Manager Teach Ratings

[nuwildcat]

Do the manager teach ratings (i.e. teach baserunning, teach infield, etc.) make a difference or is it only the coach who fills that corresponding staff role that matter? For example, if my manager is Legendary at teaching baserunning does that help improve the players skills or is it the first base coach responsible for baserunning that affects development?

[eas9898]

For reasons unknown, the devs are silent on how much of the coach/manager ratings work. Many people have asked on these forums for further information, but have only received silence.

[Crickett13]

we don't even know who the pitching coach and hitting coach have a positive developmental influence on.

[brotherblues]

Originally Posted by eas9898

For reasons unknown, the devs are silent on how much of the coach/manager ratings work. Many people have asked on these forums for further information, but have only received silence.

I figure that a lot of the coding things in this game need a bit of mystery about them. Sort of to emulate that element of the unknown that is prevalent in reality.

[ezpkns34]

What I value most in managers, in order:
- Team Relationship ratings
- Teach Running
- Mechanics
- Handle Aging (unless you have a young team, in which case Development)
- Teaching Hitting & Pitching


Not to say that that's the correct order to prioritize though

[fredbeene]

at what ages of players do coaches help? is the cut off 30 years old?
how does POTENTIAL and coaches ratings work together?
Can coach help guy over 30 out of hitting slump?

[Crickett13]

Originally Posted by brotherblues

I figure that a lot of the coding things in this game need a bit of mystery about them. Sort of to emulate that element of the unknown that is prevalent in reality.

A little mystery is fine. Seeing that your hitting coach is liked by your closer but not knowing if his preference for teaching patience is helping your CF, you know like you have with the other versions, is just bad programing.

[brotherblues]

Originally Posted by Crickett13

A little mystery is fine. Seeing that your hitting coach is liked by your closer but not knowing if his preference for teaching patience is helping your CF, you know like you have with the other versions, is just bad programing.

Aha. I think (just spitballing here) looking at your players' statistical performance and also at what your scout says (ratings changes) gives you insight on wether the coach is affecting things.

[Crickett13]

Originally Posted by brotherblues

Aha. I think (just spitballing here) looking at your players' statistical performance and also at what your scout says (ratings changes) gives you insight on wether the coach is affecting things.

Alternatively they could put the functionality to see whose development they are affecting back into the game since they never meant to remove it.and before you say "How do you know what they intended?" It is pretty simple. If that was the case they would have replied to the numerous threads about it with a simple "We removed that"

[fredbeene]

Originally Posted by crickett13

alternatively they could put the functionality to see whose development they are affecting back into the game since they never meant to remove it.and before you say "how do you know what they intended?" it is pretty simple. If that was the case they would have replied to the numerous threads about it with a simple "we removed that"

thank you!!!!!

[One Post Wonder]

I bought OOTP 22 specifically because they finally upgraded the coaching and you could (apparently) see whether a coach was any good or not. There is no other reason why I wanted to upgrade. Nothing else interested me. So reading this thread does not make me happy.

That was my one major gripe with the old versions, that you had to enter the editor to see how good a coach was. Drove me crazy that a game in which player development is so important would not give you this information. And the funny part is, until around OOTP 14 the coaching was not opaque and it wasn't a problem. They just seemingly intentionally broke it one day and never explained why.

I mean, why Markus? Seriously, are any devs reading this? Why? Why can't the game just tell me how good my f**king coaches are or at the very least what the various attributes do? Do you see any other management games doing this? No, you don't.

What kind of sense does it make for you to spend all this effort coding in 1b and 3b coaches and a bunch of stats like 'influence mechanics' while giving your playerbase no idea of how those things work? How was that an effective use of your time and budget?

Even the base coaches aren't really explained. Unless I've missed it the manual says nothing about base coaches at all apart from how they relate to 'staff chemistry'. I mean, come on.

This is the first time I've actively felt ripped off by an OOTP purchase, Baseball Mogul false promises style. I haven't always liked the direction the franchise has taken especially with PT but the game has always come through with its main feature upgrades in the past. I have to get it in my head that this is not the company I remember from 10 years ago.

[TheBrewCrew]

I think it’s just really tough to keep it realistic but also have this coaching tree.

Like did the brewers know Craig Counsell was going to be as good as he is? Doubt it. Padres hired Jace tingler hoping it worked out and luckily it has. You can take educated guesses in interviews but I think that’s tough to get right in any sports game.

I do think Football Manager has the best coaching tree/system and would love to see ootp get as in depth as that one day, I just think it’s probably really tough.

[Pdubya64]

Originally Posted by One Post Wonder

This is the first time I've actively felt ripped off by an OOTP purchase, Baseball Mogul false promises style. I haven't always liked the direction the franchise has taken especially with PT but the game has always come through with its main feature upgrades in the past. I have to get it in my head that this is not the company I remember from 10 years ago.

OPW:
My hunch is that Markus and Co. felt that "drawing back the curtain" on OOTP's use of human aspects in the game was a no-win situation.

If they define everything and how it is used by the game, it enables people to "Min-Max" the coaching system in a way that is quite unrealistic (IMO). I also imagine revealing the inner workings would have a negative domino effect on other aspects of the game.

Thus, I believe the team made a tough decision and decided to conceal certain aspects of just how coaches and players interact. Sort of like the old saying "Better to deal with the devil you know than the devil you don't know." That and the law of unintended consequences.

To close I will say this: OOTP is a very complex simulation of Baseball. It is one of the reasons I gave and continue to give Markus the benefit of doubt on matters concerning the game's engine.

I may not like all the decisions he has made over the years, but I believe we have to trust his gut instincts on such decisions.

[Bulldog Johnny Blatnik]

Originally Posted by One Post Wonder

I bought OOTP 22 specifically because they finally upgraded the coaching and you could (apparently) see whether a coach was any good or not. There is no other reason why I wanted to upgrade. Nothing else interested me. So reading this thread does not make me happy.

That was my one major gripe with the old versions, that you had to enter the editor to see how good a coach was. Drove me crazy that a game in which player development is so important would not give you this information. And the funny part is, until around OOTP 14 the coaching was not opaque and it wasn't a problem. They just seemingly intentionally broke it one day and never explained why.

I mean, why Markus? Seriously, are any devs reading this? Why? Why can't the game just tell me how good my f**king coaches are or at the very least what the various attributes do? Do you see any other management games doing this? No, you don't.

What kind of sense does it make for you to spend all this effort coding in 1b and 3b coaches and a bunch of stats like 'influence mechanics' while giving your playerbase no idea of how those things work? How was that an effective use of your time and budget?

Even the base coaches aren't really explained. Unless I've missed it the manual says nothing about base coaches at all apart from how they relate to 'staff chemistry'. I mean, come on.

This is the first time I've actively felt ripped off by an OOTP purchase, Baseball Mogul false promises style. I haven't always liked the direction the franchise has taken especially with PT but the game has always come through with its main feature upgrades in the past. I have to get it in my head that this is not the company I remember from 10 years ago.

One Post Wonder, I think most people agree with you, at least to some degree. I too wish there was a better way to "rate" Manager's & Coaches. Sadly some times when I don't feel like dealing with it I just edit the Coaches to match the philosophy I want for my team. I'm more concerned about Staff Cohesion than individual ratings as long as my Coaches are Average or above. Reputation means nothing to me.

I do like the ability for Coaches to improve, I wish we could track it better like we can see for players. Unless I'm missing it which is entirely possible.

I created a Ratings key to show what each Rating means number-wise, such as Good means the Pitching Coach has a Teach Pitching rating between 120 and 139. The same Key is used for both Managers, Pitching, and Hitting Coaches.

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by TheBrewCrew

I think it’s just really tough to keep it realistic but also have this coaching tree.

Like did the brewers know Craig Counsell was going to be as good as he is? Doubt it. Padres hired Jace tingler hoping it worked out and luckily it has. You can take educated guesses in interviews but I think that’s tough to get right in any sports game.

I do think Football Manager has the best coaching tree/system and would love to see ootp get as in depth as that one day, I just think it’s probably really tough.

Originally Posted by Pdubya64

OPW:
My hunch is that Markus and Co. felt that "drawing back the curtain" on OOTP's use of human aspects in the game was a no-win situation.

If they define everything and how it is used by the game, it enables people to "Min-Max" the coaching system in a way that is quite unrealistic (IMO). I also imagine revealing the inner workings would have a negative domino effect on other aspects of the game.

Thus, I believe the team made a tough decision and decided to conceal certain aspects of just how coaches and players interact. Sort of like the old saying "Better to deal with the devil you know than the devil you don't know." That and the law of unintended consequences.

To close I will say this: OOTP is a very complex simulation of Baseball. It is one of the reasons I gave and continue to give Markus the benefit of doubt on matters concerning the game's engine.

I may not like all the decisions he has made over the years, but I believe we have to trust his gut instincts on such decisions.

Yes and yes.

IRL did the Cubs finally win a world series because of Joe Maddon or in spite of Joe Maddon? Just think if we had RL Joe Maddon's ratings we'd know for sure.

[Crickett13]

Originally Posted by Pdubya64

OPW:
My hunch is that Markus and Co. felt that "drawing back the curtain" on OOTP's use of human aspects in the game was a no-win situation.

If they define everything and how it is used by the game, it enables people to "Min-Max" the coaching system in a way that is quite unrealistic (IMO). I also imagine revealing the inner workings would have a negative domino effect on other aspects of the game.

Thus, I believe the team made a tough decision and decided to conceal certain aspects of just how coaches and players interact. Sort of like the old saying "Better to deal with the devil you know than the devil you don't know." That and the law of unintended consequences.

To close I will say this: OOTP is a very complex simulation of Baseball. It is one of the reasons I gave and continue to give Markus the benefit of doubt on matters concerning the game's engine.

I may not like all the decisions he has made over the years, but I believe we have to trust his gut instincts on such decisions.

I don't think letting us see whose being affected positively by my hitting coach having a preference to teach contact is drawing back the curtain. Especially since it exists in 21.

[ezpkns34]

Originally Posted by Crickett13

I don't think letting us see whose being affected positively by my hitting coach having a preference to teach contact is drawing back the curtain. Especially since it exists in 21.

I'm not sure the "hitter types" are even still a thing (or if so, they were made Completely hidden for some odd reason while the "pitcher types" were still left easily seen in profiles)

[Crickett13]

Originally Posted by ezpkns34

I'm not sure the "hitter types" are even still a thing (or if so, they were made Completely hidden for some odd reason while the "pitcher types" were still left easily seen in profiles)

That is kind of the problem in a nutshell. They made changes and nobody, including perhaps them, seem to know what those changes affect.

They added teach mechanics without ever saying what it is. It could easily have a slight modifier on every aspect of development or help stop regression or help with fewer injuries or all of those things or none of them. We just don't know and it seems it has become almost a battle of wills between the developers who continue to refuse to comment and the paying customers who would like to know what they paid for (Yes I repurchased 22)

Honestly I think you now have more information on how good the coaches are than ever before but now you have no idea if focus for pitching coaches or hitting coaches still matters or what teach mechanics does. Many of the other changes are obvious but those are not and it makes 0 sense for them to continue to refuse to comment