George is whining again!!!

kingfc22 · 11-11-2003, 06:19 PM

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=1659479

I'm tired of hearing this guy bitch and moan every time something goes wrong for his Yankees. Reminds me of a rich spoiled brat throwing a temper tantrum.

CMH · 11-11-2003, 06:24 PM

In my opinion, I think Matsui should be eligible. I have no problem with Japanese players winning the award.

Anyway, why did I expect Steinbrenner to cry after Matsui lost?

Gosh, I hate that guy.

ey215 · 11-11-2003, 06:24 PM

"Steinbrenner's statement did not address the fact that Berroa also was excluded from two of the 28 ballots."

That just about says it all.

CMH · 11-11-2003, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ey215
"Steinbrenner's statement did not address the fact that Berroa also was excluded from two of the 28 ballots."

That just about says it all.

Argh! I was just about to say how that comment was a great shot at Steinbrenner's intelligence.

Nice job ESPN.

beavers10 · 11-11-2003, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by kingfc22

I'm tired of hearing this guy bitch and moan every time something goes wrong for his Yankees. Reminds me of a rich spoiled brat throwing a temper tantrum.

yeah, me too.

tim_uwrf · 11-11-2003, 07:30 PM

I have to go write to MY PAPER!! and CONGRATULATE Jim Souhan for doing this. It is a great INJUSTICE if Matsui had won the Rookie of the Year. RESTRICTIONS must be put into place in the MLB. Something about not playing more than 3 or so years overseas, or not being older than 28, unless all of his previous years he had been in the minors, or not being older than 28 and having no professional experience of a certain amount. THANK YOU JIM SOUHAN!!!

tim_uwrf · 11-11-2003, 08:05 PM

i just emailed Mr. Souhan a thank you note

ronsantohof · 11-11-2003, 08:32 PM

George always whines. He was whining 22 years ago after the World Series loss when me and a friend met him in an elevator. We gave him a reason to whine then.

Draft Dodger · 11-11-2003, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ey215
"Steinbrenner's statement did not address the fact that Berroa also was excluded from two of the 28 ballots."

That just about says it all.

sorry, but, no it doesn't.

Steinbrenner is pissed that the writers are trying to manipulate the voting (something that they pull every year). The fact that two people did so for Berroa doesn't change the fact that it's too easy for a vindictive rogue writer to screw up these votes by leaving someone off.

Draft Dodger · 11-11-2003, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tim_uwrf
I have to go write to MY PAPER!! and CONGRATULATE Jim Souhan for doing this. It is a great INJUSTICE if Matsui had won the Rookie of the Year. RESTRICTIONS must be put into place in the MLB. Something about not playing more than 3 or so years overseas, or not being older than 28, unless all of his previous years he had been in the minors, or not being older than 28 and having no professional experience of a certain amount. THANK YOU JIM SOUHAN!!!

maybe your effort would have been better spent emailing MLB and ask them to CHANGE THE RULES (since you like them capital letters). Souhan had no business doing that; Matsui was elligible based on the rules - it's not Souhan's place to make that judgement.

IMO, he shouldn't be allowed to vote for these kinds of things ever again.

Skipaway · 11-11-2003, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Draft Dodger
sorry, but, no it doesn't.

Steinbrenner is pissed that the writers are trying to manipulate the voting . The fact that two people did so for Berroa doesn't change the fact that it's too easy for a vindictive rogue writer to screw up these votes by leaving someone off.

Isn't that a given when you let 28 guys vote for something like this? What happened here is actually very consistent with all the other award or hall of fame votings. There are always voters who vote for all the wrong reasons. Steinbrenner could have made a better case if he's complaining about the system instead of the writers that didn't vote for his player. He's not pissed that writers are manipulating the vote. He's pissed that it's not manipulated his way.

Draft Dodger · 11-11-2003, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Skipaway
Isn't that a given when you let 28 guys vote for something like this? What happened here is actually very consistent with all the other award or hall of fame votings. There are always voters who vote for all the wrong reasons. Steinbrenner could have made a better case if he's complaining about the system instead of the writers that didn't vote for his player. He's not pissed that writers are manipulating the vote. He's pissed that it's not manipulated his way.

"I firmly believe that a great injustice has been done to Hideki Matsui. Two misguided writers clearly made up their own rules to determine who was and was not eligible for the award and disqualified an eligible candidate who could have won."

certainly, the fact that it's his player is what's spurring this on. But what he's saying is correct - 2 writers were attempting to make up their own rules. And yes, it happens all the time (I stated that above). And, hopefully, every time it happens, someone will speak out just like George did here until this crap gets fixed.

Skipaway · 11-11-2003, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Draft Dodger

IMO, he shouldn't be allowed to vote for these kinds of things ever again.

I think it might be better to add more voters. People are always biased in some way, and it's hard to judge which ones we should get rid of sometimes. With more voters, it's easier to reduce the damage.

Draft Dodger · 11-11-2003, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Skipaway
I think it might be better to add more voters. People are always biased in some way, and it's hard to judge which ones we should get rid of sometimes. With more voters, it's easier to reduce the damage.

I agree

Skipaway · 11-11-2003, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Draft Dodger

certainly, the fact that it's his player is what's spurring this on. But what he's saying is correct - 2 writers were attempting to make up their own rules. And yes, it happens all the time (I stated that above). And, hopefully, every time it happens, someone will speak out just like George did here until this crap gets fixed.

Perhaps we should wait for quotes from those two writers to see if that's the real reason they left Matsui off the ballot. Nobody left Ichiro off the ballot in 2001, were the voters different then? Ichiro got 27 1st place votes, and one 2nd.

Picking three other rookies over Matsui is not that hard.

miami_fan · 11-11-2003, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tim_uwrf
I have to go write to MY PAPER!! and CONGRATULATE Jim Souhan for doing this. It is a great INJUSTICE if Matsui had won the Rookie of the Year. RESTRICTIONS must be put into place in the MLB. Something about not playing more than 3 or so years overseas, or not being older than 28, unless all of his previous years he had been in the minors, or not being older than 28 and having no professional experience of a certain amount. THANK YOU JIM SOUHAN!!!

Does anybody else see the irony in the fact the ROY award is named after Jackie Robinson who was 28 when he began his ROY campaign for the Dodgers in 1947 after playing in the Negro Leagues?

Draft Dodger · 11-11-2003, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Skipaway
Perhaps we should wait for quotes from those two writers to see if that's the real reason they left Matsui off the ballot. Nobody left Ichiro off the ballot in 2001, were the voters different then? Ichiro got 27 1st place votes, and one 2nd.

here you go:

Ballou: "I really do think he is not a rookie in the traditional and true sense of what a rookie is," Ballou said. "I think major league baseball has to look at redefining what a rookie is."

Souhan: "I just could not in good conscience pretend that Hideki Matsui, this great player from what I consider to be a major league, was on the same footing as a 22-year-old kid trying to learn to hit a major league curveball," Souhan said. "I think it would be an insult to the Japanese league to pretend that experience didn't count."

Draft Dodger · 11-11-2003, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by miami_fan
Does anybody else see the irony in the fact the ROY award is named after Jackie Robinson who was 28 when he began his ROY campaign for the Dodgers in 1947 after playing in the Negro Leagues?

George did:
"One of the writers in question, Mr. Ballou, actually said, 'while he [Matsui] is technically a rookie by the rules of Major League Baseball, he is not a rookie in the spirit of the award.' Spirit of the award? The award was renamed by the Baseball Writers' Association to honor Jackie Robinson, its first recipient. Jackie Robinson came to the Major Leagues after playing in the Negro Leagues, a league whose high level of play is unquestioned.

Hammer755 · 11-11-2003, 09:58 PM

I hate to acknowledge it, but I'm with George on this one. According to MLB, Matsui is eligible for the award, and MLB makes the rules, not these writers. To leave him off because of his performance would be totally acceptable IMO, but to do so because you feel he shouldn't be eligible is ridiculous and these 2 writers should have their voting privilages revoked.

The fact that Berroa was left off of 2 ballots is apples & oranges, since those snubs were based on performance in all likelihood.

I don't however, see the comparison to Jackie Robinson's circumstance. Robinson debuted so late because he was not allowed to participate by Major League Baseball. That is not the case with Matsui.

CardinalMan · 11-11-2003, 09:59 PM

do any of you think Matsui would have had this backlash if he wasn't playing for the Yankees? Kinda suspicous when one writer is from Worcester and the other is from Minnesota.

This is just another example of a system that is completely screwed up. Too much power in the hands of the writers and year after year they act like snotty know-it-all children.

11-11-2003, 06:19 PM	#1
kingfc22 All Star Reserve Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Fremont, CA Posts: 651	George is whining again!!! http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=1659479 I'm tired of hearing this guy bitch and moan every time something goes wrong for his Yankees. Reminds me of a rich spoiled brat throwing a temper tantrum. __________________ GO GIANTS GO NINERS GO LAKERS GO BLUE CUBL - Red Earth Firebirds 2000 CL Central Champs NABL - Washington Senators now Buffalo Bandits

11-11-2003, 06:24 PM	#3
ey215 All Star Reserve Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Woodstock, GA Posts: 581	"Steinbrenner's statement did not address the fact that Berroa also was excluded from two of the 28 ballots." That just about says it all. __________________ "It is a haunted game in which every player is measured against the ghosts of all who have gone before. Most of all, it is about time and timelessness, speed and grace, failure and loss, imperishable hope - and coming home." Ken Burns, Baseball

11-11-2003, 08:32 PM	#8
ronsantohof Minors (Double A) Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Dermot, KS Posts: 197	George always whines. He was whining 22 years ago after the World Series loss when me and a friend met him in an elevator. We gave him a reason to whine then. __________________ Guilt or innocence, that's not my job. It's my duty to pick up scum-sucking punks like yourself who are accused of a crime. A jury of twelve really stupid people who are easily swayed by rich, fat-cat, slimy lawyers, who'll do anything but tell the truth, will sit in judgment of you. It's as American as a burrito. Eschew obfuscation.

11-11-2003, 06:24 PM	#2
CMH Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5,057	In my opinion, I think Matsui should be eligible. I have no problem with Japanese players winning the award. Anyway, why did I expect Steinbrenner to cry after Matsui lost? Gosh, I hate that guy.

11-11-2003, 07:30 PM	#6
tim_uwrf Hall Of Famer Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Field of Dreams Posts: 1,998	I have to go write to MY PAPER!! and CONGRATULATE Jim Souhan for doing this. It is a great INJUSTICE if Matsui had won the Rookie of the Year. RESTRICTIONS must be put into place in the MLB. Something about not playing more than 3 or so years overseas, or not being older than 28, unless all of his previous years he had been in the minors, or not being older than 28 and having no professional experience of a certain amount. THANK YOU JIM SOUHAN!!!

11-11-2003, 08:05 PM	#7
tim_uwrf Hall Of Famer Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Field of Dreams Posts: 1,998	i just emailed Mr. Souhan a thank you note

11-11-2003, 09:58 PM	#19
Hammer755 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 2,348	I hate to acknowledge it, but I'm with George on this one. According to MLB, Matsui is eligible for the award, and MLB makes the rules, not these writers. To leave him off because of his performance would be totally acceptable IMO, but to do so because you feel he shouldn't be eligible is ridiculous and these 2 writers should have their voting privilages revoked. The fact that Berroa was left off of 2 ballots is apples & oranges, since those snubs were based on performance in all likelihood. I don't however, see the comparison to Jackie Robinson's circumstance. Robinson debuted so late because he was not allowed to participate by Major League Baseball. That is not the case with Matsui.

11-11-2003, 09:59 PM	#20
CardinalMan Minors (Double A) Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 190	do any of you think Matsui would have had this backlash if he wasn't playing for the Yankees? Kinda suspicous when one writer is from Worcester and the other is from Minnesota. This is just another example of a system that is completely screwed up. Too much power in the hands of the writers and year after year they act like snotty know-it-all children.