Retire/miss seasons according to history

David Watts · 09-10-2024, 11:17 AM

See lots of folks recommending these setting for historical play. I've tried it and I just can't see how it's doable. Every time I've tried it, by the time I get to the second season, I have teams with only 1 SS on their roster. Only 1 guy rated to play CF. 1 catcher. This is with only retire according to history turned on. Miss seasons would result in an even bigger mess. If you play this way are you just accepting the players playing out of position with bad ratings, or do you go into each team and force trades/transactions, so team will have adequate backups?

Reed · 09-10-2024, 12:08 PM

Assuming this is a straight historical game (not random), are you playing with injuries on or off. And what setting if on?

David Watts · 09-10-2024, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reed

Assuming this is a straight historical game (not random), are you playing with injuries on or off. And what setting if on?

From my experience, it would be impossible to keep injuries turned on. Even with them off, teams end up with only1 SS, or only 1 guy rated to play CF.

Rain King · 09-10-2024, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

From my experience, it would be impossible to keep injuries turned on. Even with them off, teams end up with only1 SS, or only 1 guy rated to play CF.

Do you have an example? Are these very early historical seasons?

Are there other players with usable outfield/infield ratings that just don't have the experience to have an overall rating at the position?

Scoman · 09-10-2024, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

From my experience, it would be impossible to keep injuries turned on. Even with them off, teams end up with only1 SS, or only 1 guy rated to play CF.

How are your teams getting their players,Amateur draft,FA only? If your doing a yearly draft , teams should be filling out their rosters,only time it gets a little slim is during the deadball era when you play with the setting you mentioned.

Reed · 09-10-2024, 12:26 PM

When I played historical, I just turned off injuries. Very low might be okay. Prior to 1907 I had some difficulty keeping teams with appropriate players at all positions. But after 1907, it wasn’t an issue. Maybe I was just lucky?

David Watts · 09-10-2024, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scoman

How are your teams getting their players,Amateur draft,FA only? If your doing a yearly drafts, teams should be filling out their rosters,only time it gets a little slim is during the deadball era when you play with the setting you mentioned.

So, you're saying hold a amateur draft? This may be where I'm messing up, as I usually just have players debut with the actual teams, no draft.

Reed · 09-10-2024, 12:34 PM

And if you do an amateur draft, make sure it is set for around 10 or more rounds to make sure all the newcomers get included. (Normally there are enough players for about 7 rounds but some years like war years it could be higher.)

Reed · 09-10-2024, 12:39 PM

I also kept my reserve roster very low (around 5) so if a team needed a player, there usually was a free agent available.

David Watts · 09-10-2024, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reed

I also kept my reserve roster very low (around 5) so if a team needed a player, there usually was a free agent available.

Did teams sign players when they needed them, or did you have to manually assign them? With reserve roster low, were you getting a lot of the ole OOTP sign and release over and over and over?

Scoman · 09-10-2024, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

So, you're saying hold a amateur draft? This may be where I'm messing up, as I usually just have players debut with the actual teams, no draft.

Yes,it distributes the talent better and more even, and make sure you do enough rounds in each draft that all players are drafted each year.

David Watts · 09-10-2024, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scoman

Yes,it distributes the talent better and more even, and I make sure you do enough rounds in each draft that all players are drafted each year.

Do you use the reserve clause? I usually like to use free agency no matter what period I'm playing.

Reed · 09-10-2024, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

Did teams sign players when they needed them, or did you have to manually assign them? With reserve roster low, were you getting a lot of the ole OOTP sign and release over and over and over?

Teams would usually sign them. There was some of the sign for short period then release.
What year are you playing?

Scoman · 09-10-2024, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

Do you use the reserve clause? I usually like to use free agency no matter what period I'm playing.

I play with financials off in Historical. I turn off Trades also so I have no advantage over the AI. But thats just me.

uruguru · 09-10-2024, 05:03 PM

If you are playing historicals with no minor leagues, you really need to account for the roster mismatch situations that occur when a player (or pitcher) shifts to a new role, when there is a serious injury that impacts roster depth, or a trade that does the same. Here are 3 tips.

1. The easiest thing is to disable "miss seasons according to history". There's few things in the game as devious as trading your big starter to the AI at the deadline knowing full well he is going to miss the entirety of the next season. Disabling this option removes that temptation. You can still retire players according to history.

2. You need to decrease the size of the reserve roster to something like 6 or 8 (at best). This forces a reasonable group of marginal players into the free agent pool so that they can be scooped up by an AI team if they suddenly have to put their starting SS on the DL. These are all going to be 1.5 star type players that will just serve as backups to get starters from getting exhaustion.

3. Another good option is to base fielding ratings (and even pitcher stamina) on a player's career rather than a 1-year or 3-year average. The benefit of this is that the AI doesn't get screwed by unexpected player position changes in a way that a reasonable human player wouldn't.

uruguru · 09-10-2024, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scoman

I play with financials off in Historical. I turn off Trades also so I have no advantage over the AI. But thats just me.

I've really struggled to find a historical variant that I enjoy GMing because, as you suggest, trading is pretty broken in historical if you use recalc. I've done a lot of Rule V only attempts with varying sizes for the 40-man roster.

uruguru · 09-10-2024, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

Do you use the reserve clause? I usually like to use free agency no matter what period I'm playing.

As a fan, I despise free agency so I play almost exclusively with the reserve clause on. It's a bit different in OOTP than it was in real life in that it star players are still compensated according to their ability. It's not like you can lock up Tom Seaver for peanuts.

Brad K · 09-10-2024, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by uruguru

As a fan, I despise free agency so I play almost exclusively with the reserve clause on. It's a bit different in OOTP than it was in real life in that it star players are still compensated according to their ability. It's not like you can lock up Tom Seaver for peanuts.

As a human being, I despise the reserve clause and don't want it even in simulations.

uruguru · 09-10-2024, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brad K

As a human being, I despise the reserve clause and don't want it even in simulations.

Fortunately, the players in OOTP aren't human. They're just electrons! This means I don't have to deal with the ethics of the reserve clause. I can just play and have fun. And like I said, the OOTP reserve clause isn't the same thing as the real world reserve clause. The player salaries are determined by their ratings, not the owners. Which means players are paid the exact appropriate amount for their skill level. No more, no less.

twins_34 · 09-10-2024, 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

See lots of folks recommending these setting for historical play. I've tried it and I just can't see how it's doable. Every time I've tried it, by the time I get to the second season, I have teams with only 1 SS on their roster. Only 1 guy rated to play CF. 1 catcher. This is with only retire according to history turned on. Miss seasons would result in an even bigger mess. If you play this way are you just accepting the players playing out of position with bad ratings, or do you go into each team and force trades/transactions, so team will have adequate backups?

You also need to make sure transactions is on if both retire and miss seasons is on because them real transactions according to history is to fight the players that miss seasons due to war or injury cause teams had to sign the free agents they needed to replace them players and that's something you really can't do easy. This would also mean you can't have FA on, you can't have rule 5.

The settings you are turning on is better for replay mode and is the only mode they are all activated in.

09-10-2024, 11:17 AM	#1
David Watts Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Looking for a place called Leehofooks Posts: 10,134 Infractions: 0/1 (1)	Retire/miss seasons according to history See lots of folks recommending these setting for historical play. I've tried it and I just can't see how it's doable. Every time I've tried it, by the time I get to the second season, I have teams with only 1 SS on their roster. Only 1 guy rated to play CF. 1 catcher. This is with only retire according to history turned on. Miss seasons would result in an even bigger mess. If you play this way are you just accepting the players playing out of position with bad ratings, or do you go into each team and force trades/transactions, so team will have adequate backups?

09-10-2024, 12:08 PM	#2
Reed Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 2,672	Assuming this is a straight historical game (not random), are you playing with injuries on or off. And what setting if on? __________________ I am not responsible for anything I post!!! Use at your own risk!

09-10-2024, 12:26 PM	#6
Reed Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 2,672	When I played historical, I just turned off injuries. Very low might be okay. Prior to 1907 I had some difficulty keeping teams with appropriate players at all positions. But after 1907, it wasn’t an issue. Maybe I was just lucky? __________________ I am not responsible for anything I post!!! Use at your own risk!

09-10-2024, 12:34 PM	#8
Reed Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 2,672	And if you do an amateur draft, make sure it is set for around 10 or more rounds to make sure all the newcomers get included. (Normally there are enough players for about 7 rounds but some years like war years it could be higher.) __________________ I am not responsible for anything I post!!! Use at your own risk!

09-10-2024, 12:39 PM	#9
Reed Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 2,672	I also kept my reserve roster very low (around 5) so if a team needed a player, there usually was a free agent available. __________________ I am not responsible for anything I post!!! Use at your own risk!

09-10-2024, 05:03 PM	#15
uruguru All Star Starter Join Date: May 2022 Posts: 1,364	If you are playing historicals with no minor leagues, you really need to account for the roster mismatch situations that occur when a player (or pitcher) shifts to a new role, when there is a serious injury that impacts roster depth, or a trade that does the same. Here are 3 tips. 1. The easiest thing is to disable "miss seasons according to history". There's few things in the game as devious as trading your big starter to the AI at the deadline knowing full well he is going to miss the entirety of the next season. Disabling this option removes that temptation. You can still retire players according to history. 2. You need to decrease the size of the reserve roster to something like 6 or 8 (at best). This forces a reasonable group of marginal players into the free agent pool so that they can be scooped up by an AI team if they suddenly have to put their starting SS on the DL. These are all going to be 1.5 star type players that will just serve as backups to get starters from getting exhaustion. 3. Another good option is to base fielding ratings (and even pitcher stamina) on a player's career rather than a 1-year or 3-year average. The benefit of this is that the AI doesn't get screwed by unexpected player position changes in a way that a reasonable human player wouldn't.