Hall of Fame or no?

David Watts · 09-15-2013, 07:36 PM

Wondering if you would put this guy in the Hall of Fame. 2359 games, career average of .297, OBP of .354, SLG .489, OPS of .843. He had 2748 hits, 415 doubles, 79 triples, 401 home runs and 1551 RBI. 727.1 VORP. He was a 10 time all star and 3 time MVP. He went 17 for 36 in his only trip to the World Series with 2 home runs, 10 runs and 6 rbi.

This is a random debut league, so the player is a real player. Can anyone guess who he is?

dodger300 · 09-15-2013, 07:43 PM

Hall of Famer yes. Jim Rice.

JMDurron · 09-15-2013, 07:43 PM

This is a very one-dimensional look at said player. What position(s) did he play, and what were his defensive ratings?

David Watts · 09-15-2013, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMDurron

This is a very one-dimensional look at said player. What position(s) did he play, and what were his defensive ratings?

Actually did the one-dimensional thing on purpose due to who the player is. He played a mix of LF and RF during his OOTP career, never winning a Gold Glove. Career .982 fielding percentage.

r0nster · 09-15-2013, 07:50 PM

20 years ago I would say he on the bubble with a slim to small chance to make it into HOF but today I would say NOPE not even close

David Watts · 09-15-2013, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dodger300

Hall of Famer yes. Jim Rice.

Wow, the first person to guess nailed it.

Mister_G · 09-15-2013, 07:54 PM

Based on those numbers and the 3 MVPs I'd definitely say yes.

David Watts · 09-15-2013, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by r0nster

20 years ago I would say he on the bubble with a slim to small chance to make it into HOF but today I would say NOPE not even close

This is a random debut league that is being played as if every year was 1975. 25 seasons in and the most home runs hit in a season is 53. The all time leader is Mickey Mantle with 565. He's 38 years old and still active.

Royals_Blues · 09-15-2013, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mister_G

Based on those numbers and the 3 MVPs I'd definitely say yes.

This.

JMDurron · 09-15-2013, 10:05 PM

I still chafe at the real Jim Rice being the HOF (particularly when his superior overall teammate, Dwight Evans, never got a sniff of being close because he excelled in defense, OBP, and peaking late instead of declining early), but this particular variant, with 3 MVPs and those H/HR numbers, I'd be fine with him being in.

I was hoping for his ZR and EFF defensive ratings, fielding percentage is pretty meaningless, but knowing it's Jim Rice, I can figure out the rest.

VanillaGorilla · 09-16-2013, 02:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

He was a 10 time all star and 3 time MVP.

Barring any negative off field circumstances, this is all the info needed, for me.

Easy "Yes" vote.

VanillaGorilla · 09-16-2013, 03:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMDurron

I still chafe at the real Jim Rice being the HOF (particularly when his superior overall teammate, Dwight Evans, never got a sniff of being close because he excelled in defense, OBP, and peaking late instead of declining early),

I think Evans should be a HOFer. That said, I do not think he was clearly superior to Rice. The Rice/Evans comparison is a really fun one, as they were teammates for so long, and their career totals are very very similar.

Rice's peak seasons were better than Evan's, and Evans was never the most feared hitter in the Sox line-up. Jim Rice was, perhaps, the most feared hitter in the AL during his prime. That goes to "fame" and that is part of the vote.

I see the Rice vs Evans debate as one that can be validly argued from either side. Two different cats that brought to the table slightly different skill sets.

Rice put up his totals in 4 fewer seasons, but Evans had so many more PAs not be ABs because of his plate approach. How much their differing approaches can be attributed to the fact that they played together is intriguing to consider.

I think it is a disservice to players like Rice and Cepeda to compare them to the likes of Williams and Musial (you are not doing this, but the discussion often leads down this path) and tag them as "marginal" HOFers because they didn't have careers as great as either of them. If we make Williams and Musial the standard, then we would have a HOF with maybe 9 hitters.

OBP has been an under considered aspect for the HOF process. I think that will be changing.

Like my opinion means anything, but here it is: I think there is a better than a 50/50 chance that Dewey will be in Cooperstown before Barry.

RonP · 09-16-2013, 04:59 AM

That's a good one, Vanilla and I would not take that bet. I think there is a chance that Bonds won't get in in his lifetime. The Hall of Fame or lack thereof as a punitive measure. CF. See Pete Rose, Sr. Rose has weighed in on this he said (and I'm not quoting verbatim but I have the meaning correct, "I don't think you should have to wait until you're dead to get into the hall." Of course Rose is being punished for not being contrite enough or kow towing to various suits but Petey was always like that AND always a gambler, too. When he was playing for Cincy and had a little time off here he was known to all the cab drivers for jumping in the cab saying Golden Gate Fields and asking you who you liked. He liked gambling almost as much as P. , I hear. ,

RonP · 09-16-2013, 05:02 AM

Oh, one other thing. Darrell Evans should be in the hall. Is he? I'm sure you know.

VanillaGorilla · 09-16-2013, 05:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RonP

Oh, one other thing. Darrell Evans should be in the hall. Is he? I'm sure you know.

Darrell Evans may be at the top (or real darn close if I sat down with this for a while) of my list of "Greatest Players Not in the HOF That Won't Get In the HOF That I Do Not Endorse Getting In the HOF."

He was a great player.

However, he falls short in the "Fame" quotient that tipped the scales in Rice's favor and, belatedly, Santo's favor.

As far as my opinion is concerned, there are bubble guys I endorse (Dwight Evans, for one), and bubble guys for whom I am apathetic (Gil Hodges).

Darrell Evans just doesn't quite get there, in my estimation. I do think he is an underrated player, and that is part of the reason he will not get in, regardless of my take on his chances.

I would place Darrell in the top half of the 98th percentile of guys that ever set foot on a ML diamond as a player. That's a helluva helluva player.

I don't sense any simmering support amongst the Vets for putting him in.

Dovetailing Darrell back into the Dwight discussion, just how far the love of OBP goes into the members of the Vet Committee will determine the landscape. An entry of Dwight would certainly elevate its importance in relation to selections. OBP has largely been a residual figure in HOF selections. Guys with great OBP were not selected for their OBP, but for a correspondingly high batting average.

If Dwight Evans does get in, I think it would be a watershed mark in HOF history, regarding the importance of OBP. If Dwight does get in, then I think Darrell has reasonable chances materialize.

For now, Darrell is at the top of my list for best hitter that won't get in.

Hockey13Playa · 09-16-2013, 07:29 AM

Excuse my butting in but I've seen several of these threads... I just finished my first ever season on OOTP ... Being a new player as of a week and some change ago... In my first off season the "AI" sent like 4 players to the Hall of Fame... Is there a manual way to select who you want?

VanillaGorilla · 09-16-2013, 07:33 AM

LeagueSetup>>>Options

Scroll down the left hand column. Check the "Disable Automatic HOF Induction" box.

Hockey13Playa · 09-16-2013, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VanillaGorilla

LeagueSetup>>>Options

Scroll down the left hand column. Check the "Disable Automatic HOF Induction" box.

Thanks!!! So many customizable features it's hard to catch them all setting up a new league!!! So when a player retires I would just right click on "John Doe CF" and there will be a hall of fame option?!

VanillaGorilla · 09-16-2013, 07:51 AM

On the player profile page click the "action" tab, and you will have an option there to induct the player. You can go to the profile page of any player the software inducted and in the "action" menu there will be an option to remove that player from the HOF.

Also, if you open your HOF and right click on a name there, you will have an option to remove the player from the HOF.

Hockey13Playa · 09-16-2013, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VanillaGorilla

On the player profile page click the "action" tab, and you will have an option there to induct the player. You can go to the profile page of any player the software inducted and in the "action" menu there will be an option to remove that player from the HOF.

Also, if you open your HOF and right click on a name there, you will have an option to remove the player from the HOF.

Thank you much! I appreciate the help!!!!!

09-15-2013, 07:36 PM	#1
David Watts Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Looking for a place called Leehofooks Posts: 10,134 Infractions: 0/1 (1)	Hall of Fame or no? Wondering if you would put this guy in the Hall of Fame. 2359 games, career average of .297, OBP of .354, SLG .489, OPS of .843. He had 2748 hits, 415 doubles, 79 triples, 401 home runs and 1551 RBI. 727.1 VORP. He was a 10 time all star and 3 time MVP. He went 17 for 36 in his only trip to the World Series with 2 home runs, 10 runs and 6 rbi. This is a random debut league, so the player is a real player. Can anyone guess who he is?

09-15-2013, 07:54 PM	#7
Mister_G All Star Reserve Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 576	Based on those numbers and the 3 MVPs I'd definitely say yes. __________________ A man doesn't make mistakes, mistakes make the man @MisterG90

09-15-2013, 07:43 PM	#2
dodger300 Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 268	Hall of Famer yes. Jim Rice.

09-15-2013, 07:43 PM	#3
JMDurron All Star Starter Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 1,260	This is a very one-dimensional look at said player. What position(s) did he play, and what were his defensive ratings?

09-15-2013, 07:50 PM	#5
r0nster Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 3,081	20 years ago I would say he on the bubble with a slim to small chance to make it into HOF but today I would say NOPE not even close

09-15-2013, 10:05 PM	#10
JMDurron All Star Starter Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 1,260	I still chafe at the real Jim Rice being the HOF (particularly when his superior overall teammate, Dwight Evans, never got a sniff of being close because he excelled in defense, OBP, and peaking late instead of declining early), but this particular variant, with 3 MVPs and those H/HR numbers, I'd be fine with him being in. I was hoping for his ZR and EFF defensive ratings, fielding percentage is pretty meaningless, but knowing it's Jim Rice, I can figure out the rest.

09-16-2013, 04:59 AM	#13
RonP Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: San Francisco, California Posts: 226	That's a good one, Vanilla and I would not take that bet. I think there is a chance that Bonds won't get in in his lifetime. The Hall of Fame or lack thereof as a punitive measure. CF. See Pete Rose, Sr. Rose has weighed in on this he said (and I'm not quoting verbatim but I have the meaning correct, "I don't think you should have to wait until you're dead to get into the hall." Of course Rose is being punished for not being contrite enough or kow towing to various suits but Petey was always like that AND always a gambler, too. When he was playing for Cincy and had a little time off here he was known to all the cab drivers for jumping in the cab saying Golden Gate Fields and asking you who you liked. He liked gambling almost as much as P. , I hear. ,

09-16-2013, 05:02 AM	#14
RonP Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: San Francisco, California Posts: 226	Oh, one other thing. Darrell Evans should be in the hall. Is he? I'm sure you know.

09-16-2013, 07:29 AM	#16
Hockey13Playa Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 2,677	Excuse my butting in but I've seen several of these threads... I just finished my first ever season on OOTP ... Being a new player as of a week and some change ago... In my first off season the "AI" sent like 4 players to the Hall of Fame... Is there a manual way to select who you want?

09-16-2013, 07:33 AM	#17
VanillaGorilla All Star Starter Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 1,371	LeagueSetup>>>Options Scroll down the left hand column. Check the "Disable Automatic HOF Induction" box.

09-16-2013, 07:51 AM	#19
VanillaGorilla All Star Starter Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 1,371	On the player profile page click the "action" tab, and you will have an option there to induct the player. You can go to the profile page of any player the software inducted and in the "action" menu there will be an option to remove that player from the HOF. Also, if you open your HOF and right click on a name there, you will have an option to remove the player from the HOF.