Out of the Park Baseball---Has it come a long way or what?

[BaseballNewsNow]

Originally Posted by jpeters1734

I'd be more than happy if perfect team went away. Go play MLB the Show if you want that silly trading card game. Or join an actual online league if you want to play with friends

Or let the people who enjoy Perfect Team enjoy it.

As I see it, there's been no problem with Perfect Team so far. Franchise has not been neglected at all. There's just no reason to blindly go off at a mode that has done the game no harm. And it probably makes a ton more money that can go back into the game.

I understand that there's concern that if it makes enough money, the team will only focus on it. Which is valid, and we've seen it with other games such as Madden, NBA 2k, etc; however, I think that we've seen enough from Markus and the team from these 23 years to trust them enough to handle something like this appropriately.

Let Perfect Team be.

[jpeters1734]

Originally Posted by BaseballNewsNow

Or let the people who enjoy Perfect Team enjoy it.

As I see it, there's been no problem with Perfect Team so far. Franchise has not been neglected at all. There's just no reason to blindly go off at a mode that has done the game no harm. And it probably makes a ton more money that can go back into the game.

I understand that there's concern that if it makes enough money, the team will only focus on it. Which is valid, and we've seen it with other games such as Madden, NBA 2k, etc; however, I think that we've seen enough from Markus and the team from these 23 years to trust them enough to handle something like this appropriately.

Let Perfect Team be.

Don’t forget, Marcus and the team no longer control the company. You’re naive if you don’t think perfect team, or any other similar mode, does not affect the single player modes.

[jcard]

Originally Posted by jpeters1734

DonÂ’t forget, Marcus and the team no longer control the company. YouÂ’re naive if you donÂ’t think perfect team, or any other similar mode, does not affect the single player modes.

This is so obvious that to even debate it does nothing but legitimize the notion of controversy where none exists. The enduring omissions from the game are so obvious that their continued absence is impossible to square with a claim to commitment to realistic simulation. For example, consider player evaluation. It is 2022, 20 years after Moneyball, and there is no front-office analytics department model at all- projected statistics, process stats, etc. Honestly, can you imagine finishing that book two decades ago and even having an argument that tools such as these would be a sine qua non of a 2022 front office simulation?

I do not presume to tell you how to feel or act, but as someone who sympathizes with you I will share my perspective. Personally, I just accept the situation for what it is, and also remember that the company does not owe me the game that I would want. If they insist on promotion that asks you to deny the undeniable, I bear it as the nature of product marketing. If other players need to believe that OOTP is the one game that has managed to embrace a micro transaction element without the main game becoming the proverbial wagged dog, I know there is no benefit to wasting my time in quixotic efforts to puncture the dissonance. All that ultimately matters is that I know the score and it most likely will be the same tomorrow. Then, it is just a matter of whether knowing this I am content with continuing to pay for a ticket.

[BaseballNewsNow]

Originally Posted by jpeters1734

Don’t forget, Marcus and the team no longer control the company. You’re naive if you don’t think perfect team, or any other similar mode, does not affect the single player modes.

Again, I will warn you about this type of thinking. As I said previously, haven't Markus and the team earned your respect and trust throughout the past 23 years? I was initially critical of the Com2Us acquisition as well, but I think that we've seen enough to say that they haven't had any impact on the game.

I am personally very happy with how the series has progressed after the acquisition. I think that the core game has progressed a great deal. I was initially skeptical after hearing the OOTP 23 new features, but after sinking in hundreds of hours, I realized how dramatic the difference between 23 and 22 is in terms of the simulation engines. I'm having more fun than ever before playing OOTP 23. Hell, I even learned how to program to develop a tool for it to judge undervalued players.

Personally, I love the 3D improvements that the game has made since the Com2Us acquisition. There is a staggering difference between OOTP 21 visuals and OOTP 23 visuals. I get that playing out 3d games isn't for everyone, but the stadiums look crisp and clear, and the animations look fantastic. That's not to say that it's perfect, but the improvements have been staggering.

Whether or not that's a product of Com2Us is a legitimate question, but I think that it is. Not to praise them too much since I'm still a little but skeptical considering the other games that they've published, but I think that the partnership has been great. Everything that Markus has said since day one of the OOTP Com2Us partnership has remained true. You can go back and check. There's no reason to doubt Markus and the team, especially considering the upgrades to the game since Com2Us acquired OOTP, Markus's track record, and the fact that literally nothing we've seen so far from Com2Us with OOTP has been bad. Nothing.

When judging things like this, it's important to have a clean slate. When the deal first happened, I did not. But after considering everything that's happened for (almost) two years, I'd say that it's time to give Com2Us a fair chance.

[jpeters1734]

Originally Posted by BaseballNewsNow

Again, I will warn you about this type of thinking. As I said previously, haven't Markus and the team earned your respect and trust throughout the past 23 years? I was initially critical of the Com2Us acquisition as well, but I think that we've seen enough to say that they haven't had any impact on the game.

I am personally very happy with how the series has progressed after the acquisition. I think that the core game has progressed a great deal. I was initially skeptical after hearing the OOTP 23 new features, but after sinking in hundreds of hours, I realized how dramatic the difference between 23 and 22 is in terms of the simulation engines. I'm having more fun than ever before playing OOTP 23. Hell, I even learned how to program to develop a tool for it to judge undervalued players.

Personally, I love the 3D improvements that the game has made since the Com2Us acquisition. There is a staggering difference between OOTP 21 visuals and OOTP 23 visuals. I get that playing out 3d games isn't for everyone, but the stadiums look crisp and clear, and the animations look fantastic. That's not to say that it's perfect, but the improvements have been staggering.

Whether or not that's a product of Com2Us is a legitimate question, but I think that it is. Not to praise them too much since I'm still a little but skeptical considering the other games that they've published, but I think that the partnership has been great. Everything that Markus has said since day one of the OOTP Com2Us partnership has remained true. You can go back and check. There's no reason to doubt Markus and the team, especially considering the upgrades to the game since Com2Us acquired OOTP, Markus's track record, and the fact that literally nothing we've seen so far from Com2Us with OOTP has been bad. Nothing.

When judging things like this, it's important to have a clean slate. When the deal first happened, I did not. But after considering everything that's happened for (almost) two years, I'd say that it's time to give Com2Us a fair chance.

You misinterpreted my point. You tried to invoke trust based on a 23 year track record, but I’m just pointing out that that track record ended with the acquisition. I don’t say that as a negative, just that you shouldn’t put blind faith into the company just because they were fantastic before they sold.

[BaseballNewsNow]

Originally Posted by jpeters1734

You misinterpreted my point. You tried to invoke trust based on a 23 year track record, but I’m just pointing out that that track record ended with the acquisition. I don’t say that as a negative, just that you shouldn’t put blind faith into the company just because they were fantastic before they sold.

I think that you can, especially since the past 2 years with Com2Us have been pretty good. Nothing has happened with Com2Us to make us think that they're bad for OOTP--yet.

I don't like Com2Us as a company, but it seems as if they haven't had a huge impact on OOTP.

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by BaseballNewsNow

I think that you can, especially since the past 2 years with Com2Us have been pretty good. Nothing has happened with Com2Us to make us think that they're bad for OOTP--yet.

I don't like Com2Us as a company, but it seems as if they haven't had a huge impact on OOTP.

I've been around since 2002 and, with two or three versions now done under Com2Us, this is where I'm at on the whole trust OOTP Dev. and Markus. It appears Com2Us was\is smart enough to take the "easy" profits and not mess with success. I say this because nothing much has really changed in the progress of the game, the release cycle, the frequent patches, and all around support from Matt and Markus. It's all pretty much followed what Markus said when first announcing the sale. Until I see evidence of change I see no reason for my trust in Markus, Matt and co. to change.

I have no opinion on Com2Us as I'd never dealt with them before the OOTP purchase. They've done nothing since buying OOTP to make me have a negative opinion and I hope that continues.

For those that say one is naive to think PT has no affect on OOTP proper, fair enough. Just don't be so naive as to think PT has not had a positive affect on OOTP proper. Both games do things that benefit the other.

[fredbeene]

It is naive to think the profits from PT will go into development.
It my go into cigar chomping execs
I have no proof, but i highly doubt devs is a full time job on ootpb....probably a cross between different products.
That is why after 23 years I can't get all the stats like baseball ref.

It is not communicated what the vision is.
At least with Strat i know there is no vision and they will overcharge for a static a product : )

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by fredbeene

It is naive to think the profits from PT will go into development.
It my go into cigar chomping execs
I have no proof, but i highly doubt devs is a full time job on ootpb....probably a cross between different products.
That is why after 23 years I can't get all the stats like baseball ref.

It is not communicated what the vision is.
At least with Strat i know there is no vision and they will overcharge for a static a product : )

The answer for you? Don't support the product. If someone isn't delivering what you want isn't it time to move on?

[Ty Cobb]

You REALLY want to feel how far the game has come? Run VirtualBox with WinXP and load up the free version of OOTP 8, if you can still find it. Then...count how many times in the first 10 minutes of play you look for something that isn't there. Remember...no PT, no 3d, random debut, are gone right off the bat. For me, the game has come so far that Version 8 is unplayable because I'm so used to all the wonders of 23. Heck, look at GO, which has more features as a phone app than 8 did.

I do miss the atmosphere of the forums from those days though.

[Pelican]

Originally Posted by fredbeene

It is naive to think the profits from PT will go into development.
It my go into cigar chomping execs
I have no proof, but i highly doubt devs is a full time job on ootpb....probably a cross between different products.
That is why after 23 years I can't get all the stats like baseball ref.

It is not communicated what the vision is.
At least with Strat i know there is no vision and they will overcharge for a static a product : )

I don’t know a lot about the gaming world; but my impression is that any failure to invest heavily in development would leave a franchise hopelessly outdated and unprofitable. I suspect that, rather than starve OOTP, the acquisition injected funds and stability into a successful product - which is exactly what investors do, when not chomping cigars.

[atticeflone]

Very cool

[LessLikely]

Season Ticket Baseball was my first exposure. My little brother got it for Christmas when I was home from college. I watched him play it and was impressed with the customization and depth. I ripped a copy to take with me to school (sorry Markus! I was young). Saw 07 online a few years later, remembered good times, and have bought the game almost every year since.

[HRBaker]

Originally Posted by fredbeene

It is naive to think the profits from PT will go into development.

Don't follow this at all.

Profits pay the salaries of the OOTP developers. <<-- That sentence alone debunks you statement.

[LeiterFanatic]

I was happiest under 6.5. Perfect blend of fun and lite management. Now its like a real job. I also miss Inside the Park Baseball. Buying that special bat and getting laid at the bar

[OmahaBaseball]

Originally Posted by LeiterFanatic

I also miss Inside the Park Baseball. Buying that special bat and getting laid at the bar

In my mind, that game had such potential -- really is too bad that it didn't stay the course.

[texasmame]

Been on board since the 2007 edition.

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by fredbeene

I have no proof, but

Pretty good summation of most of the speculation on these boards.

[sdw1000]

My first version was 15. I needed something where I had every team, every season and not charge me an arm and a leg. Been here since. I have issues sometimes with the 3-D etc but for the most part, it's a good game.

[AESP_pres]

2007 was my first one... thanks to the demo included with the Eastside Hockey Manager CD. Fall in love with the game immediately and got almost all the different yearly releases since that day, I skip two or three releases... OOTP8 for sure (I think it was 2007 with a different number to follow the regular order) but I can't remember the others.

What I love is the historical part of the game and watch my Expos on the field again...