Pete Rose sycophants

[monkeyman576]

MLB finally did the right thing. Rose and Jackson were no saints, but their punishment far outweighed the crime.

[daves]

When did shoeless pass away? Should his ban ended sooner?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[monkeyman576]

1951 and yes.

[Brad K]

The personal failings don't mean they weren't great players. How about we let every true star into the Hall but include comments about his personal failings in his Hall biography.

As examples

"At one time Rose was under a permanent ban from baseball. After initially denying it, he admitted to gambling on baseball games. Rose entered a plea of guilty when charged with tax evasion. He avoided being charged but paid a settlement to a woman who claimed she had a relationship with him when she was under the age of consent and he was in his 30s."

and...

"There are allegations Bonds used steroids to increase his performance. It was never proven however changes in his appearance lend support to the allegation. How much, if any, performance advantage he gained if he used steroids cannot be determined as opposing pitchers are known to have used steroids. Bonds was having a Hall of Fame career prior to the alleged steroid use."

[dsvitak]

Originally Posted by Brad K

The personal failings don't mean they weren't great players. How about we let every true star into the Hall but include comments about his personal failings in his Hall biography.

As examples

"At one time Rose was under a permanent ban from baseball. After initially denying it, he admitted to gambling on baseball games. Rose entered a plea of guilty when charged with tax evasion. He avoided being charged but paid a settlement to a woman who claimed she had a relationship with him when she was under the age of consent and he was in his 30s."

and...

"There are allegations Bonds used steroids to increase his performance. It was never proven however changes in his appearance lend support to the allegation. How much, if any, performance advantage he gained if he used steroids cannot be determined as opposing pitchers are known to have used steroids. Bonds was having a Hall of Fame career prior to the alleged steroid use."

I was one of those that trashed Bonds for PED usage.

I then read a sophisticated analysis of what PED's likely did to his stats.

About 100 homers, and TONS of extra walks. That's about it. His homer count would have been quite close to his Godfather's, and he would certainly be in the HoF now.

Same with McGwire. He took andro-creatine, which was legal, and available in nutrition shops, AND was openly displayed in his locker at the stadium.

Yep..it was the pre-cursor to steroids, but it was LEGAL. Never could figure out all the heat he got for it. IT WAS LEGAL.

[chucksabr]

Originally Posted by monkeyman576

MLB finally did the right thing. Rose and Jackson were no saints, but their punishment far outweighed the crime.

Given that they were on the permanently ineligible list, it seems to me the punishment fit the crime exactly. But now that Manfred has issued his executive order that "permanently" does not really mean permanently, the punishment is now far less than the crime.

Do you feel the same way about Chick Gandel and Eddie Cicotte, the two scumbags that sought out gamblers to take up their propostion to throw the 1919 World Series?

[chucksabr]

Originally Posted by dsvitak

I was one of those that trashed Bonds for PED usage.

I then read a sophisticated analysis of what PED's likely did to his stats.

About 100 homers, and TONS of extra walks. That's about it. His homer count would have been quite close to his Godfather's, and he would certainly be in the HoF now.

Same with McGwire. He took andro-creatine, which was legal, and available in nutrition shops, AND was openly displayed in his locker at the stadium.

Yep..it was the pre-cursor to steroids, but it was LEGAL. Never could figure out all the heat he got for it. IT WAS LEGAL.

I would like to read that analysis that concluded steroids added 100 home runs to Bonds' record, because I am dubious about that one.

[Amazin69]

Originally Posted by dsvitak

I was one of those that trashed Bonds for PED usage.

I then read a sophisticated analysis of what PED's likely did to his stats.

About 100 homers, and TONS of extra walks. That's about it. His homer count would have been quite close to his Godfather's, and he would certainly be in the HoF now.

Same with McGwire. He took andro-creatine, which was legal, and available in nutrition shops, AND was openly displayed in his locker at the stadium.

Yep..it was the pre-cursor to steroids, but it was LEGAL. Never could figure out all the heat he got for it. IT WAS LEGAL.

As I always seem to need to note, "Andro" and similar substances were banned by MLB in June, 1991, IIRC. (One time I even linked to Fay Vincent's directive on this.)

The fact that you could "buy it at GNC" is utterly irrelevant. McGwire had seven years' notice that this constituted cheating. And he still chose to do it.

(You can get a prescription for steroids, too. Doesn't mean players are allowed to take them, though.)

[Brad K]

Originally Posted by chucksabr

Given that they were on the permanently ineligible list, it seems to me the punishment fit the crime exactly. But now that Manfred has issued his executive order that "permanently" does not really mean permanently, the punishment is now far less than the crime.

Do you feel the same way about Chick Gandel and Eddie Cicotte, the two scumbags that sought out gamblers to take up their propostion to throw the 1919 World Series?

He took Jackson off the list 74 years after his death. Maybe Rose should have had to wait 74 years too.

[Brad K]

Originally Posted by chucksabr

I would like to read that analysis that concluded steroids added 100 home runs to Bonds' record, because I am dubious about that one.

I'd like to see the evidence he hit balls farther. That's the key to whether steroids helped him.

[Leo_The_Lip]

Originally Posted by Brad K

I'd like to see the evidence he hit balls farther. That's the key to whether steroids helped him.

This is NOT true.
Sterids were't the key to power. It was recovery time.

As Castey use to say, "you could look if up."

[Brad K]

You mean fewer missed games?

A guy is stronger but doesn't hit the ball farther?

Yet runners on steroids run faster and weight lifters lift more.