Fan Loyalty Almost Crashed!

korme · 12-12-2013, 04:23 PM

Just got one of those emails because my old catcher signed with a new team.

That's all and well, he was popular. But he last played for me in 2019, sat out in 2020, and then signed for peanuts to another team in 2021. Now my fans are mad about it 2 years later? Come on.

le receveur · 12-12-2013, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by korme

Just got one of those emails because my old catcher signed with a new team.

That's all and well, he was popular. But he last played for me in 2019, sat out in 2020, and then signed for peanuts to another team in 2021. Now my fans are mad about it 2 years later? Come on.

like real life, i will be mad for a long time for the Jays letting Munenori Kawasaki go....

(there is a problem in OOTP that it waits until a re-signing.)

Westheim · 12-13-2013, 01:40 AM

Didn't Kawasaki bat like .220? While I am aware that there had been some kind of minor hype about him with the Blue Jays (saw a few R.A. Dickey starts, none too great), I never could grasp ... just why?

Meanwhile I agree that the fans should be mad the second that very popular player becomes a free agent. They could be the more joyful if he resigns with his old team, like a -8 drop in fan interest followed by a +10 increase.

le receveur · 12-13-2013, 03:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Westheim

Didn't Kawasaki bat like .220? While I am aware that there had been some kind of minor hype about him with the Blue Jays (saw a few R.A. Dickey starts, none too great), I never could grasp ... just why?

.

he had a .326 on base average tops of all the back up infielders, had great ABs (when you keep watching JP swing at everything you appreciate it ) was fun to watch, was a great presence in room according to everyone and only wanted $1 million. not much more you can ask from a 25th man,,,

eriqjaffe · 12-13-2013, 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by le receveur

there is a problem in OOTP that it waits until a re-signing.

I agree - if there's going to be a fan interest hit, it should hit when the player files for free agency, not when he finally signs with another team.

endgame · 12-13-2013, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eriqjaffe

I agree - if there's going to be a fan interest hit, it should hit when the player files for free agency, not when he finally signs with another team.

I agree. The original intention may have been to create the illusion of 'holding out hope' or reserving judgment, but the logic doesn't play out and seems inappropriate and ill-timed when the signing occurs. OTOH, I suppose one could offer up an alternative that if the player resigns with the original team the fan support would increase yet another notch. I'm of the opinion it should illustrate reaction almost immediately, though. We should revisit this in the next version.

Matt Arnold · 12-13-2013, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by le receveur

he had a .326 on base average tops of all the back up infielders, had great ABs (when you keep watching JP swing at everything you appreciate it ) was fun to watch, was a great presence in room according to everyone and only wanted $1 million. not much more you can ask from a 25th man,,,

His OBP was fine, especially considering the Jays lack that totally, but he still didn't hit great. It's true he was a fine 25th guy, could fill in for a bit, but he's fairly easily replaceable. Yeah, he was a likeable guy, though. People often get attached to the marginal guys - same reason fans were upset a few years back when John McDonald was traded.

As for the game, there should probably be one hit to loyalty when the player goes to free agency, and then another when he signs with another team. I mean, I'm sure the Yankees fans were upset when Cano went to free agency, and then it really hits hard when he actually signed with someone else. But maybe there should be a cap on the time - so if the guy hasn't signed by the start of the regular season, then the game should treat that as if he signed with another team. So this old catcher you should get the hit at the beginning of 2020 to fan loyalty, and they shouldn't really care about him when he actually signs 2 years later.

le receveur · 12-13-2013, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UWHabs

His OBP was fine, especially considering the Jays lack that totally, but he still didn't hit great. It's true he was a fine 25th guy, could fill in for a bit, but he's fairly easily replaceable. Yeah, he was a likeable guy, though. People often get attached to the marginal guys - same reason fans were upset a few years back when John McDonald was traded.

but to me this is what Fan loyalty is all about. it can be totally irrational... like people who want to get rid of Bautista because he has a 'bad attitude',,,(and is only a .250 career hitter,, something i read yesterday)...

Mune was obviously circumstances, a ray of sunshine in a crappy year,,,and the 12 pitches AB were great...

The Game · 12-13-2013, 12:17 PM

I dont get how loyalty crashes when a superstar signs with a new team. Cano just signed with the Mariners. Yankees will not see any noticeable difference in attendance based on Cano leaving. Had Paul Konerko signed with a new team vs coming back to the Sox it would not have a had any factor in Sox attendance. We weren't gonna go to games whether he came back or not.

Snarf054 · 12-13-2013, 12:34 PM

It may not matter with the Yankees because fans know they are just going to go out and replace him with another big name free agent. However if you are a Royals fan you tend to get a little annoyed with the fact that your club is no more than a shared farm club for the rest of the league.

The Game · 12-13-2013, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snarf054

It may not matter with the Yankees because fans know they are just going to go out and replace him with another big name free agent. However if you are a Royals fan you tend to get a little annoyed with the fact that your club is no more than a shared farm club for the rest of the league.

Royals have not had a swing bigger then 300,000 in attendance in 20 years
(i only went back to 1991) and when they lost fans it was because of record and tended to rebound the next year or the year after that. It has gone up each of the last 3 years.
Also I have had teams with a market size of 10 spending at 10 go from 95 loyalty down to 70 because some veteran who hit ,271 12 HR 55 RBI in an injury plagued season at age 38 left the team and signed a league min contract with a non contender.

Westheim · 12-13-2013, 01:23 PM

It's not loyalty that crashes, but fan interest. Although I don't really get how loyalty works either.

The Game · 12-13-2013, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Westheim

It's not loyalty that crashes, but fan interest. Although I don't really get how loyalty works either.

Your right I did mean fan interest I do get them confused. I just dont see why their should be such a big gain or loss when a player comes or goes.

Matt Arnold · 12-13-2013, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Game

Your right I did mean fan interest I do get them confused. I just dont see why their should be such a big gain or loss when a player comes or goes.

I think it does make sense to shift based on moves in the off-season, but the overriding factor will tend to be performance.

So, for example, last off-season, after the Blue Jays big trades, fan interest in the Jays would have been 100%. There was a noticeable uptick in ticket sales - the team on the season was up almost 6000 people a game over last year, a lot of that based on the hope that these new additions would pan out. Fan interest would be low now though after the bad season, but I still think the big name additions from last winter still keep it higher now than it would have been before those moves.

Snarf054 · 12-14-2013, 10:13 AM

You can't really equate attendance in real life to what fans think though. Royals fans may have no hope for the future but they still have cheap ticket prices and a beautiful ball park. Their attendance is mostly determined by who the opponent is. And besides that in real life no matter how bad your team is going to a game is still better than not going to a game.

12-12-2013, 04:23 PM	#1
korme Minors (Double A) Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: bloodbuzz ohio Posts: 105	Fan Loyalty Almost Crashed! Just got one of those emails because my old catcher signed with a new team. That's all and well, he was popular. But he last played for me in 2019, sat out in 2020, and then signed for peanuts to another team in 2021. Now my fans are mad about it 2 years later? Come on.

12-13-2013, 01:40 AM	#3
Westheim Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Germany Posts: 14,215	Didn't Kawasaki bat like .220? While I am aware that there had been some kind of minor hype about him with the Blue Jays (saw a few R.A. Dickey starts, none too great), I never could grasp ... just why? Meanwhile I agree that the fans should be mad the second that very popular player becomes a free agent. They could be the more joyful if he resigns with his old team, like a -8 drop in fan interest followed by a +10 increase. __________________ Portland Raccoons, 96 years of excell-.... of baseball: Furballs here! 1983 * 1989 * 1991 * 1992 * 1993 * 1995 * 1996 * 2010 * 2017 * 2018 * 2019 * 2026 * 2028 * 2035 * 2037 * 2044 * 2045 * 2046 * 2047 * 2048 * 2051 * 2054 * 2055 * 2061 * 2071 1 OSANAI : 2 POWELL : 7 NOMURA \| RAMOS : 8 REECE : 10 BROWN : 15 HALL : 27 FERNANDEZ : 28 CASAS : 31 CARMONA : 32 WEST : 39 TONER : 46 SAITO Resident Mets Cynic - The Mets from 1962 onwards, here.

12-13-2013, 12:17 PM	#9
The Game Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Inside The Game Posts: 30,937	I dont get how loyalty crashes when a superstar signs with a new team. Cano just signed with the Mariners. Yankees will not see any noticeable difference in attendance based on Cano leaving. Had Paul Konerko signed with a new team vs coming back to the Sox it would not have a had any factor in Sox attendance. We weren't gonna go to games whether he came back or not. __________________ Go today don't wait for tomorrow It isn't promised, all the time you get borrowed Don't live your life for other people Don't bottle your emotions till they crack and fill a couple just sorrows Take your mind and refocus go get a paper write your goals out Throw your middle fingers to all your haters "Stay Strong"

12-13-2013, 01:23 PM	#12
Westheim Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Germany Posts: 14,215	It's not loyalty that crashes, but fan interest. Although I don't really get how loyalty works either. __________________ Portland Raccoons, 96 years of excell-.... of baseball: Furballs here! 1983 * 1989 * 1991 * 1992 * 1993 * 1995 * 1996 * 2010 * 2017 * 2018 * 2019 * 2026 * 2028 * 2035 * 2037 * 2044 * 2045 * 2046 * 2047 * 2048 * 2051 * 2054 * 2055 * 2061 * 2071 1 OSANAI : 2 POWELL : 7 NOMURA \| RAMOS : 8 REECE : 10 BROWN : 15 HALL : 27 FERNANDEZ : 28 CASAS : 31 CARMONA : 32 WEST : 39 TONER : 46 SAITO Resident Mets Cynic - The Mets from 1962 onwards, here.

12-13-2013, 12:34 PM	#10
Snarf054 Minors (Double A) Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 127	It may not matter with the Yankees because fans know they are just going to go out and replace him with another big name free agent. However if you are a Royals fan you tend to get a little annoyed with the fact that your club is no more than a shared farm club for the rest of the league.

12-14-2013, 10:13 AM	#15
Snarf054 Minors (Double A) Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 127	You can't really equate attendance in real life to what fans think though. Royals fans may have no hope for the future but they still have cheap ticket prices and a beautiful ball park. Their attendance is mostly determined by who the opponent is. And besides that in real life no matter how bad your team is going to a game is still better than not going to a game.