Patch 6.02A makes game run slower?

[octones]

Well, if it is how the game is going to be now with the patch it definately should have been mentioned in the patch readme.

Something this big should have been noted, as it is quite obvious it should have been expected to be made a big deal of otherwise, as it has been now.

So either they failed to notify us of the significant slowdown or there is a bug or memory leak causing things to go much slower. All people are asking for is an official word from Markus on if this was intended or not. Right now we have no word saying it was intended, so of course you are going to have people asking if it is intended.

[sguthrie]

Originally posted by adventureran
No, I'd certainly not expect it to be correct when the game is released. That would be expecting far too much.

True, it should've worked the first time (please don't imply that I said it shouldn't have). But it didn't and they fixed it. I still don't understand why the slower speed would have been acceptable if it were right the first time, but not now that it's been fixed.

[octones]

Originally posted by sguthrie
True, it should've worked the first time (please don't imply that I said it shouldn't have). But it didn't and they fixed it. I still don't understand why the slower speed would have been acceptable if it were right the first time, but not now that it's been fixed.

That's not the point.

The point is that no mention was made of the game now being 3 times slower (or more) than before.

I think people are fine with the game working more realisticaly. I guess we just expected to be notified of such a significant slowdown in the simming process.

[adventureran]

So you're saying when the game was released it was seriouisly flawed or bugged, but it's not now? That's a much better response.

And the suggestion has to do with myself and others who have posted saying that they turned all the new stuff off and it still happens. It would make sense that if you turn these new features off, there should be some speed difference.

However, I'm not getting into the "bug" aspect of this. This is just one instance and if speed is the sacrifice for more accurate stats and more realistic simming, then I personally have no problem with it and I'm sure many others don't either.

However, the fact remains how the company handles these types of things, meaning both the patches and the responses to them, has remained constant and annoying.

I'm thrilled that the company listens to the requests of its customers and attempts to incorporate them into this game. But things are not handled in a professional, or oftentimes, logical manner.

However, now I fear I have hijacked a thread about a particular concern and should get it back on track. It is much slower to sim now and I would like a response from someone who actually has working knowledge of OOTP, that either this is due to the increased AI logic or not. And, if it is, why there are no determinable differences in speed when many of the transaction features are disabled.

Thank you.

Originally posted by Henry
adventuran,

I can't say I agree with you. Your assuming that this is a "bug" and there is nothing "yet" to suggest that. It makes much more sense that this is the result of adding all the roster rules to the game - and getting them to work right. If so, Steve is right in saying either live with the increased speed or turn off the options.

On the other hand, Markus is aware of the concern, and will certainly look into IF there is something he can do about it - that should be a given.

[Malleus Dei]

Originally posted by RayofHope
Interesting to see that it appears the people with pimped out hyper speed running machines seem to be the ones that "don't notice a difference."

Is a 3.2 GHz computer with 1GB of RAM considered a "pimped out hyper speed running machine"? Because I sure don't see any speed difference.

[darrylr]

Malleus,

Did you sim a full season with all the roster/waiver/etc. options turned on?

It was very noticeable on my machine (which appears to be the same as yours) when Sept came around in my season. Up until Sept 1 I didn't see much of a difference but the month of Sept. took twice as long to sim as the entire season up to the end of August? The extra time was not during the game simming but rather the Day End and Week End periods. I had absolutely nothing else running and have regular degrags and virus scans.

-Darryl

[Henry]

Someone didn't read my post....

Did some testing last night...

1.4 mhz 384mb W2K machine...

V6.01, full season, standard league, defaults, took 26 minutes
V6.02a, full season, standard league, defaults, took 84 minutes

Turned off 40 man roster, waivers, minor league options, Rule 5, and Minor league Fa, and the season took 35 minutes.

Conclusion.... 40 man roster, waivers, minor league options, Rule 5, and Minor league FA are causing the extra time.

[darrylr]

I read your post Henry and it agrees with what I am seeing.

What I am trying to figure out is why some people don't seem to see the same thing. I highly doubt it is something outside of OOTP6 that is causing the speed change but since many people claim to see no difference than some people might think it is not due to changes in OOTP6.

EDIT: I also noticed that I have computer trades, financial system, coachs/scouts, simulate minors, injuries and fatigue turned off in my setup so I don't think trading per se or these other items are involved in the extra time. I do have all the options related to rosters/waivers/rule 5/etc turned on at defaults though like Henry had.

-Darryl

[Henry]

Unfortunately we don't know if folks are running through their testing the same way we are. I ran a full season with roster rules on - then reset the league and ran the season again with rules off - noting the total time to get my numbers.

[silvam14]

Just another thing that might need to be mentioned by testers who are posting their results is the number of teams in your league. The sim times can obviously be longer if you are simming a 40 team league rather than a 12 team league.

This might make no difference to the person who is testing because it is a constant value, but to another person who might be waiting to install the patch might see 84 minutes to sim a season and say WHOA! I'm not waiting that long! but that person might have been simming a 40 team league.

I hope I am not rambling on here....

[darkhorse]

Originally posted by adventureran
But things are not handled in a professional, or oftentimes, logical manner.

I'm taken aback by this statement.

This "game" isn't worth the hassle any longer.

Glad to see you haven't abandoned ship.

[silvam14]

Originally posted by darkhorse
I'm taken aback by this statement.



Glad to see you haven't abandoned ship.

Take heart, Darkhorse, I am sure there are people who wouldn't think the game was worth the hassle because the main menu didn't look like how they would like it to be.

Whenever there is a new patch, or a problem with something, It is a certainty that some people are going to step to the ledge and jump off before ever trying to reason it out.

[slic1149]

Time for a ram upgrade. I am running at 256 now and with the new features that probably isn't enough. The shock of seeing the program on my machine (p4 1.5) almost triple in length after application of the patch is something I am going to have to get used to but I do enjoy the game and that is a sacrifice I am willing to make. It seems to me that as a straight simming game this is no longer my best bet. Looks like this will turn into a more intense management on a day by day basis than it was before. I prefer historical sims and have never fully used the game to it's potential this slowdown makes me take a look at how I play the game and perhaps will actually enhance my enjoyment.

Having said that, I do believe it is unreasonable to expect all of the folks with a slower system who enjoy simming seasons to make that adjustment. Turning off the features has helped my sim time somewhat but it still feels like it's running in molasses as compared to ootp5 and even compared to the original release of ootp6 it is much, much slower. This is a challange that I wasn't expecting and it seems that several other folks are suprised also.

It is my hope that the development team takes a long look at what they can do to speed up the program performance and still maintain the integrity of the new features. Based on past performance I will trust Markus and the company to do the best they can to balance the features and the speed issue in their normal professional manner.

This will be my last post on this matter and I hope that customer base will allow the company a chance to work through this issue without needless complaining over a problem that is now known and being examined.

[Sweed]

Originally posted by adventureran
These are the answers we have come to love and expect. First buy the game. Then while patching, we will make it miserable for you.

I could certainly understand these kinds of things happening (or at least more so) in a new version release. But in a "patch" ... ? And since we've already been admonished for using the terms patch and update incorrectly, I believe this is just a patch.

And I'm sorry, but while Steve may give the "corporate answer", it appears he just does not know So I would much rather see him post something along the lines of ... "Markus is aware of your concerns and is looking into it." However, the "just live with it" response is always good for customer appeasement.

I was truly hoping that after the debaucle that was V.5.04a,b,c, etc. that lessons would have been learned and corrections would have been made to the system. Ah well ... lessoned learned by the customer.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally posted by Steve Kuffrey
Presently I'd suggest either:

-Make do with the slower sim speeds
-Toggle some of the "roster move" options
-Cut back on the number of programs or processes running in the background.
-Upgrade your OS, RAM or other PC components if possible.

I'm sure that the speed issue will be looked at, but there's no promises that there will be increases in speed since alot of work has gone into trying to get the roster and player AI to where it needs to be(not saying that it is there but progress is being made).

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Just my opinion but I don't see anything wrong in Steve's answer.
I think too many times people read things into what is written here when there is no tone to what is said that would be available in a face to face conversation.

I don't read this as a "just live with it" at all statement. Steve starts with "presently I'd suggest" and then gives the player some options to try until the speed issue is looked at. Since he is not Markus he cannot give any promises that anything will change and simply says so. With some people (not saying you, adventureran) this cover his ass statement must be made or the board will errupt with "but Steve said" this would be fixed posts.

I guess we'd be better off if Steve did simply say
"Markus is aware of your concerns and is looking into it."( which as Henry said- should be a given) instead of giving some suggestion on how to try to work around it until it is looked at.

Let's face it the guy can't win no matter what he says

[Skipaway]

Originally posted by McSweeny
man you guys are hilarious

first you complain long and loud about the AI and the waiver system, and then you all start bitching about the patch that addressed those issues slowing your games down! what do you want? sheesh!

i want a car that gets 800,000 miles to the gallon and NEVER needs an oil change! be a little realistic

Who are "you guys"? Who actually bitched for both?

The point is, some people want it faster, while others want it more accurate. I'm sure the game is trying to find a balance.

[BlitzburghBucco]

Yeah, I noticed some slowdown, but I sim a week at a time. Really, the only time it was a nuisance was trade deadline time. I haven't gotten into September yet, but I can live with sacrficing some speed for realism. I'm not in a hurry.

That's just me though.

[BlitzburghBucco]

P.S.

1.67 GHz Athlon AMD
Win XP
1 GB RAM

[Malleus Dei]

Originally posted by darrylr
Malleus,

Did you sim a full season with all the roster/waiver/etc. options turned on?

It was very noticeable on my machine (which appears to be the same as yours) when Sept came around in my season. Up until Sept 1 I didn't see much of a difference but the month of Sept. took twice as long to sim as the entire season up to the end of August? The extra time was not during the game simming but rather the Day End and Week End periods. I had absolutely nothing else running and have regular degrags and virus scans.

-Darryl

Three times. Didn't notice any slowdown. Will try again and time it.

[octones]

This is akin to a developer of a FPS game putting out a patch that would drop the game from 50fps to 20fps on the best machines out there.

Sure, it adds new features and makes it more realistic - but you didn't tell anyone that it would slow it down so much.

Let it also be known that I am fine with the patch. I like the additions and I don't mind the slower speed. Sure, it is a pain right now just because I'm simming through the years right now but I can live with it. Just would have liked to have known before hand rather than start simming and finding it now takes three times as long as before.

No matter how much you upgrade a product, if you do anything (especially with technology) that slows it down you will get complaints and questions. Is it so surprising to everyone that people are complaining about the slower speeds? Doesn't surprise me.

[sporr]

Imagine how slow the game will be with full minor league schedule implementation in the future. People have to expect that with more features (features that they have been asking for I may add), the game will surely take longer to process all of the information.