Furture of Baseball

Bohunk · 06-27-2002, 12:46 PM

With Modern baseball and where it seems to be headed, thoughts come to mind of the MLB folding up its tents and shutting down. I guess its possible, given the current economics of the game. I can see fans getting disinterested in alot of cities, except for those 4 or 5 that compete every year and can afford 100 to 150 million dollar payrolls. Who wants to root for a team that under the current conditions has no chance of competing? I sit and watch my Pirates lose constantly, and it gets depressing as a fan.

Here in Cleveland, Bartolo and Thome are on the block because next year they will command around 25 to 30 million a year and the Indians can't afford to spend half their budgeted payroll (around 60 to 65 mil) on two players. Plus they want to get something for them beofre they become FA's.

But we as OOTP players have an opertunity to change all of this (I think) by adjusting our league. What if MLB disbanded say around 2010 and wanted to start up a new league and make it work right? I have set up leagues in different styles on several occasion's but I could not get it to work. I set a salary cap and adjusted the economics so that the highest paid players sit around 5 million. The problem comes in where a player wants more salary than a team can afford (those hall of famers that deserve more money under the current system) and that player ends up retiring at 31 or 32, and they don't meet the criteria for entering the HOF with only about 6 to 10 years of big league experience.

Is there a way to make players that would get 6 to 20 mil a year only want 5 or so and those average players want less as well without adjusting in the editor?

Steve Kuffrey · 06-27-2002, 01:05 PM

No, there is currently no way to adjust what the top players will want as far as salary goes. But, it does not get higher as you play more years it is maxed out now...so that the top salaries end up somewhere in the mid-teen millions or so.

Chappy · 06-27-2002, 01:22 PM

I made a league similar to the one you describe. I basically took the international league (with fictional players), set TV contracts to $0 expiring in 1900 (so they never get TV deals) and created ballparks that held the correct number of fans (usually between 8 and 16 thousand, I found the stadium statistics online but only entered # of seats, I didn't mess with dimensions).

Needless to say, the free agent pool grew extensively after 5 years. Occasionally, a 'superstar' would sign a 1 year deal in April or May, but most players refused to sign and retired young.

It's a wierd thing when your career hits leader had a .280 career average.

jameyhammock · 06-27-2002, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Chappy
I made a league similar to the one you describe. I basically took the international league (with fictional players), set TV contracts to $0 expiring in 1900 (so they never get TV deals) and created ballparks that held the correct number of fans (usually between 8 and 16 thousand, I found the stadium statistics online but only entered # of seats, I didn't mess with dimensions).

Needless to say, the free agent pool grew extensively after 5 years. Occasionally, a 'superstar' would sign a 1 year deal in April or May, but most players refused to sign and retired young.

It's a wierd thing when your career hits leader had a .280 career average.

I guess that's a good way to simulate an independent league. All of your good players end up getting signed by the big league clubs and you're left with only so-so players.

Bohunk · 06-27-2002, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Steve Kuffrey
No, there is currently no way to adjust what the top players will want as far as salary goes. But, it does not get higher as you play more years it is maxed out now...so that the top salaries end up somewhere in the mid-teen millions or so.

Thats too bad. I was hoping there would be a way to adjust this, maybe in a furture patch or somehting

Anyway I just got tired of seeing the Yanks and Mets in my current single player league and IRL go to the playoffs every year and teams like KC and Milwaulkee(sp?) never have enough money even to sign free agents

SoxWin · 06-27-2002, 02:16 PM

Personally I think the future of baseball is brighter then the furture but really, what do I know?

Cheers

Rich

CMH · 06-27-2002, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SoxWin
Personally I think the future of baseball is brighter then the furture but really, what do I know?

Cheers

Rich

SoxWin beat me to it...

Bohunk · 06-27-2002, 02:34 PM

OK typo, sorry.

SoxWin · 06-27-2002, 02:40 PM

Quote:

SoxWin beat me to it...

Just like my boys are beating your pansy team

Cheers

Rich

CMH · 06-27-2002, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SoxWin

Just like my boys are beating your pansy team

Cheers

Rich

yea you're right, its only been 2 years since we won a championship

Malleus Dei · 06-27-2002, 04:15 PM

Furture Legends

http://www.goldencountry.net/flegends.htm

Furture products

http://www.deltamodels.bigstep.com/generic.html?pid=4

SoxWin · 06-27-2002, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Furture Legends

http://www.goldencountry.net/flegends.htm

Furture products

http://www.deltamodels.bigstep.com/generic.html?pid=4

Now that's some good stuff

Quote:

yea you're right, its only been 2 years since we won a championship

Yep, losers

Cheers

Rich

spleen1015 · 06-27-2002, 05:37 PM

It would be very cool if OOTP's financial system would adapt to situations like these. Players wouldn't demand 10 mil when the team only makes 10 mil in a season. They would ask for 900K or something. Maybe the Era Manager could include financial settings some day...

Malleus Dei · 06-27-2002, 06:03 PM

The Furture of Baseball... a time, taking place beyond the veil of the present, in which every owner, GM and manager acts just as furtively as Bud Selig does...

Carlton · 06-27-2002, 06:35 PM

ok stop picking on typos...you crazy wack jobs...hahaha..but seriously

I hate you ridea of "financial balance" in Baseball

If an owner cannot run a Major league team its his fault...The Salary Cap is Communism plain and simple and if it takes a hold of Baseball I will never watch it again.

E-one likes to say it works in Football and Basketball...does it? Ask the veterans of Football...ask Antonio Freeman of The Packers. All it does is create chaos.

Baseball was great in the fact that it was Capitalism in its finest...like Microsoft...because they are #1 doesn't give Congress the right to break it up as a Monopoly. That case was pure jealousy and Lobbyist pocket money.

Our country was based on the system that you can start from nowhere and become a success. For every complaint I hear about The Yankees "buying" championships I cite the 70's and 80's ...what happened there with the Yanks? George was still in charge.

For every small market bitch I cite 1980 who was in the Series? KC Royals perhaps...what about the Twins? The Padres a few years ago?

Payroll means nothing, talent and cohesion as a team and maybe even a family (even a dysfunctional one like The 86 Mets) means success.

That's why I 'used" to love Baseball with all my heart...because it was once personal...not so distant and owner controlled like Basketball and Football.

And if they change to appease the uninformed masses it wil be a crying shame.

Baseball is America
America is Capitalism
and if you can't run an easy operation like Baseball then like Enron you should disappear!

CMH · 06-27-2002, 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by spleen1015
It would be very cool if OOTP's financial system would adapt to situations like these. Players wouldn't demand 10 mil when the team only makes 10 mil in a season. They would ask for 900K or something. Maybe the Era Manager could include financial settings some day...

10 million compred to 900,000 is a HUGE HUGE difference in salary demands. i think every major league owner would love to have you as a player...

Specs · 06-27-2002, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Carlton
ok stop picking on typos...you crazy wack jobs...hahaha..but seriously

I hate you ridea of "financial balance" in Baseball

This "ridea" you speak of...?

CMH · 06-27-2002, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Specs

This "ridea" you speak of...?

i think its a noun...

for example...you ridea!

Bohunk · 06-28-2002, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Carlton
ok stop picking on typos...you crazy wack jobs...hahaha..but seriously

I hate you ridea of "financial balance" in Baseball

If an owner cannot run a Major league team its his fault...The Salary Cap is Communism plain and simple and if it takes a hold of Baseball I will never watch it again.

E-one likes to say it works in Football and Basketball...does it? Ask the veterans of Football...ask Antonio Freeman of The Packers. All it does is create chaos.

Baseball was great in the fact that it was Capitalism in its finest...like Microsoft...because they are #1 doesn't give Congress the right to break it up as a Monopoly. That case was pure jealousy and Lobbyist pocket money.

Our country was based on the system that you can start from nowhere and become a success. For every complaint I hear about The Yankees "buying" championships I cite the 70's and 80's ...what happened there with the Yanks? George was still in charge.

For every small market bitch I cite 1980 who was in the Series? KC Royals perhaps...what about the Twins? The Padres a few years ago?

Payroll means nothing, talent and cohesion as a team and maybe even a family (even a dysfunctional one like The 86 Mets) means success.

That's why I 'used" to love Baseball with all my heart...because it was once personal...not so distant and owner controlled like Basketball and Football.

And if they change to appease the uninformed masses it wil be a crying shame.

Baseball is America
America is Capitalism
and if you can't run an easy operation like Baseball then like Enron you should disappear!

Unfortunatley I don't know any ex-football or ex-basketball players so I can't ask them. And frankly, I could care less about them. What I care about is the once great sport of baseball. It's the best sport in the world IMO but its run like crap.

It's sad that you have to go back 20 to 30 years to show us when small market teams actually won anything. I think the league is in worse shape today than it was in the 70's and 80's. The average paid per player in 1970 was around $29,000 in 1980 it was around $150,000, now its at $2 mil. Quite a difference, and the small markets can't afford that.

Yes good management in baseball is essential, but small market teams are at a disadvantage to the large market teams. If KC needs a Giambi to have a chance at competeing for at least a Div championship, they do not have the amount of money it takes to get him, where the Yanks have all the money they need. Oakland certainly did not have the money to keep him, but the Yanks didn't mind if their payroll went over $100 mil.

The Indians a small to med market team, had great management along with a new stadium and ended up winning the div title 6 out of 7 years. At their height of popularity they sold out the stadium several years in and row and still could not go over a $100 in payroll. Why, because they still could not bring in the money the Yanks can. Since 1995 the Yanks have been in the playoffs every year and will probably be for years to come because they can afford to have the highest payroll in the league every year. And the highest payroll means (with the right decisions) the best players. They don't have to "retool", they don't have to wait for their young stars to get good and then compete. The MLB is turning into the Yanks and Mets with 28 farm teams IMHO.

Anywho, their are more small and med market teams in baseball than there are big market teams. And if baseball wants to continue in the same path I can't see people buying seasons tickets for a those teams that has no chance of competing that year, which will lead to the Yanks and Mets winning more and more.

Payroll means everything. Players want the money, only 5 or 6 teams have the money. Consiquently those are the teams that compete year after year anymore.

spleen1015 · 06-28-2002, 01:14 PM

Free Agency is the cause of the current situation. When players are going to the highest bidder, salaries are bound to get inflated. Then it becomes a small market/big market issue. Yes, the A's might be good right now, but wait until all of those guys start asking for 15 mil a year contracts. You might as well change the Yankees nickname to Athletics.

06-27-2002, 01:05 PM	#2
Steve Kuffrey Administrator Join Date: Jul 1999 Location: S.E. TN - Georgia born and raised Posts: 17,036	No, there is currently no way to adjust what the top players will want as far as salary goes. But, it does not get higher as you play more years it is maxed out now...so that the top salaries end up somewhere in the mid-teen millions or so. __________________ Steve Kuffrey DABS Atlanta Braves - 2008 Eastern Division Champ *DBLC Atlanta Braves - 2011, 2014 East Division Champ, 2012, 2013 NL Wildcard Baseball Maelstrom-Montreal Expos-2013 Tourney winner, 2014 WC Team Sparky's League - Tampa Bay D'Rays Epicenter Baseball League - Astros 2014 The CBL Rewind - Phillies '95

06-27-2002, 02:16 PM	#6
SoxWin Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Blissful ignorance Posts: 3,315	Personally I think the future of baseball is brighter then the furture but really, what do I know? Cheers Rich __________________ It's called partying. When you do a lot of it, you're bound to be places where the police show up. I smoke a lot of pot and drink a lot of beer. I also graduated Suma Cum Laude. ****ing sue me. - Luis Rivera

06-27-2002, 02:34 PM	#8
Bohunk Minors (Single A) Join Date: May 2002 Location: Cleveland Posts: 73	OK typo, sorry. Last edited by Bohunk; 06-27-2002 at 02:37 PM.

06-27-2002, 12:46 PM	#1
Bohunk Minors (Single A) Join Date: May 2002 Location: Cleveland Posts: 73	Future of Baseball With Modern baseball and where it seems to be headed, thoughts come to mind of the MLB folding up its tents and shutting down. I guess its possible, given the current economics of the game. I can see fans getting disinterested in alot of cities, except for those 4 or 5 that compete every year and can afford 100 to 150 million dollar payrolls. Who wants to root for a team that under the current conditions has no chance of competing? I sit and watch my Pirates lose constantly, and it gets depressing as a fan. Here in Cleveland, Bartolo and Thome are on the block because next year they will command around 25 to 30 million a year and the Indians can't afford to spend half their budgeted payroll (around 60 to 65 mil) on two players. Plus they want to get something for them beofre they become FA's. But we as OOTP players have an opertunity to change all of this (I think) by adjusting our league. What if MLB disbanded say around 2010 and wanted to start up a new league and make it work right? I have set up leagues in different styles on several occasion's but I could not get it to work. I set a salary cap and adjusted the economics so that the highest paid players sit around 5 million. The problem comes in where a player wants more salary than a team can afford (those hall of famers that deserve more money under the current system) and that player ends up retiring at 31 or 32, and they don't meet the criteria for entering the HOF with only about 6 to 10 years of big league experience. Is there a way to make players that would get 6 to 20 mil a year only want 5 or so and those average players want less as well without adjusting in the editor? Last edited by Bohunk; 06-27-2002 at 02:32 PM.

06-27-2002, 01:22 PM	#3
Chappy Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Raleigh, NC Posts: 2,721	I made a league similar to the one you describe. I basically took the international league (with fictional players), set TV contracts to $0 expiring in 1900 (so they never get TV deals) and created ballparks that held the correct number of fans (usually between 8 and 16 thousand, I found the stadium statistics online but only entered # of seats, I didn't mess with dimensions). Needless to say, the free agent pool grew extensively after 5 years. Occasionally, a 'superstar' would sign a 1 year deal in April or May, but most players refused to sign and retired young. It's a wierd thing when your career hits leader had a .280 career average.

06-27-2002, 05:37 PM	#13
spleen1015 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 6,010	It would be very cool if OOTP's financial system would adapt to situations like these. Players wouldn't demand 10 mil when the team only makes 10 mil in a season. They would ask for 900K or something. Maybe the Era Manager could include financial settings some day...

06-27-2002, 06:35 PM	#15
Carlton Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 3,765	ok stop picking on typos...you crazy wack jobs...hahaha..but seriously I hate you ridea of "financial balance" in Baseball If an owner cannot run a Major league team its his fault...The Salary Cap is Communism plain and simple and if it takes a hold of Baseball I will never watch it again. E-one likes to say it works in Football and Basketball...does it? Ask the veterans of Football...ask Antonio Freeman of The Packers. All it does is create chaos. Baseball was great in the fact that it was Capitalism in its finest...like Microsoft...because they are #1 doesn't give Congress the right to break it up as a Monopoly. That case was pure jealousy and Lobbyist pocket money. Our country was based on the system that you can start from nowhere and become a success. For every complaint I hear about The Yankees "buying" championships I cite the 70's and 80's ...what happened there with the Yanks? George was still in charge. For every small market bitch I cite 1980 who was in the Series? KC Royals perhaps...what about the Twins? The Padres a few years ago? Payroll means nothing, talent and cohesion as a team and maybe even a family (even a dysfunctional one like The 86 Mets) means success. That's why I 'used" to love Baseball with all my heart...because it was once personal...not so distant and owner controlled like Basketball and Football. And if they change to appease the uninformed masses it wil be a crying shame. Baseball is America America is Capitalism and if you can't run an easy operation like Baseball then like Enron you should disappear!

06-28-2002, 01:14 PM	#20
spleen1015 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 6,010	Free Agency is the cause of the current situation. When players are going to the highest bidder, salaries are bound to get inflated. Then it becomes a small market/big market issue. Yes, the A's might be good right now, but wait until all of those guys start asking for 15 mil a year contracts. You might as well change the Yankees nickname to Athletics.