Irrevocable Waivers -- How do I disable this?

[sterjs]

How do I disable or avoid irrevocable waivers? I don't like to micromanage, so I let the AI manage roster moves and lineups, but not free agency, trades, etc. It is basically cutting talented players without my consent. Why in the heck would the AI put this player on irrevocable waivers? I have gotten a multitude of trade offers for him.

[sterjs]

He went on to put up a 3.05 ERA and 4.0 WAR in 189 IP for the Cubs. What an unreal decision by the AI... there absolutely needs to be a warning before players are placed on irrevocable waivers.

[Déjà Bru]

I am not necessarily defending the AI, which is still a work in progress in this complicated game. However, consider these possibilities:

• It's relatively easy for a middle reliever to get multiple star ratings in this game, for one reason or another. Don't forget that by default they are rated against each other rather than against all players in this regard. Middle relievers are the bottom of the barrel and there are usually tons of them floating around.
• I see you are playing with scouting on. You do realize that scouting is not 100% accurate unless you choose so in the options? The AI filters its decisions through your scout for all roster decisions that you delegate to your AI managers.
• Was your roster already adequately stocked with such relievers? If so, this guy could have been just the runt of the litter, so to speak. Maybe the AI had to dump him to move up better pitchers.
• Sometimes you have to go through the irrevocable waiver process with a guy to get him off the 40-man secondary roster in order to free up a slot for a better player to protect from the Rule 5 draft or because you just acquired a better guy with a MLB contract.
• Take a look at some other things. For example:
  • His recent performance: 7-12 with an ERA of 4.91. That reminds me of Phil Hughes on the Yankees with similar numbers. I'd like to DFA that guy myself if I could!
  • His Hold Runners rating is virtually zero, which means guys can run on him at will, stretching singles and walks into doubles. I always avoid such pitchers, myself.
  • His defense, stamina, and movement are all mediocre. He's neither starter nor closer material.

He's just another run-of-the-mill middle reliever with mediocre to poor numbers. I'd keep him around if I had a need for a warm body in the bullpen but if I had a bunch of better guys and he was clogging up the roster, I might waive him too.

EDIT: Don't forget one other thing. You say "He went on to put up a 3.05 ERA and 4.0 WAR in 189 IP for the Cubs." Technically, the AI did not know that would happen when it made it's waiver decision. That sounds strange to say but it's just like IRL. Some decisions look terrible in hindsight but that's part of the human condition that this game tries to simulate. You are looking at it as if there was certainty involved. Like, "The AI should have know this guy was good and that he would do well in the future, so the AI was dumb for letting him go." It does not work that way. There is a good amount of randomness, management uncertainty, and scouting error built into the game to enhance its realism.

EDIT 2 : Oh, to answer your question. Once you delegate roster decisions to your AI managers, there is no safeguard or warning against making certain transactions that seem questionable to you afterward. It might be a good suggestion for a future version of this game for the AI to run such transactions by you before going ahead but for now (and perhaps for simplicity's sake), if you delegate, you delegate and take the consequences.

[sterjs]

Originally Posted by Déjà Bru

He's just another run-of-the-mill middle reliever with mediocre to poor numbers. I'd keep him around if I had a need for a warm body in the bullpen but if I had a bunch of better guys and he was clogging up the roster, I might waive him too.

EDIT: Don't forget one other thing. You say "He went on to put up a 3.05 ERA and 4.0 WAR in 189 IP for the Cubs." Technically, the AI did not know that would happen when it made it's waiver decision.

No, if you look closely he is an SP rated 3/3.5* by the Scout and by OSA. He had a +1.0 WAR season as a rookie starter and is cost controlled for several more years. IMO, it's easy to see that such a player has way too much potential to place on irrevocable waivers. I posted the OP before I ran the rest of the season, so it was not a case of hindsight. Since he was placed on waivers, he has +8.2 WAR as a starter in 2 seasons for the Cubs.

[SandMan]

Originally Posted by sterjs

No, if you look closely he is an SP rated 3/3.5* by the Scout and by OSA. He had a +1.0 WAR season as a rookie starter and is cost controlled for several more years. IMO, it's easy to see that such a player has way too much potential to place on irrevocable waivers. I posted the OP before I ran the rest of the season, so it was not a case of hindsight. Since he was placed on waivers, he has +8.2 WAR as a starter in 2 seasons for the Cubs.

Actually his expected role is Bullpen according to his player profile . His stamina is low and once his forkball drops a bit he will only have two pitches. Also the scouts don't rate him as a starter but as a borderline starter. His future should be in the bullpen. Try him as a starter but he will always be just a mediocre player. His stats on SDP shows him with 141 IP in 26 starts. This is only 5 innings per start.

Can you post his last two seasons? This will show if the pitcher is a starter or would be better suited in the bullpen.

[Orcin]

Originally Posted by sterjs

How do I disable or avoid irrevocable waivers?

You cannot disable waivers if you have financials on and minor leagues. You could play with reserve rosters instead of minors to avoid them. Players will still develop normally with reserve rosters.

You could also change "Signings/Transactions" and "Roster Moves" for the major league club to human control.

[sterjs]

Originally Posted by SandMan

Can you post his last two seasons? This will show if the pitcher is a starter or would be better suited in the bullpen.

[SandMan]

With the Cubs he went 16-25 in his two season with the club and 23-37 in his career. He had one mediocre season and one bad for the Cubs. He is only averaging a little over 5 innings per start. I still think this player will never be a good or average starter. He is best suited for the bullpen.

That is just my feelings looking at the stats but YMMV. Also I noticed that his salary went up to $5M from $500K. He is not worth the $5M IMO. The more I look at his ratings and his actual stats I would not put him in my rotation, but he might make a decent MR.

[Déjà Bru]

Originally Posted by sterjs

No, if you look closely he is an SP rated 3/3.5* by the Scout and by OSA. He had a +1.0 WAR season as a rookie starter and is cost controlled for several more years. IMO, it's easy to see that such a player has way too much potential to place on irrevocable waivers. I posted the OP before I ran the rest of the season, so it was not a case of hindsight. Since he was placed on waivers, he has +8.2 WAR as a starter in 2 seasons for the Cubs.

We have a difference of opinion, then. Leave aside the other points that I made; I think you disregarded this one, although you partially quoted it in your last post:

Technically, the AI did not know that would happen when it made it's waiver decision. That sounds strange to say but it's just like IRL. Some decisions look terrible in hindsight but that's part of the human condition that this game tries to simulate. You are looking at it as if there was certainty involved. Like, "The AI should have know this guy was good and that he would do well in the future, so the AI was dumb for letting him go." It does not work that way. There is a good amount of randomness, management uncertainty, and scouting error built into the game to enhance its realism.

And it's not your hindsight that I was talking about, but the AI's. Perhaps that's stretching things a bit but, if you are expecting the AI to perform perfectly in your absence, you are going to be disappointed in this game. It's supposed to make some mistakes, just like a human player would, for realism and balanced gameplay.

[RchW]

Originally Posted by SandMan

With the Cubs he went 16-25 in his two season with the club and 23-37 in his career. He had one mediocre season and one bad for the Cubs. He is only averaging a little over 5 innings per start. I still think this player will never be a good or average starter. He is best suited for the bullpen.

That is just my feelings looking at the stats but YMMV. Also I noticed that his salary went up to $5M from $500K. He is not worth the $5M IMO. The more I look at his ratings and his actual stats I would not put him in my rotation, but he might make a decent MR.

Might be a MR may be a stretch. In my 5 point scale he would be 3/2/4 with a 4-3-2 pitch ratings. I rarely look at any MR that isnt a 4 in 2 of the three pitcher ratings and a 4/5 in at least 2 pitches.

Definitely not worth the $5M.

[sterjs]

Originally Posted by Déjà Bru

And it's not your hindsight that I was talking about, but the AI's. Perhaps that's stretching things a bit but, if you are expecting the AI to perform perfectly in your absence, you are going to be disappointed in this game. It's supposed to make some mistakes, just like a human player would, for realism and balanced gameplay.

I have no expectation of perfection. I'm willing to let the AI make mistakes in exchange for saving time. The problem with irrevocable waivers imo is that they are a major roster move, but they are categorized with minor transactions.

[nyy26wc]

Originally Posted by Déjà Bru

[*]It's relatively easy for a middle reliever to get multiple star ratings in this game, for one reason or another. Don't forget that by default they are rated against each other rather than against all players in this regard. Middle relievers are the bottom of the barrel and there are usually tons of them floating around.

Not all of us undervalue middle relievers. I love building a bullpen around as many hard throwing high SO/9 pitchers that I can get my hands on. I always make sure I have at least 3 good middle relievers at all times. I currently have David Robertson, Steve Chisek and Huston Street. I've also got a prospect I really like, but he can't get his ERA into single digits yet in the bigs (but, it's small sample size and he only has a handful of major league appearances so far), but hopefully he will pan out. Then, when I get to dump Mariano Rivera and his almost 6 ERA at the end of this season, I am pretty certain that I will go with a pure middle reliever bullpen and stick whoever's available at the moment into the 9th inning in any particular game.

[RchW]

Originally Posted by sterjs

I have no expectation of perfection. I'm willing to let the AI make mistakes in exchange for saving time. The problem with irrevocable waivers imo is that they are a major roster move, but they are categorized with minor transactions.

Not in the game I play.

[nyy26wc]

Originally Posted by RchW

Not in the game I play.

It depends on whether the player was a major leaguer or a minor leaguer. Releasing a major leaguer puts the move onto both the "major transactions" and the "all transactions" lists. Releasing a minor leaguer only puts it on the latter.

I just tested this in one of my test leagues. I had the Yankees release Joba Chamberlain off the major league roster and Sam Demel off the AAA roster.

[sterjs]

Originally Posted by RchW

Not in the game I play.

So if the game categorizes it as a major transactions, all the more reason for it to be lumped in Transactions instead of Roster Moves in the Manager Options screen.

[RchW]

Originally Posted by nyy26wc

It depends on whether the player was a major leaguer or a minor leaguer. Releasing a major leaguer puts the move onto both the "major transactions" and the "all transactions" lists. Releasing a minor leaguer only puts it on the latter.

I just tested this in one of my test leagues. I had the Yankees release Joba Chamberlain off the major league roster and Sam Demel off the AAA roster.

Sure but the subject was irrevocable waivers.

[RchW]

Originally Posted by sterjs

So if the game categorizes it as a major transactions, all the more reason for it to be lumped in Transactions instead of Roster Moves in the Manager Options screen.

Roster moves are transactions too. Players who have their contracts purchased and players who are demoted all show up in the Major Transaction report. I could post another screen shot but take my word on it.

I'm not quite sure what you find problematic. The pitcher in question was marginal and cost a lot. The team should put him on waivers.

[sterjs]

Originally Posted by RchW

I'm not quite sure what you find problematic. The pitcher in question was marginal and cost a lot. The team should put him on waivers.

All I can say is we strongly disagree on player evaluation. Even the AI agrees with me as he has been the #1 or #2 Starter for the Cubs for 3 seasons with 10.5 Total WAR. In MLB, the going rate is about $5-$6 million/win(not sure what the OOTP rate is for $140 million average budget) and this guy is yielding over 3 wins per season. ML caliber SP don't grow on trees--a guy like this can make any rotation in MLB.

[CatKnight]

Originally Posted by Orcin

You cannot disable waivers if you have financials on and minor leagues. You could play with reserve rosters instead of minors to avoid them. Players will still develop normally with reserve rosters.

What? Of course you can.

When you use the drop down menu to select the number of days for the waiver period, you can disable the rule.

[Orcin]

Originally Posted by CatKnight

What? Of course you can.

When you use the drop down menu to select the number of days for the waiver period, you can disable the rule.

Ah, thanks for pointing that out. I didn't realize "Waiver Rule Disabled" was an option in "Waiver Period Length". I don't think I have ever opened that dropdown.

That should solve the OP's problem then.