Gambo and T_Wil1 Photopack

[RUKen]

Originally Posted by Amazin69

I have no idea what Pebbly Jack (who would turn 70 that summer) was doing in an Indians uniform in 1927. He wasn't a coach, and "Old-Timers' Day" and such had yet to be invented, as I understand it.

Old-Timers' Days were occasionally held as early as the '00s. The Cleveland Indians had one on July 29, 1921 (see attached image). It appears that 1920-style uniforms were provided for most of the attendees. Glasscock wasn't at that event, but perhaps the team continued having it through the '20s. Jack Glasscock played for the Cleveland National League team for the first 5 1/2 seasons of his major league career, beginning in 1879.

[Amazin69]

I stand corrected. Speaking of the Naps, here's Nig Clarke in 1910 (they'd been wearing the script "C" on the uniforms until then) showing off the effects of a career using early-20th century catcher's gloves:



Ouch.

(From the same auction as the others, and similarly de-browned and sharpened.)

[DeweyintheHall]

Originally Posted by Amazin69

I stand corrected. Speaking of the Naps, here's Nig Clarke in 1910 (they'd been wearing the script "C" on the uniforms until then) showing off the effects of a career using early-20th century catcher's gloves:

Attachment 1014267

Ouch.

(From the same auction as the others, and similarly de-browned and sharpened.)

Careful...the authorities at Baseball Reference have decided you should call him Jay Clarke....https://www.baseball-reference.com/p...larkni01.shtml

[stlcardsfan]

Originally Posted by Patsy Tebeau

A much clearer photo of Pike. Written on the back is 'compliments (?) of your cousin, I.E. Pike'

I knew this had to be you!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/13501125649...EAAOSwJzZmFSFt

99% of your items are incredibly insane and of course so are the prices. I have included photos of his listing claiming this is Lou Gehrig along with the "comparison" picture he is using to prove it is Gehrig. Pathetic.

[stlcardsfan]

here is one claiming its Cap Anson.

Just stupid.

The fact that people have bought your items thinking they are true historical items of the people you claim them to be makes my skin crawl.

Here is the description on the "Anson"

"1860’s to 1870’s Cap Anson tintype. Likely the earliest image of Anson. I have another uniformed Anson tintype listed where he appears to be slightly older. This tintype and the other listed Anson could both be considered as “Holy Grail” cards. To even consider them worth less than six figures is a laugh. I do have a family to feed, so entertaining reasonable offers is what I’m here for. Image was likely taken in Marshalltown Iowa, but perhaps taken during Anson’s arrival in Chicago. More likely rural Iowa. If it was taken in Chicago it would’ve likely been a cdv. Anson does seem to have an air of confidence in this image. Likely taken during his rise in his home state. This tintype is like seeing MLB lying in a cradle. If any auction reads my listings, enough is enough man. Contact me. I don’t read my emails often. Text or phone that shows your info on caller id. Tap out already for the sake of history of the greatest game. The crookedness is pretty apparent at this point if you haven’t noticed. Save grace already. Is there an honest auction house out there? Tintype measures about 2 1/2 by 4 inch in size. Stains, toning, wear, scratching, rust, emulsion, creasing and bends. Feel free to ask questions. It’s got to be getting hard for these houses to set up a catalog. I got an adjustable constant catalog. Let me know which players you’re looking for. I am getting tired on my end throwing shade. Gets old making half of a listing explaining the way money rules and ruins. Their makings folks, not mine. Guess they got a plan(with dollar signs on their end of course). Feel free to ask questions."


Also including the other photo of who he thinks is anson but older

[stlcardsfan]

Originally Posted by stlcardsfan

here is one claiming its Cap Anson.

Just stupid.

The fact that people have bought your items thinking they are true historical items of the people you claim them to be makes my skin crawl.

Here is the description on the "Anson"

"1860’s to 1870’s Cap Anson tintype. Likely the earliest image of Anson. I have another uniformed Anson tintype listed where he appears to be slightly older. This tintype and the other listed Anson could both be considered as “Holy Grail” cards. To even consider them worth less than six figures is a laugh. I do have a family to feed, so entertaining reasonable offers is what I’m here for. Image was likely taken in Marshalltown Iowa, but perhaps taken during Anson’s arrival in Chicago. More likely rural Iowa. If it was taken in Chicago it would’ve likely been a cdv. Anson does seem to have an air of confidence in this image. Likely taken during his rise in his home state. This tintype is like seeing MLB lying in a cradle. If any auction reads my listings, enough is enough man. Contact me. I don’t read my emails often. Text or phone that shows your info on caller id. Tap out already for the sake of history of the greatest game. The crookedness is pretty apparent at this point if you haven’t noticed. Save grace already. Is there an honest auction house out there? Tintype measures about 2 1/2 by 4 inch in size. Stains, toning, wear, scratching, rust, emulsion, creasing and bends. Feel free to ask questions. It’s got to be getting hard for these houses to set up a catalog. I got an adjustable constant catalog. Let me know which players you’re looking for. I am getting tired on my end throwing shade. Gets old making half of a listing explaining the way money rules and ruins. Their makings folks, not mine. Guess they got a plan(with dollar signs on their end of course). Feel free to ask questions."


Also including the other photo of who he thinks is anson but older

here is the other photo and description he has provided
1871 Rockford Forest City uniformed baseball tintype. Scott Hastings back center. Pony Sager front left. Cap Anson front right. Scott Hastings was considered the top player on the Forest City by his teammates. Very early image of Baseball HOF member Cap Anson. The man seated next to Anson is the reason Cap Anson played MLB baseball. Pony Sager was Cap Anson’s teammate in Iowa and convinced the 19 year old Anson to give the majors a try. This tintype should be on Cooperstown. Wish I could sort my way through the smoke and mirrors of the baseball market to put this in its rightful home. Stains, toning, wear, creasing, scratches, paint loss, emulsion and rust. Feel free to ask questions. About 2 by 4 inch in size. Bargain price for baseball history. What’s this worth in auction. 7 figures? Just trying to feed my family. Is that story on the internet still around about the auction world swooping in to save the old lady from giving away the 1960’s Reds cdv. Precious. Crooked little world we cater to nowadays. This card probably won’t be listed much longer, so if you have an inkling of buying you’ve been warned. I plead again tell me one man’s name who even claims to know anything about newly baseball images. If it’s the King Kahoona. He’s scared to face me. If it’s the other 2 guys. They don’t respond to emails. Give me a name. There seems to be claims of companies as authenticators of certain things. Not really specially newly discovered images. Never seen that phrased. Careful wording. Careful wording makes authenticators hand over fist crooks. They use the word criteria as an enabler of their thievery. If this card is worth $35000 the whole market will crumble. Fools. Here it is folks baseball history for fractions of pennies on the dollar.

[stlcardsfan]

Here is another that is clearly not the same person

[Amazin69]

Originally Posted by DeweyintheHall

Careful...the authorities at Baseball Reference have decided you should call him Jay Clarke....https://www.baseball-reference.com/p...larkni01.shtml

I'm aware. But we seem to be sticking with precedent here. At least as far as my searching the thread for him indicated.

(I have no problem, either way. The book I read as a child [in the 1970s] that referenced his 8-HR game against Corsicana called him "Jay 'Nig' Clarke", and I've always been a bit dubious about using the nickname. I'm just trying to conform the norm, here.)

[Amazin69]

Originally Posted by stlcardsfan

here is the other photo and description he has provided
1871 Rockford Forest City uniformed baseball tintype. Scott Hastings back center. Pony Sager front left. Cap Anson front right. Scott Hastings was considered the top player on the Forest City by his teammates. Very early image of Baseball HOF member Cap Anson. The man seated next to Anson is the reason Cap Anson played MLB baseball. Pony Sager was Cap Anson’s teammate in Iowa and convinced the 19 year old Anson to give the majors a try. This tintype should be on Cooperstown. Wish I could sort my way through the smoke and mirrors of the baseball market to put this in its rightful home. Stains, toning, wear, creasing, scratches, paint loss, emulsion and rust. Feel free to ask questions. About 2 by 4 inch in size. Bargain price for baseball history. What’s this worth in auction. 7 figures? Just trying to feed my family. Is that story on the internet still around about the auction world swooping in to save the old lady from giving away the 1960’s Reds cdv. Precious. Crooked little world we cater to nowadays. This card probably won’t be listed much longer, so if you have an inkling of buying you’ve been warned. I plead again tell me one man’s name who even claims to know anything about newly baseball images. If it’s the King Kahoona. He’s scared to face me. If it’s the other 2 guys. They don’t respond to emails. Give me a name. There seems to be claims of companies as authenticators of certain things. Not really specially newly discovered images. Never seen that phrased. Careful wording. Careful wording makes authenticators hand over fist crooks. They use the word criteria as an enabler of their thievery. If this card is worth $35000 the whole market will crumble. Fools. Here it is folks baseball history for fractions of pennies on the dollar.

Is there even anything that indicates these are ANY baseball "teammates"? The "uniforms" aren't exactly uniform, after all.

[cinemaodyssey]

I suspected as well. And those are only a few examples...there are others with "identifications" even more egregiously incorrect.

[DeweyintheHall]

Originally Posted by Amazin69

I'm aware. But we seem to be sticking with precedent here. At least as far as my searching the thread for him indicated.

(I have no problem, either way. The book I read as a child [in the 1970s] that referenced his 8-HR game against Corsicana called him "Jay 'Nig' Clarke", and I've always been a bit dubious about using the nickname. I'm just trying to conform the norm, here.)

I was being facetious. My love of history and of the game combine to make me find these attempts at retro-active moralizing contemptible.

Argue about it, debate it, say you think something was wrong, and stand by that principle. But to presume you so precisely know what was in the minds and hearts of people who lived and died well before you were born and that you can somehow 'protect' people of today as well as them by altering what was said in the past and of it today is arrogant beyond belief.

I keep wondering when they'll come for Kiki Cuyler - they are probably too ignorant to realize that a possible origin of his nickname was his stuttering pronunciation of his own last name.

Sorry to go on like that...as you can tell this topic gets me spun up.

[Chickazoola]

So for the Jay Clarke debate, his nickname is clearly derived from a racial slur. His wife hated the nickname and wanted the papers to use his given name. I think it's ok to move on from it and the bbref handles it tastefully by including a note about its usage.

Standards evolve and change over time and what was acceptable and "normal" can change. Acknowledging that things change is good and worthwhile, but also giving context is equally important. There is difference between whitewashing history and contextualizing history and I think bbref handles it about as well as you can.

[Patsy Tebeau]

Originally Posted by cinemaodyssey

I suspected as well. And those are only a few examples...there are others with "identifications" even more egregiously incorrect.

I noticed a lot of them, if not most of them are without a doubt not correct, though the one they claimed was Pike does resemble him a bit and the fact that it says I.E. Pike on the back and Pike's middle initial is E. according to all the books as well as b ref so that made me think it could possibly be him at the time (they probably used the fact that the only known pic of Pike is blurry beyond belief). Though upon inspecting the items they sell its clearly someone trying to cheese their way into convincing people the pictures are of relevant people when in reality they're just randos who might have 1 similar facial feature and suddenly they claim its them.

[Patsy Tebeau]

Its actually really sad seeing this because they at one point had a 'team photo' of the Keokuk Westerns for sale asking for like $40k back in like 2023 which I saw back then and figured it was like a mistake or something and now its gone so I can only assume someone was foolish enough and bought it

[Patsy Tebeau]

Originally Posted by stlcardsfan

I knew this had to be you!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/13501125649...EAAOSwJzZmFSFt

99% of your items are incredibly insane and of course so are the prices. I have included photos of his listing claiming this is Lou Gehrig along with the "comparison" picture he is using to prove it is Gehrig. Pathetic.

"I knew it had to be you" 1, im not the seller i just found the item on ebay, and yea 2 i get we all screw up at times but sheesh i mean i never spent thousands on their items like im sure some saps did nor am i the one with the profile pic of the guy who believes adam lanza was fake (which is frankly an embarrassment on its own on top of that baseless accusation of me being the seller but go off hun) plenty of people on here have made errors with photo identification like the one where they said president hayes's son with the croghan baseball team was John Bass and the very obviously reversed image of some left handed player that they thought was someone else, so theres no real reason to personally attack me

[Patsy Tebeau]

Originally Posted by stlcardsfan

here is one claiming its Cap Anson.

Just stupid.

The fact that people have bought your items thinking they are true historical items of the people you claim them to be makes my skin crawl.

Here is the description on the "Anson"

"1860’s to 1870’s Cap Anson tintype. Likely the earliest image of Anson. I have another uniformed Anson tintype listed where he appears to be slightly older. This tintype and the other listed Anson could both be considered as “Holy Grail” cards. To even consider them worth less than six figures is a laugh. I do have a family to feed, so entertaining reasonable offers is what I’m here for. Image was likely taken in Marshalltown Iowa, but perhaps taken during Anson’s arrival in Chicago. More likely rural Iowa. If it was taken in Chicago it would’ve likely been a cdv. Anson does seem to have an air of confidence in this image. Likely taken during his rise in his home state. This tintype is like seeing MLB lying in a cradle. If any auction reads my listings, enough is enough man. Contact me. I don’t read my emails often. Text or phone that shows your info on caller id. Tap out already for the sake of history of the greatest game. The crookedness is pretty apparent at this point if you haven’t noticed. Save grace already. Is there an honest auction house out there? Tintype measures about 2 1/2 by 4 inch in size. Stains, toning, wear, scratching, rust, emulsion, creasing and bends. Feel free to ask questions. It’s got to be getting hard for these houses to set up a catalog. I got an adjustable constant catalog. Let me know which players you’re looking for. I am getting tired on my end throwing shade. Gets old making half of a listing explaining the way money rules and ruins. Their makings folks, not mine. Guess they got a plan(with dollar signs on their end of course). Feel free to ask questions."


Also including the other photo of who he thinks is anson but older

I already know what young anson actually looked like, John Thorn has an image of him as a 15 yo in Marshalltown in 1867 in this article https://ourgame.mlblogs.com/cap-anso...m-956f090e184f

Definitely not the person that they claimed was in that picture on ebay

[Patsy Tebeau]

All the pics I was able to find of Washburn. Sadly all of them are after his playing days were over and I was unable to find any of him as a player.

[Cusick]

Here's a woodcut of Libe Washburn as a younger guy, although it doesn't show him in uniform. At this time, he was the captain of the Brown University football team. The image is from the Pawtucket (RI) Evening Times of Dec. 14, 1899.

[Patsy Tebeau]

Originally Posted by Cusick

Here's a woodcut of Libe Washburn as a younger guy, although it doesn't show him in uniform. At this time, he was the captain of the Brown University football team. The image is from the Pawtucket (RI) Evening Times of Dec. 14, 1899.

I never seen that one before, great find!

[Patsy Tebeau]

He was signed to a minor league contract with Philadelphia in 2016 and played in AAA with the organization for a few months.