "best-case" scenario in which all my players came into the majors at the same time and form a dynasty. However, after editing everyone's potential ratings and exporting rosters in csv format, I noticed that the "talent" ratings in the exported data do not match the "potential" ratings in the game - even for attributes I did not modify, such as individual pitch potential. For example, as you can see in the images below, although Hishashi Iwakuma's "Stuff" and "Control" potential in the editor match the "talent_stuff" and "talent_control" ratings in the export, none of the other values match. Granted, they're not off by much, but still, there's something else going on here. So... what's going on? What else is affecting the exported values, which presumably are the values that the game engine uses for player development? This is probably related to a more general question about player development - is there a way to keep imported players' development linked to their initial potential ratings as opposed to being modified by the players' real-life performance in subsequent years? I always wanted to see what Bo Jackson would do if he hadn't been injured playing football, but whenever I import him, his yearly potential ratings always change based on his real-life performance, thus requiring yearly modifications. I believe that what I'm looking for is equivalent to creating a fictional player - along with a player development model - that is as close as possible to the imported player's "best-case" potential. My current work-around is to create a bunch of random fictional players and select the one that's closest to the real player's ideal ratings, but it would be nice if there was a less time-consuming method. Thanks, -Jamie

04-05-2014, 03:39 PM	#2
jfalesi Bat Boy Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 15	Ooops Forgot to post the images Attached Images

04-05-2014, 04:33 PM	#3
Questdog Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: In a dark, damp cave where I'm training slugs to run the bases...... Posts: 16,142	Been a while since I messed with this, but the problem is that Stuff is built upon the pitch ratings. You can't just set them both to what you want them. Can't remember if the game will fix stuff to match the pitch ratings or vice versa, but it looks like it changed your pitch ratings to match your stuff.

04-07-2014, 02:27 PM	#4
jfalesi Bat Boy Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 15	I think you're right, Questdog. Related question: Can I assume that if I change the potential ratings of a random "created" player to match those of a player from real life that I'd like to emulate (say, by importing Troy Tulowitzki's best season), that the created player will then develop naturally according to the game's player development algorithms (and talent change randomness settings)? That is, will drastically changing a player's potential ratings for eye, power, etc. cause the development process to do weird things? I guess what I'm asking is, if I take two created players - say, one with all-star potential and one with scrub potential - and make them both average across the board, will they develop appreciably differently? Do the initially created potential values impact the player's development even AFTER I've modified them according to my whims? A more direct way to ask the question, for which the answer is probably proprietary, is how does the player development engine work? -Jamie

04-07-2014, 03:32 PM	#6
jfalesi Bat Boy Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 15	Makes sense. Will run some Monte Carlos to see what happens. Are you an OOTP developer?

04-12-2017, 07:44 PM	#8
Wooly Bat Boy Join Date: Apr 2016 Posts: 11	When the ratings values in the CSV do not match the Editor (but are close), does anyone know which are more valid? Is it possible the editor values are not actually up to date without re-scouting the players, so the CSV values are actually the most current ratings? I rarely find the CSV values are the same as the editor, even though they are usually close. I don't know why that would be, except for a delay in scouting or something.