Not Sure What To Call This Thread

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Originally Posted by Waltercito

Just wanted to say that I found a Walter Wazal Jr. (1945-2018) on Find a Grave. He was from San Diego, CA, though. I did NOT find any match for the name "Wazel".


So I tend to think Wazal is the correct spelling.

Agree, Finished going through 1936 amateur career and things in the summaries I'll post next I feel Wazal is correct as BoxRec has it. Just for whatever reasons, the papers were interchanging using also the Wazel spelling.

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Tue, Jan 14, 1936, The Republican, Springfield, Mass - At the Irish-American A.C. show in the Boston Arena Monday night, in the 160 pound class, John Whalen of South Boston won a decision over Walter Wazal of Fitchburg. The Standard Times, Springfield, Boston Globe and Fitchburg Sentinel on the same date ran reviews of this fight. The Fitchburg Sentinel included that Wazal had knocked out Joseph Tierney of Cambridge in the earlier round then lost to Whelan.

Sat, Jan 18, 1936, Fitchburg SenDec 1936tinel, Mass - An announcement of a boxing card to take place at the Fitchburg Lodge of Elks that Monday night included Walter "Slug" Wazel, Fitchburg against Silvester Davis of Worchester. "Slug" is used in the Sentinel's Sept 24, 1942 paper with the announcement of Walter going into active service in the Navy.

Sat, Mar 07, 1936 Fitchburg Sentinel, Mass - Walter Wazel of Fitchburg won a decision over Joe Brennan of Dracut in the finals of the 160 lb class at a boxing show in Lowell put on in Rex Arena.

Tue, Mar 10, 1936, The Republican, Springfield, Mass - In another tournament put on by the Irish-American A.C. at Boston Arena, Walter Wazal, Fitchburg defeated Francis McLean of Roxbury in the 160 lb class. Standard Times and Boston Globe again noted these fights. These were tryout fights for the New England boxing championships to take place at the Boston Arena on the next Monday night reported by the Fitchburg Sentinel on March 11th.

Mon, Mar 23, 1936, The Boston Globe, Mass - Posts preliminary commentary on the upcoming New England boxing championships featuring the best amateur boxers from Massachusetts, New Hampshire and Rhode Island. The 160 lb Class will feature Leroy Carvell of Springfield, Pat Devin, Cambridge, Neil Doherty, Brookline, Walter Wazal, Fitchburg, Eddie Carroll, Lowell, Louis Suggs, Newport R.I. and William Hayes, East Rochester, N.H.

Thu, Apr 02, 1936 Fitchburg Sentinel, Mass - Walter Wazel. Fitchburg who the article noted was under the management of James P. Harvey won in the Golden Glove tournament at the Sun Athletic Association in Lowell Wednesday evening.

Mon, Apr 06, 1936, Springfield Evening Union, Mass - Walter Wazal, Fitchburg will fight in the 160 lb class in an amateur boxing tournament at Boston Arena put on by Irish-American A.A. on this Monday evening. Fitchburg Sentinel and Boston Globe report these fights also.

Tue, Apr 07, 1936, The Boston Globe, Mass - in the Irish-American amateur tourney at Boston Arena Monday evening, Wlater Wazal of Fitchburh in the 160 lb class beat Fred McLean in the trials, then beat his twin brother Francis in the semifinal before finishing off John Monte of Somerville by 2nd round knockout.

Mon, Apr 20, 1936, The Boston Globe, Mass - The Irish-American A.A. was playing host to another amateur boxing show a the Boston Arena on this Monday evening. In the 160 pound class would be Walter Wazal of Fitchburg along with Walter Marceizyk of Providence, Henry Walmsley and Lewis Suggs of Newport and Frankie and Freddie McLean of Roxbury.

Tue, Apr 21, 1936, Fitchburg Sentinel, Mass - At the Irsh-American A.A. tournament Monday evening in the 160 pound class, Walter Marceizyk of Providence won over Walter Wazal of Fitchburg.

Thu, Apr 23, 1936 The Boston Globe, Mass - In an amateur tournement at Jefferson Club, Cambridge in the finals of the 160 pound class, Walter Wazel, Fitchburg knocked out Morris Moriarty, Belmont in the 2nd round. The Fitchburg Sentinel account of this tourney noted Wazel knocked out three of his opponents at the Jefferson Athletic Club. Those going down to defeat were Devine of Camridge, Paquette of Roslindale and Moriarty of Belmont.

Tue, Apr 28, 1936, The Waterbury Democrat, In an inter-city tournament of amateur boxers from Boston, New York, Buffalo, Detroit and Cleveland, Walter Wasel of Fitchburg won a 3 round decision over Neil Doherty of Brookline in the 160 pound class. Short accounts of this finals fight in the Springfield Evening Union, Mass and The Lewiston Daily Sun, Maine, on April 28th used the Walter Wazel spelling.

Tue, Apr 28, 1936, The Boston Globe, Mass - Atan Inter-City amateur boxing tournament at the Boston Arena on Monday evening there were fighters participating from New York, Dedroit, Cleveland and Buffalo along with those from the New England area. In the 160 pound Class, Walter Wazal of Fitchburg knocked out John Tate of New York in the first round and then in the final round Wazal beat Neil Doherty, of Brookline.

Fri, Aug 07, 1936, Athol Daily News, Athol, Mass - Walter Wazel of Fitchburg who won the middleweight class state amateur title in the spring it is reported will be turning pro in the fall. Newspaper articles in late November 1936 reporting amateur action by Wazal would indicate within the month of December 1937 Wazal turned pro.

Sat, Oct 24, 1936, Fitchburg Sentinel, Mass - At a tournament in Worcester Friday night, Walter Wazel won the 160 pound class. Wazel knocked out Thomas Connerty of Boston in the 2nd round of the semi-final and then knocked out Albert Fascio of Providence in the first round final.

Tue, Oct 27, 1936, The Boston Globe, Mass - At the Boston Arena in another elimination tournament put on by the Irish-American A.C., WDec 1936alter Wazal, Fitchburg defeated Fred MacLean, Roxbury to win the 160 pound class. Wazal knocked out Walter Kennigan, Newport in the Trial bout in the first round. In the Semifinal, Wazal knocked out Henry Hubert of Fall River in the first round.

Mon, Nov 09, 1936, The Boston Globe - In some discussion on boxers participating in this evenings bouts at the Boston Arena. In the 160 pound class would be Lewis Suggs, Fred McLean and Wa;ter Wazal of Fitchburg. Interesting comment made on Wazal, "Walter is a hard to fathom southpaw, who can punch with both dukes."

Tue, Nov 10, 1936, The Boston Globe, Mass - At the Irish-American A. A. tournament Monday evening at the Boston Arena, Walter Wazel of Fitchburg knocked out Lewis Suggs of Newport in the second rond of the 160 pound final.

Tue, Nov 10, 1936, Fitchburg Sentinel, Mass - Walter Wazal won the 160 pound class in the Boston Arena's Irish American A.C. tournament Monday evening. Wazal defeated Fred McLean of Roxbury by decision in three rounds and then knocked out Lewis Suggs of Newport in teh second round final.

Wed, Nov 25, 1936, The Republican, Springfield, Mass - Walter Wazal will be among eight of New England's best amateur boxers leave on this day for New York to compete in the Golden Gloves Eastern sectional All-America tournament on Thursday and Friday.

Fri, Nov 27, 1936, The Boston Globe, Mass - Walter Wazal, Fitchburg (paper says Boston), survived the first round of competition in the All Eastern finals of the All America tournament. Wazal knocked out Stan Ingram, Washington D.C. in 2:19 of the second round.

Sat, Nov 28, 1936, The Boston Globe, Mass - Posted the results of the Semifinal and Final rounds at the All America tournament on Friday. Walter Wazal outpointed Don Stevens, Portchester, N.Y. in 3 rounds in the 160 pound class semifinal. Then in the Final round Wazal went down to defeat to Dominic Siano, Porchester, N.Y., outpointed in 3 rounds.

This affectively ended Walter Wazal's amateur career turning pro and starting out his professional career right away in January 1937.

Now that I feel pretty confident Walter Wazal is our real Man from Fitchburg, but unfortunately the papers continue to use Wazel also. I've yet to see the Watzel spelling used like BoxRec has for the one file that lists his Mike O'Dowd alias so maybe that's a tie in to when/how he started using that alias O'Dowd.

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Instead of scrambling through tons of papers at one time to unearth several fights, I though it might be entertaining to look at Wazal's pro career one fight at a time. See what I can unearth and at the same time look a bit at his opponent. See what I can find relatively quick without spending a whole lot of time on the opponent's full career, especially if it's lengthy like Dom Labbe's is So I looked up quick what general bio I could find on Labbe, which I was happy to find a fair amount which I'll share with you here also along with a quick rating file for him and a couple photos found. The rating I did a fairly quick play testing of, but it will I'm sure need refinement.

So here is Walter Wazal's first pro fight results from several sources found..
Fri, Jan 01, 1937, Portland Press Herald, Maine - Fight card where Dom Labbe, Lewiston is to battle Henry Johnson, Lawrence, Mass in 6 rounds. Result articles on Jan 02 note Labbe fought Walter Wazal an apparent last minute replacement.

Fri, Jan 01, 1937 Evening Press, Portland, Maine - Prefight article notes boxing card talking place at the Exposition Building, Portland with Labbe meeting Johnson for six rounds.

Sat, Jan 02, 1937, Fitchburg Sentinel, Mass. - Short paragraph account of Walter Wazal of Fitchburg defeating Don Labbe of Lewiston in 22 seconds in Portland, Maine Friday night. Says it was a scheduled 8 round fight but all other accounts say 6 rounds.

Sat, Jan 02, 1937, Evening Express, Portland, Maine notes that Walter Wazil, southpaw from the Boston area knocked out Dom Labbe of Lewiston in 22 seconds with Labbe getting thrown off guard by the the southpaw deliveries.

Sat, Jan 02, 1937 Lewiston Daily Sun, Maine and the Sun-Journal, Lewiston, Maine, listed their fight weights at Labbe, 161 and Wazil 163. It says the fight was scheduled for 6 rounds which is what BoxRec notes under the Walter Watzel file.

Sat, Jan 02, 1937, Portland Press Herald, Maine - Headline: "Labbe Wants Wazil Again", Note some use of the spelling Wazil. Had to search Labbe to find these records. Article notes in that that Wazil's manager, Jimmy Harvey claimed Wazil had 75 knockouts as an amateur with 14 in a row at one time. Said, the Labbe fight was Wazil's first professional fight.
Wazal Career Record: W1(KO 1) / L0(KO 0) / D0

Here is a little bit on Dom Labbe - MW 1932-1939
Career Record: W43(KO 41) / L8(KO 7) / D5
With Newspaper Decisions: W74(KO 41) / L19(KO 7) / D15 / NC2

Birth Name: Dominique A. Labbe

Find a Grave Info:
Date Of Birth 10 July 1908 Lewiston, Androscoggin County, Maine
Date of Death 22 June 1985 Lewiston, Androscoggin County, Maine
Burial: Saint Peter's Cemetery, Lewiston, Androscoggin County, Main
Spouse: Georgette Cecilia (Turcotte) Labbe 1910-1986 (m. 1964)

Noted in BoxRec: Brother of fellow boxers Paul Junior(Paul Labbe Jr), K.O. Labbe and Baby Jack Renault (Jack Labbe)

Mon, Sep 23, 1946, Porland Press Herald, Maine - Obituary found announcing the death of Achille P. Labbe, 81. He was a former boxer and had four sons who were boxers also. He died on Sunday. He was a native of St. Frederic, Quebec and lived in Lewiston for 39 years after living in Augusta and Manchester N.H. He was a father of 19 childern! 14 were surving at his death. His childern as mentioned included four boxer, they were Achille Paul (Paul Junior), Liniere (Jack Renaud), Arthur (K.O. Labbe) and Dominique who boxed as Dom Labbe.

Third Photo is Wazal, first two are Labbe.

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Howdy on this rainy Sunday in Georgia, USA!

I'm going through fight logs on BoxRec for Hal Thomas and John Henry Johnson, Walter Wazal's 2nd professional fight (First on the current Walter Wazal BoxRec log). Both of these fight logs for Thomas and Johnson are not very long so I'm taking some time to look through both to see which may be the real name and which the alias. I thought at first Hal Thomas being the real name because right now it's fight under that name that are the earliest ones I'm finding in the papers. But some newspaper comments in the first month of 1937 are beginning to make me feel John Henry Johnson may be the "real name" maybe Henry Johnson and Hal Thomas is the alias.

Stay tuned......
Rocco

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Still working on Hal/Harry Thomas or John Henry Johnson. Getting near through all the fights I think. Haven't quit on it.

Been seeing a lot of this Arena. I was pleased to see there was a Venue file in by data base. I've filled in a bit of missing info and have included here a couple photos on wiki site on it and if you web search there's a fair amount of into on it. Has quite a boxing history to it.

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Ok, Attached is a file for one, Hal Thomas MW, Alias John Henry Johnson and possibly Harry Thomas. Found different fight records on BoxRec under all these names. When Wazal fought him he was going by John Henry Johnson. The fights I researched between these three fighter names and actually a fourth one in BoxRec, John Johnson, starts out as Hal Thomas. So that's what I'm calling him.

The Bio notes is lengthly. with different comments to show how the names appear to link to each other as being one person. You can agree or not with that. It all adds up to a not very good Middleweight.

Never found a photo of him.

Rocco

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Walter Wazal's next fight combining the Wazal / Watzel versions on BoxRec as I'm doing for Walter, is again Dom Labbe so we'll be looking at his fourth opponent, Vincenzo Troiano coming up next.

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Started looking into Troiano and his story starts back in 1934 actually. Interesting start some of what I've found. Here's some bio info on Troiano and the beginning of his career in the US with his first two fights. first fight against a Chris de Rosa, Boxrec presents de Rosa as DeRossier? Have not found where that's come from. A little look into Chris found accounts spelling it as DeRosier but also De Rosa also back in 1930 with his first fight account. All just more name spelling confusion!

Some initial Troiano info thought you'd find interesting....

Date of Death: 1992-07-08 (Age: 82) listed in BoxRec.
Find a Grave Places his Date of Birth as Dec 13, 1909
Notes his full name as: Vincenzo Nicolo "Vincent" Troiano
A picture of his Burial stone shows Vincent N. 1909-1992 and Lucri Nappy 1912-1983
There is also a photo of Vincenzo showing him full length in his boxing garb and has some gentleman in a suit standing next to him. This photo, there is the headshot posted on BoxRec, guessing came from this photo?


Thu, Sep 06, 1934, Richmond Times-Dispatch- In a boxing news article, it mentions some of the known middleweights, Ken Overlin included to be meeting "the best Italy has in middleweights, Vincnzo Troiano. Article says Troiano has been over in the US only six weeks. The Richmond News Leader on this same days says specifically Troiano to box Chris de Rosa of New York in an eight rounder.

Tue, Sep 11, 1934, The Richmond News Leader, Richmond, VA - Background article on Vincenzo Troiano proclaimed middleweight champion of Italy, due to make his American debut against Chris De Rosa, New York Jewish fighter. Headline of the article, " De Rosa's Opponent Here Instructed by Mussolini to Bring Crown to Italy"! Troiano had defeated Italy's middleweight title holder for the championship and after doing so, it was quoted in the papers that Premier Mussolini expected that some day Vencenzo would be bringing the world's middleweight title to Italy.After fighting all over Europe and Africa according to the article he came over to America. This article states it been only seven weeks he'd been here from this date. He spent time in Maine with family his first two weeks here and then moved to New York to train at the Pioneer Gym on 54th street.
A Side Note: BoxRec has Chris DeRosa filed as Chris DeRossier. Found an article in The Boston Globe, Fri, Apr 25, 1930 with a short account of Chris' first fight listed in BoxRec against a Stonewall Jackson on Apr 24, 1930. The account says "Chris Derosa of Boston was awarded the decision over Stonewall Jackson of this city". Couple other fights BoxRec lists I found in papers name spelling as Chris DeRosier.

Wed. Sep 12, 1934, The Richmond News Leader and Richmond Times-Dispatch, Richmond, VA - At the Richmond Stadium program of the Sportsmen's Club prefight round up of a fight card that evening includes Chris de Rosa, New York, 160, vs Vincent Troiano, Italy, 160 in an eight round contest.

Thu, Sep 13, 1934, The Richmond News Leader - Round up of fights at the Richmond Stadium, Chris de Rosa, New York middleweight won by TKO in the 7th round against Vincent Troiano, Italy. The Richmond Times-Dispatch report includes that the fight seemed about even when "what seemed to be a butt" opened up a cut over Troiano's eye that was bad enough he did not come out to answer the start of the eighth round. Record: W0(KO 0) / L1(KO 1) / D0

Thu, Oct 25, 1934, The Record, Havensack, NJ - Pre Fight article on the Mookie Goldman vs Vicenzo Troiano eight round bout this evening a the Teterboro Airdrome, Hasbrouck Heights, NJ. In talking about Troiano, it's said hw he was being acclaimed in the Italian news. He had boxed in the Carnera-Uzcudun card in Italy and had impressed Premier Mussolini so much he paid for much of Troiano's expenses to come to America. This record says while fighting in Italy, France, Belgium and African, Troiano had not lost in 20 fights with most of the wins by knockout.

Fri, Oct 26, 1934, The Record, Hackensack, NJ - Fight night, Thursday Oct 25th at the Hasbrouck heights Teterboro Airdrome some wild confusion in the conclusion of the Vincenzo Troiano, 164 vs Mookie Goldman, 164 bout. In the third round of the scheduled eight rounds, referee Johnny Jayes stopped the fight after just 12 seconds elapsed in the third round when Goldman suffered a cut over his left eye from a head butt collision with Troiano. At first Hayes signaled TKO stoppage win for Troiano after sending Goldman to his corner. When the ring announcer was announcing this decision, referee rushed over yelling "no, no, Goldman wins. He was butted over the eye". So the announcer changed the verdict announcment. Then in the fighter dressing room discussions came up between Hayes and Troiano's people and Boxing Commissioner George Zimmerman with Troiano's managers protesting the Goldman win. In there Hayes contended he never told the ring announcer to announce any verdict and that he "didn't pick any man as the winner"!! So then in the dressing room infront of everyone including newpaper writers who then asked had he made a decision yet, Hayes announced, "No, but I'll give one now. Troiano is the winner by a technical knockout." That ended that article's discussion on events with Troiano being named winner by Third round TKO.
The Jersey Journal account of events on Fri Oct 26th also noted the decision changing as The Record had. First announcing Troiano winner by TKO and then changing it to Goldman by TKO as then announced in the ring by the ring announcer Dave Lurie. But then later in the dressing room Hayes claiming he'd not rendered a decision to Lurie and so then in there declared Troiano the winner by TKO as he first declared in the ring.
The Herald Statesman, on Fri, Oct 26th gives a more abbreviated account of the fight's confused ending only stating the announcements in the ring with the first award of the TKO win to Troiano, but then Hayes reversing that giving the TKO to Goldman. No mention of the events later as accounted by The Record and The Jersey Journal giving the decision back to Troiano.

Sat, Oct 27, 1934, The Record, Havensack, NJ - Well then a new verdict announcement by Referee Johnny Hayes the next day on the Troiano v Goldman bout. Hayes announced a total denial of all the events on Thursday night. He reported to the State Atheletic Commission that Mookie Goldman was the winner over Vincenzo Troiano by TKO "because of Troiano's "foul tactics"". Referee Hayes denied all the discussions later in the dressing room stating he was misquoted retracting his "supposed" decision in the dressing room giving the TKO win back to Troiano. So that leaves it apparently as how BoxRec records the fight results as a 3rd round TKO win for Goldman.

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Early goings on for Troiano in the US did not go well going 0-6-0, stopped 3 times in those 6 losses.

Sat, Oct 27, 1934, The Record, Havensack, NJ - Well then a new verdict announcement by Referee Johnny Hayes the next day on the Troiano v Goldman bout. Hayes announced a total denial of all the events on Thursday night. He reported to the State Atheletic Commission that Mookie Goldman was the winner over Vincenzo Troiano by TKO "because of Troiano's "foul tactics"". Referee Hayes denied all the discussions later in the dressing room stating he was misquoted retracting his "supposed" decision in the dressing room giving the TKO win back to Troiano. So that leaves it apparently as how BoxRec records the fight results as a 3rd round TKO win for Goldman.
Record: W0(KO 0) / L2(KO 1) / D0

Sat, Nov 17, 1934 Pittsburgh Sun-Telegraph, Pittsburgh, PA - Sammy Slaughter, 167 lbs, Terre Haute, Ind., one of the ranking middleweights mentioned alongside Anson Green and Gorilla Jones outfought Vincenzo Troiano, 160-161 lb, Italy in a 10 round bout at Erie, PA Friday night the 16th. Record: W0(KO 0) / L3(KO 1) / D0

Tue, Dec 04, 1934 The Philadelphia Inquirer, PA - In a 10 round bout in Newark, N.J., Billy Ketchell, 171-171 1/2, Millville, N.J. won by TKO over Vincent Troiano, 162-162 1/2, Italy in the 8th round. Referee Joe O'Connor stopped the bout at the end of the 7th when Troiano suffered a badly cut left eye. The Courier-News, Bridgewater, NJ account of the fight on Dec 4 notes it took place at Laurel Garden, Newark. Record: W0(KO 0) / L4(KO 2) / D0

Thu, Jan 03, 1935, The Daily Record, Long Branch, NJ - In a scheduled 10 rounder Wednesday night, acting as a comeback jump off bout for Vince Dundee to gain a rematch against Teddy Yarosz who'd defeated Dundee on September 11, 1934 for the NBA/NYSAC World Middleweight Title. At Laurel Garden, Neward, Dundee took on Vicenzo Troiano of Italy. The early rounds were not much to watch, but in the fourth round Dundee got in a right that was a solid smash to Troiano's body which staggard Vincenzo greatly such by the next round, Referee Frank Scully decided to halt the fight, TKO win for Dundee. Dundee came into the fight weighing 164 to Troiano's 159 1/2.
Thu, Jan 03, 1935, Times Union, Brooklyn, NY - Account of fight records that the stoppage in the 5th round came at 2:33. They noted that Dundee just totally outclassed Troiano and with constant left jabs and right crosses besides the body punches, Dundee had Vincenzo's face
"puffed" and the Italian was exhausted by the time Referee Scully stopped it. Record: W0(KO 0) / L5(KO 3) / D0

Tue, Jan 22, 1935 The Courier-News, Bridgewater, NJ - Announces fights tonight at the Moose Hall in Elizabeth, NJ by the Union County AA. Included is Mickey Bottone, Newwark middleweight taking on Italian Vincenzo Troiano. The Times out of Trenton, NJ announce this being the Main six round fight on the card.

Wed. Jan 23. 1935. The Record, Havensack, NJ - In the Mickey Bottone, 164 v Vincenzo Troiano, 160 six round bout, Bottone was the better fighter through most of the six rounds to take the decision verdict from Referee Frank Farmer. Record: W0(KO 0) / L6(KO 3) / D0

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Ran across this nice article in the Portland Press Herald on Mar 31, 1935 which runs a good biography of Vincenzio from his early days in Italy up to a present moving to Portland, Maine to visit family there and begin renewed training leaving New York where he'd failed pretty bad in his early career in America.

Sun, Mar 31, 1935, Portland Press Herald, Maine - Nice introductory article on Vincenze Troiano who'd come recently to visit with relatives in Portland and take up training at the Porland Athletic Club with hopes to restart his career which was going no where while he was in New York with the management there. Before he started his training at the PAC, he had a nasal operation but then started his new training after that. This article notes that Troiano was born December 13, 1909 in the town, Manfredonia, Italy. At 14 his brother died and he left school to help support his mother who was widowed along with three younger brothers and two sisters. Then living in Naples, in 1926 his mother died and now Vincenzo was head of the family! He took up working at an electrical supply and equipment manufacturer and while there began boxing training in between working at the factory and tending to his family. In 1930 at the age of 20 he won the amateur championship of Naples and later finished his amateur career as title champion of all Italy. He fought a total of 74 bouts in three years. From 1932 to 1934 he took part in 25 professional bouts loosing one decision to an Abel Arcote, ex champion of France. Vincenzo was W23 / L0 / D2 in those bouts. Money he won from these bouts he used to help him on his voyage to America.