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Old 05-08-2024, 11:49 AM   #41
DotDash
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Originally Posted by Socali View Post
I have Mondesi at Level 4 and in checking CHANCE status to level up to 5, I'm seeing an issue I did not see before.

I selected 4008 points worth and need 6441 points to level up to 5. However, it is saying 25.40% chance of success. Shouldn't it be 4008/6441 for 62.23% chance of success?

I don't level up unless I have 100% chance, so I am getting there but I never noticed the percentage being off like that before. What am I missing?

Attachment 1009054
This seems to be by design, although I still haven't seen a reason why the upgrade chance isn't increased linearly with invested points, and the ROI distribution changes per upgrade level. It needlessly obfuscates the process and, as you noticed, isn't explained in the game client. Gambling with points is incentivized for the 1st two levels of upgrade, but disincentivized thereafter (based on Iron cards.)

https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/...16&postcount=8
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Old 05-08-2024, 01:27 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by DotDash View Post
This seems to be by design, although I still haven't seen a reason why the upgrade chance isn't increased linearly with invested points, and the ROI distribution changes per upgrade level. It needlessly obfuscates the process and, as you noticed, isn't explained in the game client. Gambling with points is incentivized for the 1st two levels of upgrade, but disincentivized thereafter (based on Iron cards.)

https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/...16&postcount=8
Thank you for taking the time to address my question.

Well, when I have 6441 points as THEIR graphic says I need for 100% chance and it SAYS I have 100% chance then all will be good.

Edit to add: This must be a higher math thing (not my area). I was thinking in terms of percentage of points I had where the chance equation doesn’t match that but rather actual mathamatical chance of success. The math gods must find humor in this ;-)

Last edited by Socali; 05-08-2024 at 01:57 PM. Reason: Add comment
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Old 05-09-2024, 05:37 AM   #43
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Combinator Card Trading

Just a thought. How about being able to trade 10 combinators of the same level for any combinator of that level?
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Old 05-09-2024, 09:42 AM   #44
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Rob posted an excellent Sticky Thread yesterday:

Combinator Cards 101: A Primer on How Combinator Cards Work

Last edited by Socali; 05-09-2024 at 09:51 AM.
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Old 05-10-2024, 06:53 AM   #45
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Unless you can quick sell them, i think they are an absolute waste of time and space. My .02.
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Old 05-10-2024, 09:29 PM   #46
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Unless you can quick sell them, i think they are an absolute waste of time and space. My .02.
They are now essential for quick tournament teams. Again, though, you need the right ones. Since it's random distribution, most of the Combinators we get will not be worth boosting (they still won't be all that good) and will sit in the card shop collecting dust. I have one that's fourth in line for the minimum bid and will probably never sell. So much for the big hoopla when I pulled the bright red card!
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Old 05-11-2024, 09:48 AM   #47
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IMO, they are terrible for the future of the game except for deep pocket players.

If you can't afford to have the top ones on your tournament team, then your team is relegated to being nothing more than a steppingstone in the early rounds. The trend continues. The rich get richer while the rest of us are ground into the dirt of mediocrity at best.

Is this good for the game's growth? I doubt it because it only addresses the top 10% of players.

This game needs a sharp jolt for the rank-and-file player. If the little guy is even wanted anymore, that is. As evidence of the exodus, I present Exhibit "A": Two teams from each Diamond League get promoted to Perfect League this year instead of one. Somehow, I think that reflects a sharp decline in either interest or the ability to keep customers due to how they feel ignored at lower levels of the game.

Meanwhile, I am the poster boy for that insanity definition by my staying here playing the game every year expecting things to improve. Funny how competitive baseball in any form can cling to the cleats of us old guys. But I just got me one of those wire brush plates to knock the cling off my cleats. In the old days we used a bat but maybe this brush thing will work for me this year.
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Old 05-11-2024, 10:20 AM   #48
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IMO, they are terrible for the future of the game except for deep pocket players.

If you can't afford to have the top ones on your tournament team, then your team is relegated to being nothing more than a steppingstone in the early rounds. The trend continues. The rich get richer while the rest of us are ground into the dirt of mediocrity at best.

Is this good for the game's growth? I doubt it because it only addresses the top 10% of players.

This game needs a sharp jolt for the rank-and-file player. If the little guy is even wanted anymore, that is. As evidence of the exodus, I present Exhibit "A": Two teams from each Diamond League get promoted to Perfect League this year instead of one. Somehow, I think that reflects a sharp decline in either interest or the ability to keep customers due to how they feel ignored at lower levels of the game.

Meanwhile, I am the poster boy for that insanity definition by my staying here playing the game every year expecting things to improve. Funny how competitive baseball in any form can cling to the cleats of us old guys. But I just got me one of those wire brush plates to knock the cling off my cleats. In the old days we used a bat but maybe this brush thing will work for me this year.
as someone who had proposed the idea of 2 teams up from diamond to perfect, it's for a few reasons:

one: diamond was too top heavy and easy for the good teams. you could coast all week and get 110 wins without even looking at your team once if you had good players. diamond should be harder than that, and half as many diamond leagues should raise the quality of that

two: diamond playoffs felt REALLY bad. playoffs in general are a dice roll, but it felt especially bad if you had 110 wins, made a run, and then lost in game 7 of the playoffs with no benefit at all. this at least helps the playoffs feel a little less bad

three: going back to the first point again, a lot of players struggled on the gold and diamond roller coaster. making it harder to get to diamond will allow folks to be at the level they should be at without having the up and down stress of going somewhere that's too difficult for them.


it has nothing to do with any game playrate, it's a test to see how the psychology feels with fewer diamond leagues
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Old 05-11-2024, 11:47 AM   #49
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As others have realized at this point whales just get to dominate even more since the introduction of combinator cards. It makes it a necessity to have the deep pockets to buy what you want and spend like crazy to fully boost your whole lineup. Just looked at an iron tourney I was in and literally everyone in their starting lineup was fully boosted.

Sadly there is no point to even play anything other than PD tourneys anymore. They have further ruined the chances for the little guys to earn any packs.
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Old 05-11-2024, 02:30 PM   #50
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as someone who had proposed the idea of 2 teams up from diamond to perfect, it's for a few reasons:

one: diamond was too top heavy and easy for the good teams. you could coast all week and get 110 wins without even looking at your team once if you had good players. diamond should be harder than that, and half as many diamond leagues should raise the quality of that

two: diamond playoffs felt REALLY bad. playoffs in general are a dice roll, but it felt especially bad if you had 110 wins, made a run, and then lost in game 7 of the playoffs with no benefit at all. this at least helps the playoffs feel a little less bad

three: going back to the first point again, a lot of players struggled on the gold and diamond roller coaster. making it harder to get to diamond will allow folks to be at the level they should be at without having the up and down stress of going somewhere that's too difficult for them.


it has nothing to do with any game playrate, it's a test to see how the psychology feels with fewer diamond leagues
I think a better solution is
1) keep perfect league at 40 teams -- 16 stay 24 demote
2) a new level between perfect and diamond -- 4 leagues of 30 promote 4
3) 24 diamond leagues -- 4 promote

Works fine numbers-wise and makes all leagues challenging and always promotes 4 to eliminate the crapshoot feel of the playoff system. Reducing perfect league by 4 slots can't be good news for whales, (unless there are less than 36 whales!)
Current system just shifts the breezy league to gold which should be harder.
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Old 05-11-2024, 10:13 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by cwhitman View Post
as someone who had proposed the idea of 2 teams up from diamond to perfect, it's for a few reasons:

one: diamond was too top heavy and easy for the good teams. you could coast all week and get 110 wins without even looking at your team once if you had good players. diamond should be harder than that, and half as many diamond leagues should raise the quality of that

two: diamond playoffs felt REALLY bad. playoffs in general are a dice roll, but it felt especially bad if you had 110 wins, made a run, and then lost in game 7 of the playoffs with no benefit at all. this at least helps the playoffs feel a little less bad

three: going back to the first point again, a lot of players struggled on the gold and diamond roller coaster. making it harder to get to diamond will allow folks to be at the level they should be at without having the up and down stress of going somewhere that's too difficult for them.


it has nothing to do with any game playrate, it's a test to see how the psychology feels with fewer diamond leagues

Thanks for your opinion and that is all you offered. Whether you or anybody else proposed this change is irrelevant. I am not some 8-year-old to be impressed by your credentials or lack thereof.

One: Many people think that it is not so easy to get to Diamond as you make it out to be. And how many people do coast to 110 wins per year? Not very many, but then again, we can't all be so elite as to yawn on Monday and wake up for the playoffs on Sunday with those 110 wins. So, half as many leagues makes twice as many coasting to those 110-win seasons. So much for the rest of us peons having a chance each week.

Two: Is Diamond the only level where winning 110 games and not getting promoted feels like crap? I could have sworn that has happened to me many times in PT through the years at much lower levels and at Diamond. It felt like crap every time. Maybe we should cut every level in half so that we can all have that good feeling more often? We could leave the rest of the teams in Entry Level in perpetuity.

Three: People ride that roller coaster at every level when they are promoted.

Get used to the test that you speak of. PT membership peaked way before this season. There is realistically nowhere to go but down. The niche for baseball is small and most players came aboard early in the PT Universe. So, let's hurry and chase away customers like the soon to be 30-dollar hamburgers in California.
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Old 05-12-2024, 07:37 PM   #52
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Yeah the combinator crap is just crazy and made for those with deep pockets. It is no longer about strategy and skill, but who pays the most. I entered 9 bronze quicks yesterday, won one, and 6 I made to the semi's undefeated, only to lose two straight 5 times to teams with combinator galore....Thank you ootp for taking the the fun out of the game....
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Old 05-13-2024, 12:04 AM   #53
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The concept of combinators is decent, would love to see it work.

What I'd suggest is a limit of the number of combinator levels, say 26 elvels total.

So you spread your 26 levels either level 1 for every player, 5 players at level 5 and 1 at level 1 etc.

A game like this needs to try to add variance to the mix. While the meta seems to get batters with high power/eye and pitchers who combat that, I have seen other strategies also be successful (other teams, not mine, I'm not that good).

For the record, I don't bemoan those who want to pay to win, even thoguh I'm a free to play guy. if your entertainment budget is to $50 to $100 a week, and you choose to spend $50 a week on PP in OOTP, that's fine and your decision.

What the developers can do is try to get the balance right so BOTH types of player can compete against each-other - or at least the top tier of free-to-play isn't bashed out of it.

I'd love to see some stats on just how many of the 10,000+ PT teams (not players but teams) spend on PT, and how many spend more than $2,000 a year.

I would think with a relatively low player base compared to other games, a monthly access fee for ALL players, to then ALL be on the same footing could be attractive.

If we assume there's 10,000 teams, if everyone of those teams cost $10 a month, that's $1.2m revenue. Yes some players would drop off, but I reckon many who have become disenchanted with PT would come back as the playing field is leveled and the skill (and luck) aspect becomes more important.

You then adjust the PP payouts, greater rewards at higher levels - provide maybe 3 tiers of membership with different monthly inclusions, $10, $15, $20 a month.

If only 5% of the current teams are spending on PT (say 500 teams) - they'd need to spend around $2,400 a year on average per team to get to $1.2m revenue.
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Old 05-13-2024, 11:31 AM   #54
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If using players from the same team or year generates the most combinator points, then why is that not a filter option in the card shop?
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Old 05-17-2024, 06:37 AM   #55
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So far, out of about 22 iron CC pulls, only my very first was one that I would want to buy, the rest have mainly been wah wah waah. And I've only managed to buy two that anyone else was interested in.

Picking one card, I don't think a Bill Campbell combinator has been sold for at least 3 weeks. If I bid I just push the price up, and no doubt a copy will finally hit the market while I'm catching zzz's...

I've got 900k, but if there's nothing to spend it on (other than seriously OTT sell orders) and I can't get the cards I need, what's the point? Is there any prospect at all of cards becoming easier to acquire in 25, or are we stuck in a brutal dogfight for 40-rated cards for the duration?
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Old 05-17-2024, 08:32 AM   #56
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I've got 900k, but if there's nothing to spend it on
This should put out the fire in your pocket nicely:
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Old 05-17-2024, 08:36 AM   #57
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So far, out of about 22 iron CC pulls, only my very first was one that I would want to buy, the rest have mainly been wah wah waah. And I've only managed to buy two that anyone else was interested in.

Picking one card, I don't think a Bill Campbell combinator has been sold for at least 3 weeks. If I bid I just push the price up, and no doubt a copy will finally hit the market while I'm catching zzz's...

I've got 900k, but if there's nothing to spend it on (other than seriously OTT sell orders) and I can't get the cards I need, what's the point? Is there any prospect at all of cards becoming easier to acquire in 25, or are we stuck in a brutal dogfight for 40-rated cards for the duration?

Speaking with no knowledge here, but it seems likely any significant change to the Combinator process in V25 is (1) time consuming, (2) risky, and (3) detrimental to those who have jumped on the bandwagon with both feet. It seems logical they are currently working on the process but will give themselves the 10 months available until v26. It's also possible Combinators may end up like PT+ and become history.
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Old 05-17-2024, 08:43 AM   #58
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This should put out the fire in your pocket nicely:
Damned right, they'd be sure to empty the coffers! I already did that once, though, when I thought I wouldn't be able to play for a few weeks. Regretted it quite a bit within a few days.
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Old 05-17-2024, 09:14 AM   #59
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Speaking with no knowledge here, but it seems likely any significant change to the Combinator process in V25 is (1) time consuming, (2) risky, and (3) detrimental to those who have jumped on the bandwagon with both feet. It seems logical they are currently working on the process but will give themselves the 10 months available until v26. It's also possible Combinators may end up like PT+ and become history.
Absolutely, but there is a serious problem. Look at the iron PTCS standings for the first week of this month, then compare them to every other format. Notice a difference? I think combinators are here to stay, but I don't think they should be a legal way to break the game. Or maybe it's just me that has No Idea Yet.
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Old 05-20-2024, 11:11 AM   #60
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I can't bid on a combinator because I already have 10 copies of the vanilla card.

I figure that being able to distinguish between combinators and vanilla cards is key to the possibility of tournaments with combinator limits. But it will also be nice to avoid this annoying quirk.
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