Professor Luckymann's Lab 2.0

[Makonnen]

This is part of why pure math can't solve these things ... but avoiding that for the moment, some food for thought on Rogan: https://i9s.org/wp/?player=rogan-001bul

I think he may be a little OP, but the triple thing makes it hard to really tell. I do stand with Rogan being the closest thing in history to Ohtani, so it's really worth it to get him right. Even among NeL enthusiasts, I'm coming around to seeing Rogan as significantly underrated.

[luckymann]

Originally Posted by No Pepper

There is something terribly wrong with triples here and its not just your players.

Absolutely. I'm going to keep an eye on it in my Everyman League, which is now on 25 and uses curated LTMs. Will report back.

G

[luckymann]

Originally Posted by Makonnen

This is part of why pure math can't solve these things ... but avoiding that for the moment, some food for thought on Rogan: https://i9s.org/wp/?player=rogan-001bul

I think he may be a little OP, but the triple thing makes it hard to really tell. I do stand with Rogan being the closest thing in history to Ohtani, so it's really worth it to get him right. Even among NeL enthusiasts, I'm coming around to seeing Rogan as significantly underrated.

It's not just that.

Your projections and my input data aren't all that different with regard to K for Bullet. I have him at a career 4.4 K9, yours looks (you should really have career totals on your site, no?) similar. My peak is 5.2, yours is 6.2.

It is how the game treats this data that is key here. And my early experience with v25 is that it greatly underpowers pitchers in the editor. For mine, it has to be something to do with the change from 1-250 to 1-550. The projected stats, all of it just seems off.

Very interested to see how my IP adjustment affects all of this but first impressions are that this is a mess.

G

[Makonnen]

Yeah, career totals are, as they say, "on the list." It felt for a while like it was more important to get a volume of MLE's out there than to improve things on the site (totals, comparison tools, ultimately some way to export the data). But the pendulum may be swinging back ...

Rogan's career totals:

i9sRaw		Yrs	AB	H	2B	3B	HR	BB	SO	SB	CS	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS
rogan-001bul	23	9472	3089	592	205	217	1042	660	416	157	.326	.393	.501	.894

		Yrs	G	GS	IP	H	BB	SO	HR	H/9	BB/9	WHIP	K/9
		16	505	434	3403	3238	907	1601	125	8.6	2.5	1.22	4.2

[luckymann]

Originally Posted by Makonnen

Yeah, career totals are, as they say, "on the list." It felt for a while like it was more important to get a volume of MLE's out there than to improve things on the site (totals, comparison tools, ultimately some way to export the data). But the pendulum may be swinging back ...

Rogan's career totals:

i9sRaw		Yrs	AB	H	2B	3B	HR	BB	SO	SB	CS	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS
rogan-001bul	23	9472	3089	592	205	217	1042	660	416	157	.326	.393	.501	.894

		Yrs	G	GS	IP	H	BB	SO	HR	H/9	BB/9	WHIP	K/9
		16	505	434	3403	3238	907	1601	125	8.6	2.5	1.22	4.2

If you have v25, I'd love for you to go and create Bullet using that data and posting some screenshots of how he comes out.

This is what I got and I expect your input will result in something very similar:

[luckymann]

OK, so I have posted these issues as a bug and will be putting this exercise on hold until hopefully the issue is dealt with because as it stands it is utterly pointless to proceed in v25.

Check out the bug post HERE if you are interested and comment in either place if you feel so inclined.

Thanks

G

[congokurtz]

Originally Posted by luckymann

OK, so I have posted these issues as a bug and will be putting this exercise on hold until hopefully the issue is dealt with because as it stands it is utterly pointless to proceed in v25.

Check out the bug post HERE if you are interested and comment in either place if you feel so inclined.

Thanks

G

I'm sorry to hear and hope the issue gets resolved quickly. So I'm curious, when you edit players do you change the resulting stats and then click on create current ratings based on stats? That's what I assumed after reading your bug post. Also, didn't even realize until reading Luke's response on your bug post that there is a new feature in the editor displaying an expected current stats line. In Luke's response he says this, "If you look at the new lines in the editor for 25 that give expected output stats in the actual league the players are in, that will give a much better picture of what to expect, and you can then edit the players based on those values."

What stands out to me here is the "league the players are in." This would lead me to believe that if I'm looking at an NeL player in an NeL league the expected stats line would be in that league, but I'm not sure of this because when I look at an NeL player in an NeL league the expected current stats has MLB written next to it. And now I wonder that since the NeL is an affiliate of the MLB, that these expected stats line is for the MLB. But then Luke does mention in your bug post that you shouldn't look at the resulting stats line for editing since it will tell you nothing in a league with extreme values such as the NeL. So I'm confused and wonder what do these expected stats line reflect for NeL players, MLB or NeL?

[luckymann]

Originally Posted by congokurtz

I'm sorry to hear and hope the issue gets resolved quickly. So I'm curious, when you edit players do you change the resulting stats and then click on create current ratings based on stats? That's what I assumed after reading your bug post. Also, didn't even realize until reading Luke's response on your bug post that there is a new feature in the editor displaying an expected current stats line. In Luke's response he says this, "If you look at the new lines in the editor for 25 that give expected output stats in the actual league the players are in, that will give a much better picture of what to expect, and you can then edit the players based on those values."

What stands out to me here is the "league the players are in." This would lead me to believe that if I'm looking at an NeL player in an NeL league the expected stats line would be in that league, but I'm not sure of this because when I look at an NeL player in an NeL league the expected current stats has MLB written next to it. And now I wonder that since the NeL is an affiliate of the MLB, that these expected stats line is for the MLB. But then Luke does mention in your bug post that you shouldn't look at the resulting stats line for editing since it will tell you nothing in a league with extreme values such as the NeL. So I'm confused and wonder what do these expected stats line reflect for NeL players, MLB or NeL?

Yes, that's precisely how I do it.

That response completely baffled me but it seems it's all I'm going to get.

Why should there be any slippage between the stats you put in for a player in the year and environment you want them to work and these so called "expected" stats?

In other words, if I am entering in stats for 1924 MLB into a player in an MLB save in 1924, why should the engine change them at all?

Neither it nor the response makes any sense to me, which is itself more reflective of the wider pattern I am seeing with dev interaction. I'm not sure even they know how the game works any more, or should work. Either that or they are just being wilfully obtuse, because some of the feedback from them for 25 has bordered on the nonsensical. The "make bads" discussion is a case in point. As, I believe, is this one of mine.

Not much I can do other than pack this in until the issue is hopefully addressed. I'm certainly not wasting my time with things as they currently are, which render the editor basically useless.

I will bump that other thread again in a couple weeks to see if I can get a straight answer. EDIT - I just did so now.

G

[tm1681]

Originally Posted by No Pepper

There is something terribly wrong with triples here and its not just your players.

When I've run older leagues - fictional or real - and let the engine AutoCalculate all of the settings, for some reason triples frequently end up pretty much out of control.

I almost always manually tinker with the Triples factor.