Bullpen Issues

ink625 · 08-16-2010, 06:53 PM

The AI manager never uses my #1 and #2 MR. The 3 & 4 guys get all the innings. The setup man, mop-up and closer are being used properly. 2 months into my season and my #1 & 2 MR have a combined 1.1 IP. My 3 & 4 have a combined 21.2 IP. When I move my 1 & 2 to 3 & 4 then they get all the innings and the new 1 & 2 get none. Any ideas?

BusterKing · 08-16-2010, 09:01 PM

Have you tried not to assign any relievers?

SteveP · 08-16-2010, 09:26 PM

Don't know for sure what you mean by your numbering system, but ...

shot in the dark: the AI doesn't agree with your assessment of who is really the best #1 RP. Putting guys in a certain order in the reliever boxes has no influence on the AI whatsoever. That is not obvious, of course. So, if that is the problem, sorry. In any event, if you give control to the AI, the AI will decide these things on the basis of what the AI thinks is good.

ink625 · 08-16-2010, 10:39 PM

If my team was the Cleveland Rifles then Christian and Martinez would rarely get to pitch and Miles and Montgomery would pitch all the time. If I switched their spots in the middle relief section then Miles and Montgomery would rarely pitch and Christian and Martinez would pitch all the time with no exceptions. Regardless of who the AI thinks is the best MR, shouldn't all four get to pitch at least somewhat frequently? 2 of my 4 relievers are only pitching once every couple weeks or less. Sorry forgot to quote, but this is in response to SteveP.

ink625 · 08-16-2010, 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BusterKing

Have you tried not to assign any relievers?

Never thought of that. I'll try it.

bailey · 08-16-2010, 10:50 PM

I've also observed this 'feature'. If you want the other guys to get innings, set a pitch count to the pitcher's getting all the innings forcing the AI to take them out early.

SteveP · 08-16-2010, 11:31 PM

I see you have scouting turned on. The AI may have a better idea about the ability of those pitchers than you do.

ink625 · 08-17-2010, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveP

I see you have scouting turned on. The AI may have a better idea about the ability of those pitchers than you do.

I do have scouting turned on, but this isn't a screenshot for my team. It is just an example. Regardless of who the AI thinks is better, I have 4 middle relievers and I think more than 2 of them should be used. At this rate 2 of my relievers would only get a combined 4 or 5 innings for the entire season. This seems ridiculous to me. With that said, I am going to try to not set the middle relievers and see if that helps. If it doesn't I will mess with the pitch counts a little. Thanks for your input everyone.

dmarco82 · 08-18-2010, 01:39 PM

I think the issue is stamina. The two guys that are not pitching very often have very low stamina and the two guys who are pitching a lot have relatively high stamina. I think the AI is using the first two guys when they are rested, but it is taking them a while to recover from being used before they can pitch again.

SteveP · 08-18-2010, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmarco82

I think the issue is stamina. The two guys that are not pitching very often have very low stamina and the two guys who are pitching a lot have relatively high stamina. I think the AI is using the first two guys when they are rested, but it is taking them a while to recover from being used before they can pitch again.

Yeah, that's the other reason (besides scouting). There is no easy fix for this, though guys have played with options and LTM settings, etc., to spread IPouts for RPs around more. I think the easiest option may be to set the RP stamina LTM to .900 (to pick a number). This LTM doesn't ever adjust on its own, so I don't see why someone couldn't play with this LTM as much as they wanted.

Just an idea.

MikeyB · 08-18-2010, 03:55 PM

Wouldn't a simpler work around be to use the Player Strategy settings? Take the 2 guys you don't want pitching as much and set them to "Hook Early". That might help, no?

ink625 · 08-18-2010, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmarco82

I think the issue is stamina. The two guys that are not pitching very often have very low stamina and the two guys who are pitching a lot have relatively high stamina. I think the AI is using the first two guys when they are rested, but it is taking them a while to recover from being used before they can pitch again.

The guys in the post above aren't my players. That is just a sample screenshot.

My players have the following stamina ratings

Pitcher A is 68
Pitcer B is 59
Pitcher C is 51
Pitcher D is 50

Pitcher C and D were getting the most innings by far.

However, I did manage to fix the issue to my liking with pitch counts and not setting my middle relievers. Thanks for the input guys!

sley · 08-20-2010, 01:12 PM

I'm having similar problems with AI pitching decisions when simming. Viewing replays.... My Amercian League team ace was yanked going into the 9th inning with a no hitter, 6 k's, 1 walk, pitch count not an issue. Two relievers came in and promptly lost the game. Two days later in a simmed game my #3 starter pitched a nine inning complete game giving up 29 runs! There were 3 healthy rested relievers and even a healthy rested closer. A few weeks later because of dtd injuries and rest issues I had to start a reliever with a high stamina rating. He pitched 5 innings and 2 other relievers finished up. The very next day, that same reliever who started and pitched the day before was used in relief and was shelled. He was the only reliever used but there were 2 other relievers and a closer available. The AI had other options and the decisions didn't make sense. Not much realism if you ask me. By the way those two relievers who lost the no hit game, I traded them to Pittsburgh.

SteveP · 08-20-2010, 02:15 PM

Might be something broken in your copy of the game, but ...

[QUOTE=sley;3030788]

Quote:

My Amercian League team ace was yanked going into the 9th inning with a no hitter, 6 k's, 1 walk, pitch count not an issue.

Was he yanked for a PH or for a reliever? If the former, you may need to check the various PH for Pitcher settings/slider. If the latter, how do you know pitch count was not an issue?

Quote:

Two days later in a simmed game my #3 starter pitched a nine inning complete game giving up 29 runs!

That sounds like something is broken.

Quote:

The very next day, that same reliever who started and pitched the day before was used in relief and was shelled.

Likewise, but worth taking a look at the Hook Relievers slider.

sley · 08-22-2010, 04:57 PM

Thanks for your reply Steve.
It was an American League team's pitcher so the DH was in effect so he wasn't lifted for a pinch hitter. His team was winning as well. I don't think the ph for pitcher would apply but it is down close to never on the slide. I checked the pitch count in the box score after the game and saw that the pitch count was not an issue for this pitcher. And in regards to the relief pitcher used as a starter and then used in relief the next day, I don't see how the hook relievers slider applies. I mean why would he be used at all in the first place when he pitched 5 inning the day before and there were 2 rested, healthy relievers and a closer available? I don't get it. Thanks again.

Killebrew · 08-22-2010, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveP

I see you have scouting turned on. The AI may have a better idea about the ability of those pitchers than you do.

That does not mean the game should ignore user input

. Anyone that plays OOTP a lot knows that the game has some 'issues' with player evaluation, so not only should the game apply the users instructions, in most cases it should be safe to say the user will know more than the games AI. That being said and as others have noted, reliever usage is impacted if these same #1-4 relievers are slotted elsewhere, and by their stamina ratings of course.

What used to happen is that OOTP seemed to give the 3rd slotted reliever the lions share of the relief innings, even if you set all relievers to a 25 pitch limit. I am able to get a lot of innings for the #1 slot reliever in OOTP10 and OOTP11 as long as he is not used in the other pitching slots, but the game still goes to the #3 reliever more often than the #2 for some reason. I just write this off as a game quirk and try to slot my relievers with that usage in mind.

Also, if you really want to bury a pitcher - see how many innings the game gives a setup guy that is not slotted elsewhere

.

Left-handed Badger · 08-22-2010, 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmarco82

I think the issue is stamina. The two guys that are not pitching very often have very low stamina and the two guys who are pitching a lot have relatively high stamina. I think the AI is using the first two guys when they are rested, but it is taking them a while to recover from being used before they can pitch again.

If I understand the complaint correctly though. They are pitching 1 inning a month. Just how low does their stamina have to be for that?

dmarco82 · 08-23-2010, 12:21 AM

If you are not playing out/managing your games, another way to look at it is that you are the GM of the team and the manager apparently does not agree with your evaluations of the players. Maybe it is time for him to go and be replaced by someone else.

Killebrew · 08-23-2010, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmarco82

If you are not playing out/managing your games, another way to look at it is that you are the GM of the team and the manager apparently does not agree with your evaluations of the players. Maybe it is time for him to go and be replaced by someone else.

If OOTP really worked that way then why would anyone bother controlling a team? It would just be an AI-only simulation with OOTP customers as the audience. Fortunately, I'm pretty sure OOTP does not work that way

.

SteveP · 08-23-2010, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killebrew

What used to happen is that OOTP seemed to give the 3rd slotted reliever the lions share of the relief innings, even if you set all relievers to a 25 pitch limit. I am able to get a lot of innings for the #1 slot reliever in OOTP10 and OOTP11 as long as he is not used in the other pitching slots, but the game still goes to the #3 reliever more often than the #2 for some reason. I just write this off as a game quirk and try to slot my relievers with that usage in mind.

AFAIK, the AI does not pay any attention to the order in which you put guys in those boxes. To the AI they are just a pool of RPs that you specify should be considered as MRs, Setup guys or Closers. I believe the impact of what you do here is only an influence on the AI, not definitive. If the AI happens to really like a guy, it will always use that guy as the first choice until he becomes too tired to pitch.

There is something similar that can happen with pinch hitting.

08-16-2010, 10:39 PM	#4
ink625 Major Leagues Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Kentucky Posts: 406	If my team was the Cleveland Rifles then Christian and Martinez would rarely get to pitch and Miles and Montgomery would pitch all the time. If I switched their spots in the middle relief section then Miles and Montgomery would rarely pitch and Christian and Martinez would pitch all the time with no exceptions. Regardless of who the AI thinks is the best MR, shouldn't all four get to pitch at least somewhat frequently? 2 of my 4 relievers are only pitching once every couple weeks or less. Sorry forgot to quote, but this is in response to SteveP. Attached Images Last edited by ink625; 08-16-2010 at 10:46 PM.

08-18-2010, 01:39 PM	#9
dmarco82 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 46	Stamina I think the issue is stamina. The two guys that are not pitching very often have very low stamina and the two guys who are pitching a lot have relatively high stamina. I think the AI is using the first two guys when they are rested, but it is taking them a while to recover from being used before they can pitch again.

08-18-2010, 03:55 PM	#11
MikeyB Minors (Double A) Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Calgary, AB Posts: 118	Wouldn't a simpler work around be to use the Player Strategy settings? Take the 2 guys you don't want pitching as much and set them to "Hook Early". That might help, no? __________________ BML Commish www.ootp-bml.com

08-20-2010, 01:12 PM	#13
sley Minors (Double A) Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 182	Really bad AI pitching decisions I'm having similar problems with AI pitching decisions when simming. Viewing replays.... My Amercian League team ace was yanked going into the 9th inning with a no hitter, 6 k's, 1 walk, pitch count not an issue. Two relievers came in and promptly lost the game. Two days later in a simmed game my #3 starter pitched a nine inning complete game giving up 29 runs! There were 3 healthy rested relievers and even a healthy rested closer. A few weeks later because of dtd injuries and rest issues I had to start a reliever with a high stamina rating. He pitched 5 innings and 2 other relievers finished up. The very next day, that same reliever who started and pitched the day before was used in relief and was shelled. He was the only reliever used but there were 2 other relievers and a closer available. The AI had other options and the decisions didn't make sense. Not much realism if you ask me. By the way those two relievers who lost the no hit game, I traded them to Pittsburgh.

08-16-2010, 06:53 PM	#1
ink625 Major Leagues Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Kentucky Posts: 406	Bullpen Issues The AI manager never uses my #1 and #2 MR. The 3 & 4 guys get all the innings. The setup man, mop-up and closer are being used properly. 2 months into my season and my #1 & 2 MR have a combined 1.1 IP. My 3 & 4 have a combined 21.2 IP. When I move my 1 & 2 to 3 & 4 then they get all the innings and the new 1 & 2 get none. Any ideas?

08-16-2010, 09:01 PM	#2
BusterKing Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 2,434	Have you tried not to assign any relievers?

08-16-2010, 09:26 PM	#3
SteveP Moderator Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 3,109	Don't know for sure what you mean by your numbering system, but ... shot in the dark: the AI doesn't agree with your assessment of who is really the best #1 RP. Putting guys in a certain order in the reliever boxes has no influence on the AI whatsoever. That is not obvious, of course. So, if that is the problem, sorry. In any event, if you give control to the AI, the AI will decide these things on the basis of what the AI thinks is good.

08-16-2010, 10:50 PM	#6
bailey Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 3,424	I've also observed this 'feature'. If you want the other guys to get innings, set a pitch count to the pitcher's getting all the innings forcing the AI to take them out early.

08-16-2010, 11:31 PM	#7
SteveP Moderator Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 3,109	I see you have scouting turned on. The AI may have a better idea about the ability of those pitchers than you do.

08-22-2010, 04:57 PM	#15
sley Minors (Double A) Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 182	Thanks for your reply Steve. It was an American League team's pitcher so the DH was in effect so he wasn't lifted for a pinch hitter. His team was winning as well. I don't think the ph for pitcher would apply but it is down close to never on the slide. I checked the pitch count in the box score after the game and saw that the pitch count was not an issue for this pitcher. And in regards to the relief pitcher used as a starter and then used in relief the next day, I don't see how the hook relievers slider applies. I mean why would he be used at all in the first place when he pitched 5 inning the day before and there were 2 rested, healthy relievers and a closer available? I don't get it. Thanks again.

08-23-2010, 12:21 AM	#18
dmarco82 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 46	If you are not playing out/managing your games, another way to look at it is that you are the GM of the team and the manager apparently does not agree with your evaluations of the players. Maybe it is time for him to go and be replaced by someone else.