124 Appearances

[henry296]

I was just playing around/testing and noticed a relief pitcher in the 1990s get 124 appearances. Anyone else see anything so dramatic?

[mattg591971]

http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...rly-1900s.html

I'm wondering if we're seeing the same problem and it is somehow tied into the pitcher fatigue problem others are reporting.

[megamanmatt]

Originally Posted by henry296

I was just playing around/testing and noticed a relief pitcher in the 1990s get 124 appearances. Anyone else see anything so dramatic?

I haven't seen this. So far the single season record for games played by a pitcher in my league is 89 games. How prevalent is it? One player with 124, while certainly a crazy number, may just be a player who played his butt off, but if you're seeing like 6 or 7 guys then there may very well be a problem.

Single season record in reality is 106 by the way so like I said one player isn't beyond the stretch of my imagination but if it's multiple players then something is wonky.

[DeViLzzz]

Mike Marshall had 106 appearances in the majors in one season once and considering how pitchers can be called in to just face one batter in a game many times during a season now it may be broken one day. Don't be alarmed by one high total and considering you haven't mentioned any other high totals well it is just a rare thing that happens.

[henry296]

This was a historical league started in 1984 and simmed until 2006.

There have been 22 pitchers to tie or break Mike Marshall record of 106 games and 70 players over those 23 seasons have pitched in 100 or more.

I checked Brad Lidge who had over 100 games in 2006 and he appeared in 16 straight games. Most of them were 1/3 of an inning or less.

[Marinersfan51]

In my MLB quickstart in 2013 I saw about 20 rp break 100 games, none had more than 106 though.

[mattg591971]

I havean odd question for you...what schedule are you loading? Are using a created/generated one, or the official MLB schedules? Testing for the link I posted above, I noticed that I get a marked difference in reliever usage when I use a created/generated schedule, though you guys are using modern setups so the off days should line up pretty well between the two different schedule types. Just throwing it out there.

[henry296]

Originally Posted by mattg591971

I havean odd question for you...what schedule are you loading? Are using a created/generated one, or the official MLB schedules? Testing for the link I posted above, I noticed that I get a marked difference in reliever usage when I use a created/generated schedule, though you guys are using modern setups so the off days should line up pretty well between the two different schedule types. Just throwing it out there.

I'm doing nothing out of the ordinary for schedules. Just started in 1984 and hit sim. The Brad Lidge example was actual calendar days in a row without a break.

[DoubleBacon]

Maybe Dusty Baker was his manager! I doubt any pitcher would pitch in all but 38 games in one season these days. There would be plenty of blow out games mixed with a few complete games where a decent manager would give the guy a rest. But innings pitched would be a better barometer of how realistic or unrealistic this stat is. If a manager liked to use a guy in "special" situations to just pitch to one batter at times, then theoretically this would be possible. Like a lefty brought in just to face a lefty.

[mattg591971]

Originally Posted by henry296

I'm doing nothing out of the ordinary for schedules. Just started in 1984 and hit sim. The Brad Lidge example was actual calendar days in a row without a break.

I just posted some tests I did in my thread, but it doesn't seem like the schedules should make much diference in a modern setting. What I am finding, though, is that due to the number of games being pitched, your all-time ERA leader board is going to be full of relievers if they can keep their ERAs down.

[henry296]

Check out Lidge's log from early 2006. Lots of short appearances, but I'm guess it is one batter then AI sees he is tired and then pulls him. Repeat the next day,

[mattg591971]

Have you tried replicating with fictional players? Just a thought to see if the AI behaves the same way or if it might be the way stamina is being interpreted from the Lahman database (or whatever database you're using) or something like that.

[mattg591971]

After running a historical game to look at the problem I'm having, I'm seeing the same thing as you with pitchers...pitchers being used everyday throwing a small number of pitches and innings. For 1920, I'm seeing the games pitched leader with 76 games and having been used no more than 2 innings each game, sometimes throwing 10 or less pitches.

Edited to add a pic of a fictional player. Look at 8/4 onward. This digital player should have had his virtual arm fall off, yet he is only 59% tired.

Edited a second time to to say I added this to the bug report thread. Also going to try a reinstall as suggested in my linked thread above.

[Markus Heinsohn]

I'll look into this.

There are many possible reasons that may cause relief appearances to be quite high, though.

[mattg591971]

Thanks Markus. If you look in my thread about pitcher usage in the 1900s, which is linked above, you'll notice not everyone is having this issue.

[Markus Heinsohn]

Originally Posted by mattg591971

Thanks Markus. If you look in my thread about pitcher usage in the 1900s, which is linked above, you'll notice not everyone is having this issue.

That's something completely different, though.

[Markus Heinsohn]

Originally Posted by mattg591971

After running a historical game to look at the problem I'm having, I'm seeing the same thing as you with pitchers...pitchers being used everyday throwing a small number of pitches and innings. For 1920, I'm seeing the games pitched leader with 76 games and having been used no more than 2 innings each game, sometimes throwing 10 or less pitches.

Edited to add a pic of a fictional player. Look at 8/4 onward. This digital player should have had his virtual arm fall off, yet he is only 59% tired.

Edited a second time to to say I added this to the bug report thread. Also going to try a reinstall as suggested in my linked thread above.

You need to make sure you have...
a) the right league strategy settings
b) the proper player creation modifiers
c) the right league totals modifiers

All these need to be in sync so that you get good results with fictional players in historical leagues.

[Markus Heinsohn]

OK, I looked into this, simulating 1990 through 2020 (career mode), and only 3 times was the 100 mark eclipsed (the high is 103), so everything seems to work properly on default settings.

[henry296]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

OK, I looked into this, simulating 1990 through 2020 (career mode), and only 3 times was the 100 mark eclipsed (the high is 103), so everything seems to work properly on default settings.

Markus,

I checked the last couple of seasons and for the most part the leaders is in the mid 80s in terms of games pitched. Therefore with 10% of seasons exceeding that by nearly 15% that seems a little high and could be tweaked.

Also, only about 5-10 pitchers exceed 80 appearances. How many were exceeding that threshold in your test sims>