Perspective...

[HRBaker]

It's not fun anymore visiting this forum for PT. The vast majority of visitors have disappeared, and those of us left usually have a gripe about something we feel isn't being taken seriously.

An unfair consequence of this is some members of the team take it on the chin, somewhat unfairly, because no one single person is totally responsible for decisions that are made.

I am well aware that Discord has taken over any serious discussions of the game, but to be honest, at 77 years old, I simply do not want to deal with the chaos I see in Discord - the lack of organization. I am not interested (or capable) of tracking 10 conversations at once, and prefer the thread-based discussions here on the forum. The problem is, no one is here any more to discuss things with, and I get the definite impression no one from OOTP/Com2US is willing (or allowed) to take part in those discussions.

It use to be that the OOTP folks and us would bounce ideas back and forth and those discussions would be read by the ones that decided what went into the game. Definately feels like that isn;t the plan anymore.

It's very possible this forum will become an artifact while Discord will be the platform you must take part in to see/hear/discuss anything important. That would be a shame because I do not think I'm the only customer that prefers the forums and wishes they were as active as they use to be.

That said, I fully understand that PT is an income stream, and must remain so if the folks we depend on are to continue getting their paychecks. What I don't understand is why those of us that have been with OOTP for 20 years that don't/can't appear to be ignored. Maybe because all we contribute to the piggy bank is $40 a year.

I know, it's my choice if I want to play PT or not, and I have 95% gone back to the basic game - but what I fear is a future decision to forget the base game (other than providing a platform to produce output) and spend all future resources on making $$ in PT. That would effectively mean version 24 is pretty much all we'll ever see as far as improvements to the base game.

Another possibility I fear is that the base game will cost "X" and you'll have to pay "Y" more to play PT. Even though, as a F2P player, I only play PT seriously for the baseball season, I would likely not pay the extra fee in that situation.

So, what's my point?

I do LOVE the OOTP base game, and want to see it improved. I have dreams of incorporating something like ChatGPT into it, adding a newspaper output to leagues or teams, and seeing improvements in graphics... BUT, I honestly believe we'll never see those things.

I also LOVE the PT "concept". I'd love to see a way one could "join" different levels of competition (Diamond, Gold, Silver) with limitations of what cards you could use to be in those groups. I'd love to see historical-based leagues... but again, those options don't bring in money, thus I fear serious consideration will never surface.

Overall, I fear for the future of the game. Markus & Company was ALWAYS for the customer. I simply don't see that anymore, and I feel it's only time before the game we all learned to love might not be anymore - or will be an exclusive playground for those that have hundreds or thousands to invest.

(sigh)

PS: I posted this in the PT thread because I believe PT is the root cause of this issue. Those of us that have fears about OOTP - the game, have those fears because of what PT has done to what "use to be". If I would have posted this in the base-game side of the group, I likely would have gotten less reaction.

[Kushiel]

Excellent post Mr. Baker! I concur completely.

[Bunktown Ballers]

Originally Posted by HRBaker

It's not fun anymore visiting this forum for PT. The vast majority of visitors have disappeared, and those of us left usually have a gripe about something we feel isn't being taken seriously.

An unfair consequence of this is some members of the team take it on the chin, somewhat unfairly, because no one single person is totally responsible for decisions that are made.

I am well aware that Discord has taken over any serious discussions of the game, but to be honest, at 77 years old, I simply do not want to deal with the chaos I see in Discord - the lack of organization. I am not interested (or capable) of tracking 10 conversations at once, and prefer the thread-based discussions here on the forum. The problem is, no one is here any more to discuss things with, and I get the definite impression no one from OOTP/Com2US is willing (or allowed) to take part in those discussions.

It use to be that the OOTP folks and us would bounce ideas back and forth and those discussions would be read by the ones that decided what went into the game. Definately feels like that isn;t the plan anymore.

It's very possible this forum will become an artifact while Discord will be the platform you must take part in to see/hear/discuss anything important. That would be a shame because I do not think I'm the only customer that prefers the forums and wishes they were as active as they use to be.

That said, I fully understand that PT is an income stream, and must remain so if the folks we depend on are to continue getting their paychecks. What I don't understand is why those of us that have been with OOTP for 20 years that don't/can't appear to be ignored. Maybe because all we contribute to the piggy bank is $40 a year.

I know, it's my choice if I want to play PT or not, and I have 95% gone back to the basic game - but what I fear is a future decision to forget the base game (other than providing a platform to produce output) and spend all future resources on making $$ in PT. That would effectively mean version 24 is pretty much all we'll ever see as far as improvements to the base game.

Another possibility I fear is that the base game will cost "X" and you'll have to pay "Y" more to play PT. Even though, as a F2P player, I only play PT seriously for the baseball season, I would likely not pay the extra fee in that situation.

So, what's my point?

I do LOVE the OOTP base game, and want to see it improved. I have dreams of incorporating something like ChatGPT into it, adding a newspaper output to leagues or teams, and seeing improvements in graphics... BUT, I honestly believe we'll never see those things.

I also LOVE the PT "concept". I'd love to see a way one could "join" different levels of competition (Diamond, Gold, Silver) with limitations of what cards you could use to be in those groups. I'd love to see historical-based leagues... but again, those options don't bring in money, thus I fear serious consideration will never surface.

Overall, I fear for the future of the game. Markus & Company was ALWAYS for the customer. I simply don't see that anymore, and I feel it's only time before the game we all learned to love might not be anymore - or will be an exclusive playground for those that have hundreds or thousands to invest.

(sigh)

PS: I posted this in the PT thread because I believe PT is the root cause of this issue. Those of us that have fears about OOTP - the game, have those fears because of what PT has done to what "use to be". If I would have posted this in the base-game side of the group, I likely would have gotten less reaction.

I have played EVERY Version of OOTP & this will probably be my last, no longer fun. I said this before a couple months ago and got basically mocked & booed out of the forum, the copied text from you is what I mean. I can't to spend enough money to reach PERFECT LEVEL and I won't. But I also stated there should be leagues of Perfect, Diamond, Gold, Silver, Bronze, etc where only card for that level and below could be in said league..Got mocked pretty badly...Here's Your Comment In Your Post


"I also LOVE the PT "concept". I'd love to see a way one could "join" different levels of competition (Diamond, Gold, Silver) with limitations of what cards you could use to be in those groups. I'd love to see historical-based leagues... but again, those options don't bring in money, thus I fear serious consideration will never surface."


I've made Diamond a few times but now I can't even compete in Gold anymore. And I'll probally not join PT next year if things don't change. I'm almost certain Com2US don't care about the CORE game as much as we do nor as much as the original OOTP used to

Thanks for you also posting that HR BAKER

Louisiana Rugarou
BunktownBallers

[Janks]

Well said.

To discord or not to discord, that is the question. - My answer is never.

[Matt Arnold]

Everyone is welcome to play what they like best. Our goal as a team is to make sure all parts of the game are interesting.

We are still always adding to the base game (and PT). If you look at the yearly feature list, and the various patch notes, you see that we do still devote a lot of effort to improving the base game year after year, and are in no way looking to abandon that or anything.

[LeeD]

Originally Posted by Matt Arnold

Everyone is welcome to play what they like best. Our goal as a team is to make sure all parts of the game are interesting.

We are still always adding to the base game (and PT). If you look at the yearly feature list, and the various patch notes, you see that we do still devote a lot of effort to improving the base game year after year, and are in no way looking to abandon that or anything.

This. Been playing base game since OOTP 19, and there have been many. many improvements, particularly in the opponent General Mangers and the ratings quality of old-time players. Appreciate all your work there, Matt.

[Edster007]

I have a team in PT this year and don't pay much if any attention to it. That's not an indictment on the game, its my preference. I am not interested as many are in grinding missions and collecting cards etc, not my thing, I just want to set lineups and watch games play out. I would be better suited for an online league but I haven't found one that suits me and don't have the kind of time to try and start one on my own. I also understand the pay to play aspect which I do not contribute to. You can't expect to pay the base price for the game and get all the PT has to offer without the hook of people buying points to pay salaries and sink money into future versions. I played as much PT as I did previously solely because of Our League and the community it provided. As I said it doesn't make PT bad.

With that said I have been a buyer since 16 and have enjoyed the base game and continue to purchase it each year and get full enjoyment out of it-along with every version of FHM.

I will say and it doesn't really apply to this thread that the support for Go could be stepped up. It is disheartening that I posted a problem 3 or 4 times beginning in May to no responses so I gave up and I am playing last years version.

[Ty Cobb]

I humbly disagree, Baker. I feel it's the Go crowd. The phone gaming crowd seems to possess a vast amount of self-important hectoring blowhards who consider themselves omniscient, when the reverse is often true. We've inherited the rabble who inhabited the intellectually cumbersome neighborhood of Tap Sports Baseball prior, and we're poorer for it.

[saltuskin]

Perfect team is only about whales period, a ftp or someone who only puts in about 100 dollars will now get much above gold if that, whales rule diamond and perfect league
and dont say oh u can compete as a ftp play yea if u want to spend 1000 hrs a month doing tournys and drafts and pouching the players house

as i have said before i am up to 648 packs now i have opened and have no usable 100 that i have opened on my team all i get is live cards and the useless bronze cards
the sim game is great and next year will be all i play so the game loses the little money i spend on pt and it 1000s of people do it and i see after 2 months no ftp hardly plays
my 3 friends i play with all have about quite cause they cant even get out of the gold league

just my 3 cents
so

[stanfordhawkjr]

Sounds like sour grapes. Don't like it, don't play. It's OOTP's biggest money maker. Perfect Team keeps the base game at $40. Might be free on PC one day if enough whales play Perfect Team.

[Bunktown Ballers]

Originally Posted by stanfordhawkjr

Sounds like sour grapes. Don't like it, don't play. It's OOTP's biggest money maker. Perfect Team keeps the base game at $40. Might be free on PC one day if enough whales play Perfect Team.

Good for y'all WHALES....It'' be shameful when not enough players find it interesting enough when it's only whales playing. And really only "ONE" Perfect league this year. I remember when there were as many Perfect Teams as any other league. Membership is WAYYYY down from previous years and will be getting worse. Book It DANO

[Ty Cobb]

Originally Posted by saltuskin

Perfect team is only about whales period, a ftp or someone who only puts in about 100 dollars will now get much above gold if that, whales rule diamond and perfect league
and dont say oh u can compete as a ftp play yea if u want to spend 1000 hrs a month doing tournys and drafts and pouching the players house

as i have said before i am up to 648 packs now i have opened and have no usable 100 that i have opened on my team all i get is live cards and the useless bronze cards
the sim game is great and next year will be all i play so the game loses the little money i spend on pt and it 1000s of people do it and i see after 2 months no ftp hardly plays
my 3 friends i play with all have about quite cause they cant even get out of the gold league

just my 3 cents
so

I'm routinely in Gold with an occasional foray into Diamond. I'm FTP, and tournaments are too much like work. True, I get slaughtered in Diamond when I go there. I remind myself that I got there through wits and determination. My uncle, a corporate lawyer for a PA utility, gave me the best advice ever on our situation..."There are two types of people in the world; people with money, and people with time. If you don't have the money, you better make the ******* time." Ask one of the whales about how hard it is and how much time they spend...they're not just buying better players. They're also working hard at it.

As for your 648 packs, that's not a valid statistical sample. There are probably millions of packs being opened when you count free/reward/paid.

Sorry to be so tactless, but the realities are simple, just like in MLB. Money usually wins, and there isn't much room on the top of the mountain.