2006 Cubs Thread! - Page 12

Malleus Dei · 05-13-2006, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Modern Relic

The team needs some serious roster help, but I'm at a loss as to what they should even do.

To start with they need to get a new GM.

AnotherAlias · 05-13-2006, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malleus Dei

To start with they need to get a new GM.

Can we trade Hendry and a manager to be named sooner, (than later) for Brian Cashman?

Modern Relic · 05-13-2006, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malleus Dei

To start with they need to get a new GM.

Disagree. Hendry has done a fine job overall. Baker, on the other hand...

blgoblue2 · 05-13-2006, 06:42 PM

They both suck. Juan Pierre, cmon.

Modern Relic · 05-13-2006, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnotherAlias

Can we trade Hendry and a manager to be named sooner, (than later) for Brian Cashman?

Can we truly judge Cashman as a GM? How good a GM is he without Steinbrenner's wallet? Honestly, I don't follow the AL close enough to know.

EDIT: Plus, I still don't see any reason to replace Hendry. Ok, maybe 'cos of his choice of managers.

TonyJ · 05-13-2006, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Modern Relic

Disagree. Hendry has done a fine job overall. Baker, on the other hand...

"

Modern Relic · 05-13-2006, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blgoblue2

They both suck. Juan Pierre, cmon.

You're kidding me, right? So, Hendry sucks because he got the best available leadoff hitter not named Furcal? Please.

FURCAL: AVG .229 | HR 2 | RBI 10 | OBP .333 | SLG .314 | SB 9 | 2006 Salary: $8,730,196
PIERRE: AVG .231 | HR 0 | RBI 2 | OBP .276 | SLG .299 | SB 12 | 2006 Salary: $5,750,000

Furcal was overpaid when he signed, and that deal is going to look worse as it goes on. No thank you.

Who would YOU have signed? Please try to limit this discussion to who was actually available. Now, if you want to make a case that Hendry should have pushed harder to get Damon, that's fine. But in my opinion, Big Stein was signing Damon no matter what.

EDIT: I only posted numbers for Furcal vs. Pierre because the Cubs actually made an offer to Furcal.

AnotherAlias · 05-13-2006, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Modern Relic

Can we truly judge Cashman as a GM? How good a GM is he without Steinbrenner's wallet? Honestly, I don't follow the AL close enough to know.

EDIT: Plus, I still don't see any reason to replace Hendry. Ok, maybe 'cos of his choice of managers.

That's a great point. A GM is usually as good as the size of their bankroll.

I'm just disappointed with the lack of success and the off-season. I think pointing the finger at Hendry right now does nothing, in the long run. That's true. He's signed for a couple years anyway. If the Tribune could either spend a little more on the right players, or sell the team to someone that actually gives a crap about winning, I'd be a lot happier.

I'm still willing to trade Baker at this point. The team needs a little shake, rattle and roll. They started the season with a 14-9 record, I think. And then Lee went down. Since then it's like they have fallen off a cliff.

How can the loss of one player bring a team so far down? Or, is it just that the beginning of the season was a fluke and we're really witnessing their true mettle?

In other words, even if Lee had not gotten hurt, would the Cubs success be headed south anyway?

TonyJ · 05-13-2006, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnotherAlias

In other words, even if Lee had not gotten hurt, would the Cubs success be headed south anyway?

Yes.

AnotherAlias · 05-13-2006, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TonyJ

Yes.

That's what I've been thinking. When they were 14-9 I wondered how long they were going to keep that pace.

I guess we saw how long...

TonyJ · 05-13-2006, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnotherAlias

That's what I've been thinking. When they were 14-9 I wondered how long they were going to keep that pace.

I guess we saw how long...

I expected a down year, with better things to come for the trouble. They are playing some kids who should eventually be pretty good and you take a hit when you do that. In addition, we knew going in that it would be a while before we got Prior and Wood back. You don't lose two pitchers of that quality and just replace them overnight. I'm sure that Hendry is looking to replace their production and anything we get from the two of them will be a bonus going forward. I've said before that the Jones and Pierre acquisitions were questionable and I stand by that, but in general I think Hendry is still steering the right direction. Baker's flaws have been well known for some time, but until this season I think it would have been politically impossible for him to fired. That is no longer the case and he will be out. Next year is looking pretty good, especially if Pie can progress enough to help out next season.

Modern Relic · 05-13-2006, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TonyJ

I've said before that the Jones and Pierre acquisitions were questionable and I stand by that...

I definitely didn't like the Jones signing, especially for 3 years. As far as Pierre, I think he filled an immediate need, about as well as anyone else the Cubs had a reasonable chance of getting would have. And unless I completely missed it, the Cubs didn't offer Pierre an extension, did they? So at least it is a low-risk move.

It truly was a crappy FA crop this past off-season.

TonyJ · 05-13-2006, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Modern Relic

I definitely didn't like the Jones signing, especially for 3 years. As far as Pierre, I think he filled an immediate need, about as well as anyone else the Cubs had a reasonable chance of getting would have. And unless I completely missed it, the Cubs didn't offer Pierre an extension, did they? So at least it is a low-risk move.

It truly was a crappy FA crop this past off-season.

Yeah, but the thing is, Pierre ain't that good unless he's getting on base. Last season he did a poor job of it and since his walk rate is below the acceptable level, his value is tied heavily to batting average which is inherently volitile. It's not a terrible one year risk, I suppose, and I understand that there wasn't that much available (Damon for that many years is a poor signing) but they could have traded for Jason Michaels and gotten more production for less money. It wasn't a bad move, per se, but it wasn't a good one either.

The Jones signing, OTOH, was just stupid.

AnotherAlias · 05-13-2006, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TonyJ

I expected a down year, with better things to come for the trouble. They are playing some kids who should eventually be pretty good and you take a hit when you do that. In addition, we knew going in that it would be a while before we got Prior and Wood back. You don't lose two pitchers of that quality and just replace them overnight. I'm sure that Hendry is looking to replace their production and anything we get from the two of them will be a bonus going forward. I've said before that the Jones and Pierre acquisitions were questionable and I stand by that, but in general I think Hendry is still steering the right direction. Baker's flaws have been well known for some time, but until this season I think it would have been politically impossible for him to fired. That is no longer the case and he will be out. Next year is looking pretty good, especially if Pie can progress enough to help out next season.

Today's loss was tough. I respect Dusty, but it just doesn't seem to be working out and if they made a change, it would be inderstandable in my mind.

But just getting rid of Baker won't be the saving grace for the team, IMO. The Tribune, with its short arms and deep pockets is holding the team back in its own way. I really wish they would sell the team. All of those years with tight-pockets P.K. Wrigley at the helm and now the Tribune cheapskates, it's no wonder the team has had such an unsuccessful history.

Perhaps, an owner with some cahones is what they need?

TonyJ · 05-13-2006, 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnotherAlias

Today's loss was tough. I respect Dusty, but it just doesn't seem to be working out and if they made a change, it would be inderstandable in my mind.

But just getting rid of Baker won't be the saving grace for the team, IMO. The Tribune, with its short arms and deep pockets is holding the team back in its own way. I really wish they would sell the team. All of those years with tight-pockets P.K. Wrigley at the helm and now the Tribune cheapskates, it's no wonder the team has had such an unsuccessful history.

Perhaps, an owner with some cahones is what they need?

Actually, from what I understand the Tribune Company has opened up its wallet quite a bit more in recent seasons. The Lee deal is one example of that. In any case, payroll is not the problems. As Oakland has proven, you can build a winner without being Boston or New York.

Malleus Dei · 05-13-2006, 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnotherAlias

Perhaps, an owner with some cahones is what they need?

Mark Cuban?

AnotherAlias · 05-13-2006, 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malleus Dei

Mark Cuban?

Nice work, you read my mind. He was the first person I thought of when I posted that. I don't know if he would be good for Chicago, but anything is better than the Tribune.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TonyJ

Actually, from what I understand the Tribune Company has opened up its wallet quite a bit more in recent seasons. The Lee deal is one example of that. In any case, payroll is not the problems. As Oakland has proven, you can build a winner without being Boston or New York.

Sure they've spent more since coming within 5 outs of the series in '03. But they've always been known as a company that treats the Cubs as a cash cow. They have been content with filling the seats and not putting enough money back into the team. Until recently, that is. The signing of Lee was a great step forward, but I'm not sure it's quite enough.

I see them as bargain hunters. Wade Miller, Ryan Dempster, Scott Williamson, and Chad Fox were all huge question marks coming off of surgeries, but it didn't stop the Cubs from signing them. They signed these guys pretty cheaply and so far, two have worked out fairly well, while Miller is still iffy. We all know what happened to Fox last year...

Going out and getting Eyre and Howry were positive moves, I concede. But somehow it just wasn't enough. Considering the fact that two of their main starters (Prior and Wood) were on the shelf, I think it might have behooved them to make a run at someone. Glendon Rusch? He's scary. I'm worried that he is turning into the next Mike Remlinger, for the Cubs.

I don't have any answers, only questions and anxiety over this team. I've had it since I was a wee lad.

TonyJ · 05-13-2006, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnotherAlias

I see them as bargain hunters. Wade Miller, Ryan Dempster, Scott Williamson, and Chad Fox were all huge question marks coming off of surgeries, but it didn't stop the Cubs from signing them. They signed these guys pretty cheaply and so far, two have worked out fairly well, while Miller is still iffy. We all know what happened to Fox last year...

See, moves like this are what make Hendry a good GM, payroll considerations or not. All of those guys were talented players with injury questions who signed low-risk contracts for low salaries. If they don't work out, you lose nothing. If they do, you get a closer for nothing. It's a very good strategy and one more teams should be attempting. Getting the big stuff right is the most important thing in being a GM, but making moves like this that can turn in to something nifty is how you go from being a good team to a World Series contender. The Jones signing is an example of getting the big stuff wrong and that is much more of a concern than those signings.

AnotherAlias · 05-13-2006, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TonyJ

See, moves like this are what make Hendry a good GM, payroll considerations or not. All of those guys were talented players with injury questions who signed low-risk contracts for low salaries. If they don't work out, you lose nothing. If they do, you get a closer for nothing. It's a very good strategy and one more teams should be attempting. Getting the big stuff right is the most important thing in being a GM, but making moves like this that can turn in to something nifty is how you go from being a good team to a World Series contender. The Jones signing is an example of getting the big stuff wrong and that is much more of a concern than those signings.

Let's not forget the Ramirez, Lofton and Simon trades in '03 either. Good moves by Hendry, too. I think we got lucky with Williamson and Dempster.

Letting Nomar leave might turn out to be an even bigger mistake than Jones. He's hitting .333 and doing well in the field from what I've read. I'd still like to see him on the team for some reason.

mauboy · 05-14-2006, 01:24 AM

I agree with the Jones signing as the worst thing the Cubs did this off season, but it is sad to see that he's been basically their best player so far, despite his horrible, horrible start.

05-13-2006, 06:42 PM	#224
blgoblue2 Banned Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Walled Lake, Michigan Member #13775 Posts: 886	They both suck. Juan Pierre, cmon.

05-14-2006, 01:24 AM	#240
mauboy Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Nashville, TN Posts: 2,906	I agree with the Jones signing as the worst thing the Cubs did this off season, but it is sad to see that he's been basically their best player so far, despite his horrible, horrible start.