crazy free agency...

Tom Martell · 06-19-2004, 07:20 AM

So the computer went nuts and started signing 2 and 3 star players to 10+ mil contracts. The most insane was a 3 star SP going for 25.7 mil/yr. Do I have my financials cranked up too high? I havent seen this behavior in previous years and would like to prevent it from happening again.

There were at least 15-20 10mil+ per year deals in a very weak FA offseason. No 4.5 or 5 star players were available.

Brian Corleone · 06-21-2004, 02:20 PM

Just finished my 2005 solo league off-season.

Houston signed 33 year old Pedro Martinez who had a 19W 5L 3.06ERA and 257K 2004 season to a $26,340,100/6years contract.

Just my observation. I personally think it's kind of high for a person at that age.

Dan Theman · 06-21-2004, 02:53 PM

My guess is that the AI establishes contract offers based at least partially on a scale of "best available." That way if a team has, say, $30 Million to spend and they need a good starting pitcher, the team will make a certain level of offer for the best starting pitcher on the market. Maybe it isn't the most realistic, but I think it may be hard for the AI to plan ahead for better free agent bumper crops.

Biggie Fries · 06-21-2004, 04:12 PM

Interesting... Over the weekend, I just did my first solo league offseason under 6.02(a?) I was struck that, at the top end, the AI was back to making offers in the $10-$20 million range. I am in the 15th year of my league. In the early going, there were big offers. Then, as the high stat players of the initial draft retired, and the number of "giants" walking the earth (or at least my humble league) diminished, the salary structure went down. I had to keep cutting payroll to stay "realistic," even though I was able to turn a profit with the highest payroll.

So here are two observations:

1) I have been <i>happy</i> to see the salaries go up. I take it as a sign that more of the teams are trying to be competitive. Many more have payrolls in the $75-$80 million range than in many a year. Whether the players are "worth it" or not in some absolute sense makes no difference. That is, it doesn't bother me that players w/out "killer stats" (in an absolute sense) are making big money, as long as they are the best players in the league (which most of them are). Bill James wised me up on this point (that everything is relative within whatever kind of baseball you happen to be playing in that particular year).

2) I did notice that the take from television contracts went up a lot this year--at least for me. Was this unique to 6.02? I don't know. But, again, I am satisfied with the "realism quotient" of the situation.

So I have the noticed this change, too, but have enjoyed it so far.

tomolak · 06-21-2004, 04:12 PM

Tom, did you upgrade your OOTP, say, from v6.01 to v6.02 in the previous season? As far as I remember, it seems the v6.02 patch corrects a problem which is that the AI teams don't spend as much as they can and save their money for no purpose. If that's so, perhaps your AI teams stacked up too much cash in the past seasons and suddenly found themselves having a lot of money to spend as you went from v6.01 to v6.02. Just my guess...

So far, the FA signings in my solo league is rather reasonable to me. The 34-year-old Pedro just signed with the Red Sox to a $19M / 6 yrs contract. The highest salary per year is $21M paid to Todd Helton. An interesting experience is a previous off-season with Kerry Wood (4.5 stars), Byung-hyun Kim (4.0 stars) and Vicente Padilla (3.5 stars) available. I bid for Kim aggressively and nailed him down to a $10M / 6 yrs contract in perhaps the 8th or 9th day of the 30-day FA signing period. Wood signed a $15.5M / 5 yrs contract with the White Sox shortly after (perhaps the 12th day or so.) Then it seemed the losers in these two bid wars turned their attention to Padilla as the Padilla signing happened near the end of the FA signing period and the deal was $17M / 4 yrs, which made him the highest paid pitcher, period, in the league. This perhaps is the most unreasonable event that ever occured to me.

HolyCow98 · 06-21-2004, 05:02 PM

In one of my fictional leagues.....

In the second season this league...and first official full offseason....the L.A. franchise signed last seasons Pitcher of the Year, Ray Dehner to the largest contract I've seen by far.

This league uses the 1-100 scale so here is his ratings.

28 year old Throws:R Endurance:59 Ground Ball %: 65 Holding Runners: 3
Stuff: 91 Movement:68 Control: 79 Velocity 95-99 MPH

Here was his stats from the first season
GS: 34 W:16 L:4 ERA: 2.07 IP:208.2 HA:137 BB: 43 SO:241 CG:0 SHO:0-

He was a FA at the end of that season...and here is the last few lines of his player history.txt: Won Pitcher of the Year in 2004, going 16-4, 2.07 ERA...
Signed as a free agent by Los Angeles on 2/19/2005 to a 4-year deal worth $40,360,000 per year...

I've played many different leagues and countless seasons...in my leagues this is a one of a kind freak occurance...out of all my other leagues I've ever run...the largest contract I've seen before was 30.0 or 32.0 something in that neighborhood....which has been rare too...

Kaline · 06-21-2004, 05:26 PM

David Bell got paid pretty well and hes no better than a two and a half star. Or Jeff Cirillo....

I think it scales to best availible gets x amount, just like real life.

Ktulu · 06-21-2004, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Maybe it isn't the most realistic, but I think it may be hard for the AI to plan ahead for better free agent bumper crops.

Actually its impossible because the AI has no plan, it simply tries to address its positional needs.

ublguy · 06-22-2004, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomolak

Then it seemed the losers in these two bid wars turned their attention to Padilla as the Padilla signing happened near the end of the FA signing period and the deal was $17M / 4 yrs, which made him the highest paid pitcher, period, in the league. This perhaps is the most unreasonable event that ever occured to me.

Supply and demand, IMO.

The worst I have seen is A-Rod $25 million (which is okay) and in the same year Edgar Renteria for $23. Had a cap of $100, ouch.

ublguy · 06-22-2004, 03:33 PM

This issue is the big difference between MLB baseball and OOTP6, every team in OOTP6 is trying to win the world series each year. In MLB there might be 15 teams trying to win and the other half trying to hit .500 (like my brewers.)

oldtime · 06-22-2004, 04:16 PM

Can you imagine anyone in real life signing a player (even one as good as A-Rod) to a $25 million contract. That is pretty insane!!!

ublguy · 06-22-2004, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldtime

Can you imagine anyone in real life signing a player (even one as good as A-Rod) to a $25 million contract. That is pretty insane!!!

Is that a joke? Maybe I missed it, but I believe A-Rod has a contract of 10 years for $250 million dollars.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...rod.salary.ap/

jte87 · 06-22-2004, 04:26 PM

omg

oldtime · 06-22-2004, 04:38 PM

Yes, my attempt at dry, sarcastic humor! As crazy as OOTP seems from time to time, you can always find something in real life just as crazy or worse. Remember when everyone screamed that the Yankees getting Jeff Weaver and Raul Mondesi was highway robbery, and it just wasn't fair anymore??? When the Tigers were able to "steal" Doyle Alexander for a minor leaguer (John Smoltz), or the same Braves refused to part with Brad Kominsk for anyone in a trade??? What about the Expos (that's right the Expos) outbidding everyone for the next great lefty, Mark Langston, and only having to give up a few prospects including a 6-10 freak who could not throw strikes (Randy Johnson).

Then again, in my solo league Tampa Bay just signed Vance Wilson for 15.4 million over 5 years.

Cooker · 06-22-2004, 05:32 PM

I just finished the off-season (between years 2008 and 2009) in my converted solo league (which I started back in v. 5 with the old GForce 2003 rosters).

The highest free agent contract went to Vlad Guerrero who at age 33 got $15.6 million per year for 6 years from the Mets. On a 1-100 rating scale, Guerrero had an 80 for contact and 100 for power, with good speed and baserunning skills, excellent defense in RF (75) and an 85 throwing arm. In short, a mature 5-tool player.

I felt 6 years was a little long for a contract to a player who turns 34 during the 2009 season, but the amount of money felt pretty realistic.

I think 6.02a is doing a pretty good job with FA contracts.

oldtime · 06-22-2004, 05:40 PM

If only the AI had been running the IRL Mets this off season, we'd have Vlad NOW and probably be a game to two in first place!!!

Vezna31 · 06-23-2004, 09:07 PM

I had a computer-managed team pay $32M for a free agent that I had bid on. Priced me right out of the deal.

06-19-2004, 07:20 AM	#1
Tom Martell Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Stanford, CA Posts: 24	crazy free agency... So the computer went nuts and started signing 2 and 3 star players to 10+ mil contracts. The most insane was a 3 star SP going for 25.7 mil/yr. Do I have my financials cranked up too high? I havent seen this behavior in previous years and would like to prevent it from happening again. There were at least 15-20 10mil+ per year deals in a very weak FA offseason. No 4.5 or 5 star players were available.

06-21-2004, 05:02 PM	#6
HolyCow98 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Douglasville, GA Posts: 2,735	In one of my fictional leagues..... In the second season this league...and first official full offseason....the L.A. franchise signed last seasons Pitcher of the Year, Ray Dehner to the largest contract I've seen by far. This league uses the 1-100 scale so here is his ratings. 28 year old Throws:R Endurance:59 Ground Ball %: 65 Holding Runners: 3 Stuff: 91 Movement:68 Control: 79 Velocity 95-99 MPH Here was his stats from the first season GS: 34 W:16 L:4 ERA: 2.07 IP:208.2 HA:137 BB: 43 SO:241 CG:0 SHO:0- He was a FA at the end of that season...and here is the last few lines of his player history.txt: Won Pitcher of the Year in 2004, going 16-4, 2.07 ERA... Signed as a free agent by Los Angeles on 2/19/2005 to a 4-year deal worth $40,360,000 per year... I've played many different leagues and countless seasons...in my leagues this is a one of a kind freak occurance...out of all my other leagues I've ever run...the largest contract I've seen before was 30.0 or 32.0 something in that neighborhood....which has been rare too... __________________ NPBL Enjoying its 60th season Georgia GM

06-21-2004, 02:20 PM	#2
Brian Corleone Bat Boy Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 16	Just finished my 2005 solo league off-season. Houston signed 33 year old Pedro Martinez who had a 19W 5L 3.06ERA and 257K 2004 season to a $26,340,100/6years contract. Just my observation. I personally think it's kind of high for a person at that age.

06-21-2004, 02:53 PM	#3
Dan Theman Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Cleveland, Ohio Posts: 2,251	My guess is that the AI establishes contract offers based at least partially on a scale of "best available." That way if a team has, say, $30 Million to spend and they need a good starting pitcher, the team will make a certain level of offer for the best starting pitcher on the market. Maybe it isn't the most realistic, but I think it may be hard for the AI to plan ahead for better free agent bumper crops.

06-21-2004, 04:12 PM	#4
Biggie Fries Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Bryn Mawr, PA USA Posts: 115	Interesting... Over the weekend, I just did my first solo league offseason under 6.02(a?) I was struck that, at the top end, the AI was back to making offers in the $10-$20 million range. I am in the 15th year of my league. In the early going, there were big offers. Then, as the high stat players of the initial draft retired, and the number of "giants" walking the earth (or at least my humble league) diminished, the salary structure went down. I had to keep cutting payroll to stay "realistic," even though I was able to turn a profit with the highest payroll. So here are two observations: 1) I have been <i>happy</i> to see the salaries go up. I take it as a sign that more of the teams are trying to be competitive. Many more have payrolls in the $75-$80 million range than in many a year. Whether the players are "worth it" or not in some absolute sense makes no difference. That is, it doesn't bother me that players w/out "killer stats" (in an absolute sense) are making big money, as long as they are the best players in the league (which most of them are). Bill James wised me up on this point (that everything is relative within whatever kind of baseball you happen to be playing in that particular year). 2) I did notice that the take from television contracts went up a lot this year--at least for me. Was this unique to 6.02? I don't know. But, again, I am satisfied with the "realism quotient" of the situation. So I have the noticed this change, too, but have enjoyed it so far.

06-21-2004, 04:12 PM	#5
tomolak Minors (Double A) Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 104	Tom, did you upgrade your OOTP, say, from v6.01 to v6.02 in the previous season? As far as I remember, it seems the v6.02 patch corrects a problem which is that the AI teams don't spend as much as they can and save their money for no purpose. If that's so, perhaps your AI teams stacked up too much cash in the past seasons and suddenly found themselves having a lot of money to spend as you went from v6.01 to v6.02. Just my guess... So far, the FA signings in my solo league is rather reasonable to me. The 34-year-old Pedro just signed with the Red Sox to a $19M / 6 yrs contract. The highest salary per year is $21M paid to Todd Helton. An interesting experience is a previous off-season with Kerry Wood (4.5 stars), Byung-hyun Kim (4.0 stars) and Vicente Padilla (3.5 stars) available. I bid for Kim aggressively and nailed him down to a $10M / 6 yrs contract in perhaps the 8th or 9th day of the 30-day FA signing period. Wood signed a $15.5M / 5 yrs contract with the White Sox shortly after (perhaps the 12th day or so.) Then it seemed the losers in these two bid wars turned their attention to Padilla as the Padilla signing happened near the end of the FA signing period and the deal was $17M / 4 yrs, which made him the highest paid pitcher, period, in the league. This perhaps is the most unreasonable event that ever occured to me.

06-21-2004, 05:26 PM	#7
Kaline Major Leagues Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 321	David Bell got paid pretty well and hes no better than a two and a half star. Or Jeff Cirillo.... I think it scales to best availible gets x amount, just like real life.

06-22-2004, 03:33 PM	#10
ublguy Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 23	This issue is the big difference between MLB baseball and OOTP6, every team in OOTP6 is trying to win the world series each year. In MLB there might be 15 teams trying to win and the other half trying to hit .500 (like my brewers.)

06-22-2004, 04:16 PM	#11
oldtime Minors (Double A) Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 127	Can you imagine anyone in real life signing a player (even one as good as A-Rod) to a $25 million contract. That is pretty insane!!!

06-22-2004, 04:26 PM	#13
jte87 Major Leagues Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 305	omg

06-22-2004, 04:38 PM	#14
oldtime Minors (Double A) Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 127	Yes, my attempt at dry, sarcastic humor! As crazy as OOTP seems from time to time, you can always find something in real life just as crazy or worse. Remember when everyone screamed that the Yankees getting Jeff Weaver and Raul Mondesi was highway robbery, and it just wasn't fair anymore??? When the Tigers were able to "steal" Doyle Alexander for a minor leaguer (John Smoltz), or the same Braves refused to part with Brad Kominsk for anyone in a trade??? What about the Expos (that's right the Expos) outbidding everyone for the next great lefty, Mark Langston, and only having to give up a few prospects including a 6-10 freak who could not throw strikes (Randy Johnson). Then again, in my solo league Tampa Bay just signed Vance Wilson for 15.4 million over 5 years.

06-22-2004, 05:32 PM	#15
Cooker All Star Reserve Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 592	I just finished the off-season (between years 2008 and 2009) in my converted solo league (which I started back in v. 5 with the old GForce 2003 rosters). The highest free agent contract went to Vlad Guerrero who at age 33 got $15.6 million per year for 6 years from the Mets. On a 1-100 rating scale, Guerrero had an 80 for contact and 100 for power, with good speed and baserunning skills, excellent defense in RF (75) and an 85 throwing arm. In short, a mature 5-tool player. I felt 6 years was a little long for a contract to a player who turns 34 during the 2009 season, but the amount of money felt pretty realistic. I think 6.02a is doing a pretty good job with FA contracts.

06-22-2004, 05:40 PM	#16
oldtime Minors (Double A) Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 127	If only the AI had been running the IRL Mets this off season, we'd have Vlad NOW and probably be a game to two in first place!!!

06-23-2004, 09:07 PM	#17
Vezna31 All Star Starter Join Date: May 2004 Location: Wherever My VPN says Posts: 1,986	I had a computer-managed team pay $32M for a free agent that I had bid on. Priced me right out of the deal.