Is Auto Racing a sport?

[CMH]

Originally posted by Hank Greenberg
So is playing OOTP a sport? Im trying to win and using a strategy.

You should be competing against someone else.

So, I know the next question is: Is playing Madden 2004 with my buddy a sport?

If the both of you are serious about winning and using a competitive strategy to win then yes.

Is it a physical sport? No. But, it does demand thinking, strategy, hand-eye coordination, etc.

[KurtBevacqua]

Originally posted by YankeePride

Is it a physical sport? No. But, it does demand thinking, strategy, hand-eye coordination, etc.

Giving fuel to the "Yahtzee for the Olympics" action committee.

[ctorg]

Originally posted by YankeePride
A sport is anything that involves some sort of competitive strategy, skill, and/or physical exertion in which two or more players or teams are seriously competiting in an event governed by rules to achieve a goal that is fair and not predetermined.

With that being the case...Pro Wrestling (WWE) is NOT a sport. It does require physical exertion, but the result is predetermined. It is a show, much like being a stunt-man. No disrespect to those that participate in the event. It is physically demanding and I respect the danger involved in being a part of pro wrestling.

However, chess IS a sport. While it isn't a physical sport, it is a thinking sport. It involves a competitive strategy and the end-result is unpredictable or not predetermined.

Taking all this into account, NASCAR IS a sport. The competitive physical exertion may not be the same as full-contact football, but there is a huge demand for upper-body strength and hand-eye coordination. In addition, the competitors are using a competitive strategy to reach a goal that is not predetermined.

Playing whiffle-ball is NOT a sport if you are just playing with your friends because you may not be seriously competing to win. You may play hard, but you may not really care about the outcome. If you do care for the outcome, are using a competitive strategy or competitive energy (note the word competitive) then playing whiffle-ball with your friends would be a sport.

To be even more dramatic and cause an outcry...Ballroom Dancing IS a sport. The competitors are serious about the outcome, are using physical energy in a competitive manner, and the outcome of the event is not predetermined.

There are different types of sports and this is probably the problem.

There are individual sports (golf).
There are team sports (basketball).
There are physical sports (football).
There are thinking sports (chess).
There are objective sports (baseball).
There are subjective sports (figure skating).


edit:

I should also add that athletic should never be used when describing an activity. There are several players in professional sports or olympic sports that are not athletic...some of which play in sports considered to be athletic sports.

To fully understand my thinking, understand that I feel someone can be athletic but not an athlete or vice versa.

When I think athletic I think body.
When I think athlete I think talent or skill.

I think your definition is too broad. It would make playing Monopoly a sport.

Miriam Webster's primary definition isn't much better:

1 a : a source of diversion : RECREATION b : sexual play c (1) : physical activity engaged in for pleasure (2) : a particular activity (as an athletic game) so engaged in

I do believe that a sport is not just a competitive game. I would say that it must involve some level of physical activity, and that "mental sports" like chess are games, not sports.

[ihatenames]

A Sport defined, from dictionary.com

1. Physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively. A particular form of this activity.
2. An activity involving physical exertion and skill that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often undertaken competitively.
3. An active pastime; recreation.


By definition number 2, Auto-racing and baseball are sports. It may not be YOUR definition of a sport(there is a difference), however by definition they are considered sports..

[Gastric ReFlux]

Originally posted by wildhawke11
I was wondering just how long before someone took the obvious route and looked up the word SPORT in a dictionary.

It took a long time but you made it LOL
Cheers Guys All The Best

pffft dictionaries, used by the desperate to make their arguments seem as though they come from authority. We want something gut-level, less of this intellectual tripe.

[bagsangels]

this is not a sport, it takes no athletic ablility, yeah it takes ability to drive a car at such a fast speed, but its not a sport, it never will be.

[matskralc]

People think that because everyone drives a car everyday, that driving one ridiculously fast for long periods of time makes it not a sport. Just like because everyone walks everyday that they think golfing isn't a sport. "Hey, I can do that! That means it doesn't take talent...so I guess it's not a sport!"

[Skipaway]

I love polls with multiple selections. I always choose all the options.

[CMH]

Originally posted by ctorg
I think your definition is too broad. It would make playing Monopoly a sport.

Miriam Webster's primary definition isn't much better:

1 a : a source of diversion : RECREATION b : sexual play c (1) : physical activity engaged in for pleasure (2) : a particular activity (as an athletic game) so engaged in

I do believe that a sport is not just a competitive game. I would say that it must involve some level of physical activity, and that "mental sports" like chess are games, not sports.

How do you feel about ballroom dancing?

[crackpott]

Originally posted by Jason Moyer
Hm.

Auto racing requires:

Strength
Endurance
Hand-Eye Coordination

It involves:

Competition

And is a form of:

Entertainment

Sounds like a sport to me.

Sounds like you're describing sex, not racing.

Someone mentioned 160+ MPH. And although in retrospect was fairly dumb, driving down to detroit I averaged 100 MPH and touched on 120. I exerted no physical effort. So I'm just curious how racing is so much more physically difficult? Lack of power steering? is 40 MPH really that much more difficult? At least then everyone is going the same speed, as opposed to you having to account for people going half your speed. I'm really wondering this, because I've never done racing and I have no idea how it could be that physically difficult...

I'm a bowler, and i refuse to consider that a sport. I'm not sure how this would be very different, although it's all subjective.

[Skipaway]

Originally posted by crackpott
Sounds like you're describing sex, not racing.

I've only seen sex competition in Japanese porns.

[Jason Moyer]

Originally posted by crackpott
Someone mentioned 160+ MPH. And although in retrospect was fairly dumb, driving down to detroit I averaged 100 MPH and touched on 120. I exerted no physical effort. So I'm just curious how racing is so much more physically difficult?

Was your car pushing the tires' ability to grip the pavement as far as they could go? Were you driving precise lines (perfect braking point, turn in, apex, throttle application, etc) through every corner, while at the limit of traction, knowing that losing 1/10th of a second through a corner would allow another competitor to beat you? Knowing that missing your braking mark or the apex of the corner by 3 inches could result in a violent collision? Were you sitting in a 120 degree cage for 5 hours? Was your neck being whipped around by forces in excess of 3 G's?

The speed isn't the primary reason racing is difficult. Even professional-level karting (i.e. the kind that Mika Hakkinen and Michael Schumacher cut their teeth on) is physically demanding, and you have the added fun of having to shift your weight around to keep the car properly balanced if you want to be competitive.

I'll grab some onboard video and post it so you have at least some frame of reference for the effort involved, or at least as much as can be had without trying it for yourself.

Jason

[crackpott]

Originally posted by Skipaway
I've only seen sex competition in Japanese porns.

Face it. You're competing with every other guy she's ever been with.

[crackpott]

Originally posted by Jason Moyer
Was your car pushing the tires' ability to grip the pavement as far as they could go? Were you driving precise lines (perfect braking point, turn in, apex, throttle application, etc) through every corner, while at the limit of traction, knowing that losing 1/10th of a second through a corner would allow another competitor to beat you? Knowing that missing your braking mark or the apex of the corner by 3 inches could result in a violent collision? Were you sitting in a 120 degree cage for 5 hours? Was your neck being whipped around by forces in excess of 3 G's?

The speed isn't the primary reason racing is difficult. Even professional-level karting (i.e. the kind that Mika Hakkinen and Michael Schumacher cut their teeth on) is physically demanding, and you have the added fun of having to shift your weight around to keep the car properly balanced if you want to be competitive.

I'll grab some onboard video and post it so you have at least some frame of reference for the effort involved, or at least as much as can be had without trying it for yourself.

Jason

Other than the heat and the g's, none of that was physically exerting. And that would mean riding a rollar coaster in florida requires being an athlete.

[ihatenames]

Originally posted by crackpott
Other than the heat and the g's, none of that was physically exerting. And that would mean riding a rollar coaster in florida requires being an athlete.

the difference being a roller coaster lasts what 30-90 second and you don't have to concentrate on anything. I drove 14 hours back to my univeristy and that was exhausting. There is more to driving then a lot of you people probably think.

Keep in mind the inside of those race cars are burning hot, you really have to fight the steering wheel when you're going that fast. Remember that it takes deep concentration to keep your line at fastest point and not spin out or cause any accidents. How many of you have taken a hard test in university that afterwards you were just exhausted after 2 or 3 hours. Now test taking isn't a sport, but add a few more hours on to that, and then add fighting a car to keep a good line, enduring high heat, and avoiding accidents with other cars. To me that is a sport.

Like i said i drive long distances all the time, go less than half the speed of say nascar and i'm exhausted. And i'm good shape.

But like i said if your own personal definition of sport does not include racing thats your opinion. My own defintion is a recreational or competetive activity that requires physical action. Auto-racing and even nascar fall under this.

I think racing is a dumb sport, but thats a topic for another day.

[ihatenames]

Originally posted by crackpott
Sounds like you're describing sex, not racing.

Someone mentioned 160+ MPH. And although in retrospect was fairly dumb, driving down to detroit I averaged 100 MPH and touched on 120. I exerted no physical effort. So I'm just curious how racing is so much more physically difficult? Lack of power steering? is 40 MPH really that much more difficult? At least then everyone is going the same speed, as opposed to you having to account for people going half your speed. I'm really wondering this, because I've never done racing and I have no idea how it could be that physically difficult...

I'm a bowler, and i refuse to consider that a sport. I'm not sure how this would be very different, although it's all subjective.

I've made that same drive from detroit to toronto. I drive from chicago to ottawa all the time. the drive from detroit to toronto is straight with very few turns or curves. The 401 is basically the straightest stretch of road i've ever been on. I honestly don't think you can compare that to driving on a nascar track with sharpe turns. There is also very few cars on that road. I've driven it about 10 round trips now. Thats also only about a 5 hour trip for toronto to detroit. At least when i drive it. Thats not really enough to exhaust you on such a straight road with few cars in my opinion.

I think its hard to compare driving in general to nascar driving. Its much different then just taking a drive. Its just like i can go do my job for 8-12 hours which involves moving around a bit without much problem. But i can't study for school for more than 4 or 5 hours while laying down without getting completely exhausted due to intense concentration. I'd just assume auto-racing takes much more intense concentration then just taking a little drive. I don't know if that helps my point or destroys it, but i just don't think we as non professional drivers can really speculate. We're all completely ignorant of what it takes to be a driver.


edit: to change a significant typo.

[statfreak]

in addition, a nascar car (racing) track is not flat, but banked... as steeply as 33 degrees. You would have a difficult time standing on the track without tumbling over.

My own opinion, Nascar and racing in general is most definitely a sport. I don't see how it is any different than football or baseball. Everyone has their own opinion of "sport" and until we can all agree on that, having this discussion is really pointless.

Then again, Gastric knew that and was really just trolling with this thread. Kudos for succeeding...

[Hank Greenberg]

I dont think anyone is saying racing is easy, but the majority of the work is done by the car.

If your definition is anything hard that takes concentration, then you going to have to include video gmaes ect into it.

[Jason Moyer]

http://firebrand11.stargate.net/vide...n_24h_2000.wmv

2 laps around the Nurburgring in a Caterham. I'm not sure how anyone could say that what is being depicted in that clip is not physically demanding. In fact, I'd wager it's more physically demanding than anything most of us have done, and it's just 2 laps around the track during a 24 hour endurance event of which he drove for about 12 hours. Also, feel free to memorize the layout of the circuit and the lines through all the corners while you're watching that (the long straight about 10 minutes into the clip indicates that you're getting close to the end of a lap). Keep in mind also that Caterhams aren't that fast, the amount of effort being applied in that clip is no different than what you'd see watching a top driver in any other car.

Here are some Formula One onboards. David Coulthard during practice at the 2004 Monaco GP and Ruben Barrichello during practice for the 2004 San Marino GP. To get an idea of the forces being applied to the driver in these clips, people have compared stepping on the accelerator in an f1 car to being hit in the chest with a pile of bricks. 0-100 in about 3 seconds style. These require DivX:

http://firebrand11.stargate.net/vide...ap_Onboard.avi
http://firebrand11.stargate.net/vide...arrichello.avi

Jason

[SoxWin]

Originally posted by statfreak


Then again, Gastric knew that and was really just trolling with this thread. Kudos for succeeding...

Good to see someone gets it.